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I was born and raised in LA and went to college in NorCal. I went to Ohio State for grad school (go Bucks!) and just came back about a month ago to start my new career (healthcare). Here's the thing: now that I'm back home, which I was dying to do while in Ohio, I feel like my perspective on LA has permanently shifted. The high cost of living, the extreme traffic, and the realization that it's almost 100% likely that I will never be able to afford a house here are making me seriously consider moving out of state. In Columbus I saw how life was so much easier - you can actually buy a home in your 20s, traffic really isn't too bad even during rush hour (compared to LA traffic), and you don't feel like you have to fight strenuously all the time to get what you want/get **** done. Even though I don't want to live in Cbus for a number of reasons, I have a soft spot for it because it showed me a different way of life that I came to really appreciate.
LA will always be home. There really is no place like it. And in spite of the many good parts of Cbus, living there also made me realize that I took many things about LA for granted. Nevertheless, Cbus spoiled me too. I got a much higher QOL there, and I'm having a hard time re-adjusting to the high COL here. I am considering moving to another state in the West Coast where I can get more bang for my buck. I do know that it's not going to be THAT much cheaper, but even a little bit helps. I was thinking of cities in Oregon and Washington in particular. I'm not keen on Arizona (too hot).
I'd like to know if any Angelenos have dealt with this issue or are currently dealing with it. What are you planning on doing?
Well I can certainly relate to your post. I graduated from OSU (Go Bucks) years ago and came out to L.A. to escape the snow. I had no graduate degree nor a solid career in mind like you have. I went from job to job and made my own way (no family in L.A.). Eventually things came together. I bought a home, found a career and everything turned out just fine. I know things are more expensive now, but the pay is a lot better today too. I thought about moving back to Columbus over the years, I really liked it there, even sent my son back to school there. But there's just something about cruising along PCH or driving through the canyons that I could never get over. You have the advantage of having grown up here, I think I'd give it a chance if I were you. But Good Luck either way.
[quote=chessgeek;45212748]There are exceptions to "Kansas" type places in the middle of the country, though. The OP could check out three places, one in the Upper Midwest and two in California.
The Minneapolis-St. Paul area, where i grew up, would be one of those with more affordability for the OP than LA or the Bay Area and it has beautiful parks and trails on lakes and rivers. Great free concerts on summer evenings at the Lake Harriett bandshell. It is a step up from Columbus in the pro sports area too with all of the four major team sports, plus pro soccer will be there next year. It also has very good museums, food/restaurants, and entertainment (including Tony Award winning Guthrie theater; famous First Avenue nightclub and much more). The OP will be surprised at how high the pay is there, too. As an added bonus, the OP could see his/her Buckeyes football team play the Gophers every other year. On the downside, the area has very cold winters.
The OP may also want to check out Sacramento, which is more affordable than LA or the Bay Area, as was recommended earlier. They don't get the cold winters and could easily get to the Bay Area for all the pro sports and additional attractions if desired. Sacramento does have an NBA team and the minor league Rivercats baseball team. Think there is enough good food and entertainment there to satisfy most people. Summers will be hotter, but the delta breeze on occasional late afternoons/early evenings means it would certainly be far better than Phoenix and Las Vegas for climate. The Sacramento and American Rivers are also there for recreation. The trail along the American River stretches from Sacramento to suburban Folsom. The beautiful Lake Tahoe region is not too far away either. Commute traffic can be slow, but won't be as bad as LA or the Bay Area.
Santa Rosa, a nice city slightly more than an hour north of San Francisco, may be worth a look too. Don't know if home prices there have increased significantly or not. It is famous for the Charles Schultz museum (was home to the famed cartoonist in the last 25 years of his life). It is close to both the coast and wine country, too.
In Sacramento or Santa Rosa the OP could also visit some of his/her old Nor Cal college friends, assuming they have stayed in the area.[/QUOTE-]
Let's stop right there, Minneapolis? No thank you, 30 below zero. How often can you enjoy those parks? Sorry, that is very extreme weather.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mysticaltyger
The problem with California is it turns you into a weather wimp. Then you can't handle hot/cold/wind/snow. That, along with the natural human tendency for inertia, makes you willing to pay through the nose for crappy housing.
Not really. Have you ever been to Florida or the south. Where you can sit outside at night, not move a muscle and sweat? Or the Midwest in the winter. I went to Chicago one time in March for work, I found out why it was called the "Windy City", good God it cut right through you, and this was late March.
Not liking crappy weather doesn't make you a wimp. It's a preference.
As I said earlier, we get one go round in life. If some choose to live in a less expensive area so they can have a bigger area, but hate the area, the weather, the topography, the way of life, but do it to have a McMansion...good for them, hope they're happy.
