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Also for all the people talking about housing the homeless this is interesting..
"Officials said the people in the Arroyo were "service resistant" and turned down shelter beds and other aid. Rebecca Prine, director of the nonprofit Recycled Resources for the Homeless, said the Arroyo homeless people want housing in their own neighborhood — not on skid row or in South Los Angeles."
Wow..
This is typical of many homeless, they frequently turn down shelter beds for a number of reasons. Including bed bugs, theft and assault from other residents, no place to store personal belongings, requirement to vacate early in the AM, then wait in line at night not knowing if you will get a bed or not.
And then there is this, from your link: Prine said she and others, mostly volunteers, computer-matched about 150 homeless people in northeast Los Angeles to housing, including many who were pushed out of the Arroyo. But without staff, a car and other resources to help people obtain identification, get on welfare or Social Security and meet other prerequisites, the housing is on hold
It's a complicated issue but I don't see anything here worth a 'wow'
Just today , I avoided going to a store because there was a very crazy hostile homeless lady that was yelling and being aggressive outside the store she was rambling in spanish and yelling "****! ****!" ..I don't know much spanish but I know that word..
Looked like she had her "belongings" outside on the street. It looked like she was going towards someone to attack them so I just avoided going to the store all together.
Do any of you homeless advocates think these type of people should really be on the street?
This is really not that uncommon of a situation to see. I felt like almost calling the police, but I'm sure nothing would come of it.
Because the homeless are a basically a protected class here.
If a normal productive tax paying citizen acted like I'm sure it would be a different story...
but because it's a 'homeless person" , it's a *Shrugh* ..."what would you like us to do ? The poor person is homeless.."
I've been to neighborhood council meetings where people bring up issues to the police about the homeless causing problems urinating etc and that's basically their response..
In Downtown LA after doing some job interviews years ago (I spent three fall/winter seasons in Los Angeles) I went to a burger place to get some food. A homeless man was looking at me and I knew he wanted to rob me. I gave him a hostile look, paid for my food and sat down. As the waitress was going to give bring me my food he stole it from her. She called the cops. It turned out he had robbed several other businesses, but they caught him. They replaced my food.
The dorm-style housing that the homeless are so adverse to is only problematic because the homeless make it that way. They get their things stolen, by other homeless people. They get assaulted, by other homeless people. They get raped, by other homeless people. The problem is not what society isn't doing for the homeless, it's what the homeless are doing to themselves. I know a lot of them are mentally ill and a lot more are addicts, but you cannot help people who do not want help. Provide housing for the ones that want it, with the contingency that they seek employment or perform community service, but stop turning a blind eye to the ones who are dangerous or problematic for tax-paying citizens. I pay a lot in property taxes so I expect to get some protections for my property. Homeless people using my property as a toilet is unacceptable. Homeless people using my property as their personal camping ground is unacceptable.
I have a lot of sympathy but I have even more common sense.
The dorm-style housing that the homeless are so adverse to is only problematic because the homeless make it that way. They get their things stolen, by other homeless people. They get assaulted, by other homeless people. They get raped, by other homeless people. The problem is not what society isn't doing for the homeless, it's what the homeless are doing to themselves. I know a lot of them are mentally ill and a lot more are addicts, but you cannot help people who do not want help. Provide housing for the ones that want it, with the contingency that they seek employment or perform community service, but stop turning a blind eye to the ones who are dangerous or problematic for tax-paying citizens. I pay a lot in property taxes so I expect to get some protections for my property. Homeless people using my property as a toilet is unacceptable. Homeless people using my property as their personal camping ground is unacceptable.
I have a lot of sympathy but I have even more common sense.
Homeless is a term that puts together lots of people who are homeless for different reasons. An old person who is homeless because of poverty in old age is not beating or robbing themselves. A homeless person who is younger and homeless for a different reason is doing that. Women homeless aren't doing the raping, it is a subset of male homeless (not the majority).
Some people need help with addiction or mental illness. Others are simply too old or sick to work again.
And even the suggestions you make would require more tax money (enforcement of laws). Yes people should be JAILED for using your yard as a toilet but hard to do that when California gives them insufficient alternatives.
With that said homeless people tend to do a lot better when they get permanent, stable housing and treatment for their issues.
It might work that way in other places but not around here. SSI will get you on a housing waiting list -- and some of the waiting lists are decades old.
I read a story about a homeless woman somewhere around here -- she used her SSI check to stay in a motel two weeks a month. Then the other two weeks she was out on the street.
Which is why I said California underfunds low income housing. Housing shortage is no excuse, they have plenty of space to build new housing.
If not I can't say this thread and recent press on this issue is good advertising for the city of Los Angeles.
