Downtown Los Angeles, Christmas Day 2017 (apartments, income, tax)

[LuvSouthOC]

There is no Federal fix to this problem. That is where so many fail to understand the U.S. Constitution. There is likewise no duty on the part of the Federal Government to solve this problem. Instead, it involves the use of police power, a state-reserved power. Cities like Los Angeles get their police power from their charters via the Californian Constitution. These bums sleeping on public property (or private property) are breaking the law, and states, California included, have the power to handle it.

If you want to provide housing to so-called homeless people to help treat their addictions, you can send your money to organisations dedicated to providing such services; I will not as I explain below. As for the mentally ill, yes, I agree in principle we should pay to house them. However, once admitted to such a facility, I believe that departing from institutions should not be that easy. As that is not possible under the current legal framework, I will not willingly pay for mental institutions.

Naturally attractive weather and absurd altruism has dramatically increased this problem and I personally refuse to participate in misplaced altruism in any way. Allowing people to live like animals due to permissive homeless policies on the part of law enforcement and then facilitating homelessness by all manner of organizations providing food and other services near the homeless encampments, are the reasons why the homeless don't move on.

[Exitus Acta Probat]

Originally Posted by majoun

It has been a long time since I've seen the LAPD give out tickets. Sure it wasn't the SMPD over there?

I'm absolutely certain. It was an LAPD black & white staking out an intersection a mile east of SM. They also do the same thing in Brentwood occasionally.

[DabOnEm]

I see LAPD in their bicycles all the time near my job in Koreatown. They like to hide in the driveway to this new apartment/condo building and get people for going straight on a street that's a right turn only. They peddle in front of the driver on their bikes (close calls too!) and write tickets. I've seen them have a couple of people at once and they're out there on at least a weekly basis.

[Exitus Acta Probat]

Originally Posted by DabOnEm

I see LAPD in their bicycles all the time near my job in Koreatown. They like to hide in the driveway to this new apartment/condo building and get people for going straight on a street that's a right turn only. They peddle in front of the driver on their bikes (close calls too!) and write tickets. I've seen them have a couple of people at once and they're out there on at least a weekly basis.

Isn't that lovely? They're Johnny-on-the-spot when it comes to generating revenue for the city, but when it comes to doing a job a great number of us really want done because it highly impacts our safety, they refuse to do it.

[jm1982]

Originally Posted by Exitus Acta Probat

Isn't that lovely? They're Johnny-on-the-spot when it comes to generating revenue for the city, but when it comes to doing a job a great number of us really want done because it highly impacts our safety, they refuse to do it.

Get the poor tax paying sap leaving his apartment he pays half his income for while on the way to his miserable job .

It's a shame because they could actually do something regarding the problem homeless yet they don't because of orders from Beck and Garcetti .

[JohnG72]

Originally Posted by RosieSD

That still wouldn't solve the issues of homeless people who are mentally ill, or who have drug/alcohol addictions, but a work-relief program might be a start for some if done on a Federal level.

It won't, because this is literally all the homeless.

In Los Angeles, provided you are capable of showing up on time, there are a number of low level jobs you can literally get hired for the next day. Subway, Security Officer, etc. Many pay more(though not much more) than minimum wage.

I would do anything I could to avoid being homeless, including taking jobs that are beneath me.

I say this because ANYONE with a rational mindset would do the same. Most would be smart enough to move to an area of the country where these low level jobs pay MORE than in LA and actually will provide a true lower middle class lifestyle.

Point being nearly every homeless person in LA is an addict, suffers from mental illness, or both. Poofing jobs up from a federal program will not do ANYTHING to lower the homeless population.

[RosieSD]

Originally Posted by LuvSouthOC

Allowing people to live like animals due to permissive homeless policies on the part of law enforcement and then facilitating homelessness by all manner of organizations providing food and other services near the homeless encampments, are the reasons why the homeless don't move on.

So, what are the specific solutions you're proposing?

I hear what you're saying about encouraging the homeless to "move on" but what happens to the next neighborhood or the next city or the next state that they move to? Should the homeless be arrested and put in put in jail or internment camps? If so, who should pay for that?

Let's brainstorm. We all hate the homeless crisis -- so how do we actually take steps to fix the problem?

I think we have a lot of smart people here. Let's see what we can come up with.

[RosieSD]

Originally Posted by JohnG72

I would do anything I could to avoid being homeless, including taking jobs that are beneath me.

I say this because ANYONE with a rational mindset would do the same. Most would be smart enough to move to an area of the country where these low level jobs pay MORE than in LA and actually will provide a true lower middle class lifestyle.

I agree. There is a street corner not to far from where I live that is a good example of what you are saying. There is an older gentleman who stands on one side of the street day after day spinning a sign for a local business. He has to be in his late 60s. But he shows up every day for his job spinning the sign.

Meanwhile, more often than not, when I drive by, on the other corner there will be a young, healthy looking person in their 20s or 30s holding a sign asking for donations because they are "homeless."

It really galls me every time I see this juxtaposition. Like you, I would do anything I could to avoid being homeless, including spinning signs on a corner in my late 60s (not that long from now for me).

At the same time, I'm not completely convinced that ALL homeless people are mentally ill or drug addicted. Certainly a large percentage of them are, but there are still families with children and other people who do not fall into that category. So, for those people who WANT to work, perhaps a program like the Civil Conservation Corps would help them get back on their feet.

That still leaves the mentally ill, drug addicted, and just plain lazy, which as I said, I agree with you probably comprise a sizable portion of the homeless.

Let's take each group and brainstorm some specific actions that can be taken (whether city, county, state, etc.) for each group of homeless to do more than move them along to someone else's neighborhood/city/state but actually get the problem solved.

How do we get the mentally ill homeless off of the streets? (I recognize that some are mentally ill because they are drug addled obviously)

How do we get the drug addicted off of the streets?

How do we get the plain old lazy off the streets?

I'm interested in hearing your suggestions, and those of anyone else who wants to discuss ideas.

[RosieSD]

Originally Posted by jm1982

Get the poor tax paying sap leaving his apartment he pays half his income for while on the way to his miserable job .

It's a shame because they could actually do something regarding the problem homeless yet they don't because of orders from Beck and Garcetti .

So, what needs to change? I don't want to put words in your mouth but clearly you feel in LA the problem is the fault of Beck and Garcetti.

How do you Los Angelenos get rid of them and get someone in their places who will do a better job? Do you have a specific person or people in mind to replace them? Why would that person be the right choice?

And, more importantly, what concrete steps could everyone who agrees with you about Beck and Garcetti take in the next six months to make that happen in the real world (besides posting on CD, I mean).

[tickyul]

Most of the people on the streets do not want to be involuntarily-committed. Various court-rulings make the bar VERY HIGH for anything more than very brief involuntary-commitment.