There's more to life than a huge house you don't really need.
Location: "Silicon Valley" (part of San Francisco Bay Area, California, USA)
4,375 posts, read 4,070,027 times
Reputation: 2158
Quote:
Originally Posted by mysticaltyger
Without realizing it, you just made a case for moving somewhere cheaper. Very few people want to be sharing a 1BR apartment with their dad in their late 30s.
Well, if you make more money, you don't have to. Most people around here make more than $14/hr. The median salary is 100k here. If you make that, you don't have to share your apartment with anyone. You can afford it by yourself. I could move out right now. But then I couldn't help with his rent (I can pay $500, but I can't do it twice a month, one for me and one for him). So I might as well stay, for now.
Quote:
$14 an hour in a place like Ohio is almost middle class for a single person.
lmao. No, dude, it's not. Middle class -- the median income -- in most of the rest of the country is about 50k. That's at least $26/hr, more like $30 to get 50k after taxes.
Quote:
Even those on the higher end of the pay scale have to make sacrifices in terms of housing that they just wouldn't have to do in other places.
Yeah, but you see, when you want to live in the Bay Area -- as opposed to moving here for a job offer and planning on moving back to a flyover state after a few years -- you don't care how big your living space is. You care WHERE it is. You'll take as small of a living space as you must in order to be able to afford living here. Same with other desirable areas such as Los Angeles, New York or Paris.
If you live in a flyover state, you need a big house because there's nothing to do outside of your house, except for enjoying nature.
If you live in a City, there are lots of things to do. You don't need a pool or spa at your house because you have the YMCA, public pools etc. You don't need to play basketball in your big driveway because there are parks and other shared facilities to do that. Nor do you need a big yard to play soccer because there are shared places for that. You don't need a huge room to play laser tag because there are laser tag arenas you can attend. And so on.
In a City, your dwelling is where you sleep and maybe do some home office stuff or watch TV/movies. Everything else is done at shared facilities. So if you are just yourself or maybe yourself and a spouse, you only need one bedroom. If you have a kid, two bedrooms.
Point being that these are not really sacrifices. It is just that the mentality and expectations for people living in a City are different from people living in flyover states.
I am taking my mid six figure income to Colorado and buying my first house at 48 years old. I'll be able to pay it off by retirement age, 62. Here, I would be house poor and working till I'm 75; no thanks. IMO, it takes $200k a year to really have a nice stress free life in Los Angeles; probably closer to $225k honestly. The alternatives are to rent here forever in a desirable area and receive no tax breaks or move to an extreme Northern part of Los Angeles County and to the far East short of Riverside to chase a respectable mortgage. Bad air, too hot, and long commute times are your reality if choose to go far North or East; no thanks, getting out and couldn't be more excited about it!
LOL....200K a year to have a stress free life in LA? Maybe if you have a family of five and your wife doesn't work, perhaps.
It's you, you live over your head. Plain and simple.
I find with comment like yours it's people who have huge debt, maybe a divorce, child support, etc. Poor financial choices on their part, but easier to blame LA.
No reason a 48 year old who has been making six figures couldn't buy in LA. No reason at all other than you have a lot of debt.
Seen comment like yours before, one was a guy down in Long Beach. The more he posted the truth came out, both him and his wife had student loan payments, two car notes, but it's all due to the high COL in Southern CA....nothing they did.
People like you end up moving and getting a five bedroom house you don't need in lower COL state and aren't any further ahead.
Location: Live:Downtown Phoenix, AZ/Work:Greater Los Angeles, CA
27,606 posts, read 14,604,784 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neutrino78x
Well, if you make more money, you don't have to. Most people around here make more than $14/hr. The median salary is 100k here. If you make that, you don't have to share your apartment with anyone. You can afford it by yourself. I could move out right now. But then I couldn't help with his rent (I can pay $500, but I can't do it twice a month, one for me and one for him). So I might as well stay, for now.
lmao. No, dude, it's not. Middle class -- the median income -- in most of the rest of the country is about 50k. That's at least $26/hr, more like $30 to get 50k after taxes.
Yeah, but you see, when you want to live in the Bay Area -- as opposed to moving here for a job offer and planning on moving back to a flyover state after a few years -- you don't care how big your living space is. You care WHERE it is. You'll take as small of a living space as you must in order to be able to afford living here. Same with other desirable areas such as Los Angeles, New York or Paris.
If you live in a flyover state, you need a big house because there's nothing to do outside of your house, except for enjoying nature.
If you live in a City, there are lots of things to do. You don't need a pool or spa at your house because you have the YMCA, public pools etc. You don't need to play basketball in your big driveway because there are parks and other shared facilities to do that. Nor do you need a big yard to play soccer because there are shared places for that. You don't need a huge room to play laser tag because there are laser tag arenas you can attend. And so on.