They are enabling her to continue this routine. She has a car to drive somewhere else, but she knows she has it decent there so she stays there like a stray cat. A single lady in a car - how dangerous is that, just let her be, blah blah blah.
The more I read this thread, the more I realize how much more deeply entrenched the homeless situation is in LA, and something radical has to happen before any significant changes are made.
She obviously has enough money to afford rent for 1/3 of the month. What she needs is help paying the other 2/3 of the rent.
She may have other reasons for not leaving since she has a car. She may have roots in the area.
Homeless is a term that puts together lots of people who are homeless for different reasons. An old person who is homeless because of poverty in old age is not beating or robbing themselves. A homeless person who is younger and homeless for a different reason is doing that. Women homeless aren't doing the raping, it is a subset of male homeless (not the majority).
Some people need help with addiction or mental illness. Others are simply too old or sick to work again.
And even the suggestions you make would require more tax money (enforcement of laws). Yes people should be JAILED for using your yard as a toilet but hard to do that when California gives them insufficient alternatives.
With that said homeless people tend to do a lot better when they get permanent, stable housing and treatment for their issues.
When they create shelters for people from similar situations (victims of domestic violence, the elderly, etc.), it seems the shelters are more acceptable to the homeless.
This is typical of many homeless, they frequently turn down shelter beds for a number of reasons. Including bed bugs, theft and assault from other residents, no place to store personal belongings, requirement to vacate early in the AM, then wait in line at night not knowing if you will get a bed or not.
And then there is this, from your link: Prine said she and others, mostly volunteers, computer-matched about 150 homeless people in northeast Los Angeles to housing, including many who were pushed out of the Arroyo. But without staff, a car and other resources to help people obtain identification, get on welfare or Social Security and meet other prerequisites, the housing is on hold
It's a complicated issue but I don't see anything here worth a 'wow'
Yep. Thats the shelter "culture" I was talkin about alright. Really sucks.
The dorm-style housing that the homeless are so adverse to is only problematic because the homeless make it that way. They get their things stolen, by other homeless people. They get assaulted, by other homeless people. They get raped, by other homeless people. The problem is not what society isn't doing for the homeless, it's what the homeless are doing to themselves. I know a lot of them are mentally ill and a lot more are addicts, but you cannot help people who do not want help. Provide housing for the ones that want it, with the contingency that they seek employment or perform community service, but stop turning a blind eye to the ones who are dangerous or problematic for tax-paying citizens. I pay a lot in property taxes so I expect to get some protections for my property. Homeless people using my property as a toilet is unacceptable. Homeless people using my property as their personal camping ground is unacceptable.
I have a lot of sympathy but I have even more common sense.
The problem here is that your statement here depends on the premise that "Homeless" as a single monolithic entity.
Would you find it reasonable to talk about the crime that White People or Black People do to themselves? How about when one corporate department (say Microsoft or Intel) is responsible for layoffs across the entirety of the organization yet preserving their own? When one enlisted man or woman has an affair, would you complain to others about how ALL military people steal each others' spouses and even use that to justify a debate on something? That is the general idea of how your argument above was structured.
Sure there is a common thread between the homeless people in that they happen to be homeless. But criminals will be criminals no matter what place in society they end up. It's usually just a matter of whether or not they have the resources on hand to hide their antisocial behavior.
Consider also that by being homeless, many people are in a position where they have nothing to lose by ignoring social rules that they draw no benefit from. In a way, it's a very free market explainable approach. You want them to behave well which benefits you, but what's in it for them?
About the homeless people that refuse shelter, wouldn't it be natural for some people to grip more tightly to the things that they are used to, even if there are better things in the world (that are both unfamiliar and out of reach anyway)? It sounds like a shelter is uncomfortable in its way, in the same sense that some people would prefer burning fuel in stop-and-go traffic in the comfort of their own car, rather than share space with other commuters on a bus.
Last edited by DriveNotCommute; 07-12-2015 at 03:12 PM..
Reason: minor wording for clarity
The dorm-style housing that the homeless are so adverse to is only problematic because the homeless make it that way. They get their things stolen, by other homeless people. They get assaulted, by other homeless people. They get raped, by other homeless people. The problem is not what society isn't doing for the homeless, it's what the homeless are doing to themselves. I know a lot of them are mentally ill and a lot more are addicts, but you cannot help people who do not want help. Provide housing for the ones that want it, with the contingency that they seek employment or perform community service, but stop turning a blind eye to the ones who are dangerous or problematic for tax-paying citizens. I pay a lot in property taxes so I expect to get some protections for my property. Homeless people using my property as a toilet is unacceptable. Homeless people using my property as their personal camping ground is unacceptable.
I have a lot of sympathy but I have even more common sense.
Geezus you talk like "the homeless" are this big homogeneous group who can control what other homeless people do.
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