In a City, your dwelling is where you sleep and maybe do some home office stuff or watch TV/movies. Everything else is done at shared facilities. So if you are just yourself or maybe yourself and a spouse, you only need one bedroom. If you have a kid, two bedrooms.
Point being that these are not really sacrifices. It is just that the mentality and expectations for people living in a City are different from people living in flyover states.
Actually wanted to correct you on something, 50% of wage earners in the US make $13/hr or less, which works out to $27k/year. $50k/yr is median HOUSEHOLD income, most households have two earners. I fortunately make $52k/yr on my own, because my fiance only works part time while in college, so I'm the breadwinner pretty much in our household for now
Location: "Silicon Valley" (part of San Francisco Bay Area, California, USA)
4,375 posts, read 4,070,027 times
Reputation: 2158
Quote:
Originally Posted by FirebirdCamaro1220
Actually wanted to correct you on something, 50% of wage earners in the US make $13/hr or less, which works out to $27k/year. $50k/yr is median HOUSEHOLD income, most households have two earners. I fortunately make $52k/yr on my own, because my fiance only works part time while in college, so I'm the breadwinner pretty much in our household for now
Well, it could mean that people are waiting until they make 52k to buy a house, or it could mean that two people make the income together. Of course, there is a separate figure, "per capita median income", which tells us what individuals make.
In any case, the point was that in the lower cost of living areas, $14/hr is still not going to be enough to purchase a single family home, lol. My income is low right now, regardless of where in the country I lived. And if I moved to Kansas and did the same job -- working in a warehouse, verifying medical device serial numbers and moving boxes around -- I would be paid less than $14/hr because the minimum wage is lower! lol. The federal minimum wage is $7.50, so in a flyover state I would probably be making more like $10/hr. The minimum wage here in San Jose is $10.50.
The median income in Silicon Valley specifically is about 100k. Per capita is 40k.
LOL....200K a year to have a stress free life in LA? Maybe if you have a family of five and your wife doesn't work, perhaps.
It's you, you live over your head. Plain and simple.
I find with comment like yours it's people who have huge debt, maybe a divorce, child support, etc. Poor financial choices on their part, but easier to blame LA.
No reason a 48 year old who has been making six figures couldn't buy in LA. No reason at all other than you have a lot of debt.
Seen comment like yours before, one was a guy down in Long Beach. The more he posted the truth came out, both him and his wife had student loan payments, two car notes, but it's all due to the high COL in Southern CA....nothing they did.
People like you end up moving and getting a five bedroom house you don't need in lower COL state and aren't any further ahead.
LOL, not even close; nice try. I've been happily married to my FIRST wife for seven years and have only one child, minimal debt and I have 100k for a down payment but don't want to borrow more than 300k. I don't need or want a big house, just a 3-4 bed 2 bath house with a decent yard thtat's at least 2000 square feet; that's all. That's minimum 600k( Not looking for a fixer either) in a decent area with above average schools where my kid doesn't have to learn Spanish as a second language, get it?
I can afford here, but choose not too. It's hard for me to justify a $2800+ mortgage for a small box just because it's L.A. I'll get my 2000 sq. ft. home 15 min. from Boulder for half the price and put the extra 40k I'll have from the lower down to good use thank you.
I'm from the valley and have lived in NV, Hawaii, and San Diego. I love LA. I think it's a great city despite all the problems. As much as I enjoy San Diego, LA is my home and if I could easily get my same job there, I would go back. I truly think LA has a place for everyone. Sure it's expensive (San Diego is almost reaching LA prices though), but my life has always been best there (and SD though). LA to me just has so much going on and no excuses if you are bored (NYC though IMO has LA beat but I would never live there).
To the OP, the COL here is what it is for a reason. Alot of people would like to move here but the prices keep them away. I feel bad when my friends from the eastern part of the country come visit because they never wanna go home. It depends on your personal situation, if having property is Ultra-important to you, than yeah, maybe you need to not be here unless you are extremely comfortable living HOOD, on block where the lowest common denominator rules. A cheaper life in Columbus, yes, but for a reason.
What's fascinating though is that Millennials in Columbus have a higher median income than their counterparts in LA. Millennials in Columbus make $37,020 a year, and their counterparts in LA make $35,027 a year. How so many are able to get by on so little with LA's cost of living is beyond me.
What's fascinating though is that Millennials in Columbus have a higher median income than their counterparts in LA. Millennials in Columbus make $37,020 a year, and their counterparts in LA make $35,027 a year. How so many are able to get by on so little with LA's cost of living is beyond me.
I would guess the ones in LA have roommates, live with family, and/or get financial help.
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