The Los Angeles Homeless Containment Thread (Vista, Marina: town center, scenery, 2015)

[Tulemutt]

Originally Posted by njbiodude

https://original.newsbreak.com/@davi...-are-snowbirds

Not entirely. In many northern cities less than 5% of homeless aren’t from the state they live. The fact that over 3x than that come from out of state in places like LA is pretty telling.

What’s more prevalent though is homeless in warmer climates often don’t bother going to shelters. In NYC most homeless go to shelters in the winter. In Hawaii or CA many fewer do.

Take note of the first word in the title of your link: “Opinion.”

Says it all. It’s a poorly written, vacuous, *opinion* piece. The author doesn’t back up a single thing he writes.

That said, since I have repeatedly cited that approximately 12% of homeless are not local, what’s your point? Of course there are some small numbers who are migratory. That’s been established throughout the conversation here.

The myth being challenged, however, is that large numbers of California’s homeless come here for the good weather. That myth has been debunked a headspinning number of times for you and Dustin.

By the way, for the 1 millionth time: the 12% that are not local to LA County are not all from out of state as you persist in claiming.

Keep trolling the issue though.

[Tulemutt]

Originally Posted by njbiodude

…
What’s more prevalent though is homeless in warmer climates often don’t bother going to shelters. In NYC most homeless go to shelters in the winter. In Hawaii or CA many fewer do.

Yes. And? What’s that got to do with your campaign about homeless migrating to California for the weather?

[Tulemutt]

Originally Posted by Dub D

I can't tell if you're being serious...most homeless are homeless because they can't afford rent?

Obviously.

Yet the poster I responded to there claimed that lack of affordable housing is not the reason so many are homeless. It’s an absurd claim.

[dustin183]

What I don't understand is that humans have lived for thousands of years prior to the typical stick frame houses we have today. And prior to the existence of mortgages.

Humans used things in their environment to build shelter. Sticks, reeds, clay, leather, hay, stones, etc etc.

It's the requirement that a house has to meet modern standards that makes it expensive.

Why not have cheaper building methods like in the olden days. Have a big plot of land where the zoning and codes allow for this. Some of these old style methods creates homes that can last for many years.

You still need a well and a cess pit. But if the pilgrims could do it I don't see why we can't today. Every society had their methods of dealing with water and waste. Of course it would have to be done properly for good sanitation. There would have to be rules adhered to.

Let's be honest, it's just not gonna happen where every homeless person gets a modern apartment. Especially in California because the cost to build is too high. It would end up costing $600k give or take per person.

There are cheaper building methods, which provide more sturdiness and weather proofing than a tent.
Is it perfect? No, but we need practical solutions.

[CA4Now]

Originally Posted by Tulemutt

Take note of the first word in the title of your link: “Opinion.”

Says it all. It’s a poorly written, vacuous, *opinion* piece. The author doesn’t back up a single thing he writes.

And a blogger from Santa Barbara to boot, quoting an article from 20 years ago about Santa Barbara snowbirds.

He ends his article with the same conclusion that many seem to believe about weather and homelessness, "You might think Florida has the most homeless people per capita in the U.S. given its temperate climate. It actually ranks 15th, according to Orlando Business Journal. New York is first, followed by Hawaii, California, Oregon, and Washington State.

[CA4Now]

Originally Posted by dustin183

It's the requirement that a house has to meet modern standards that makes it expensive.

Let's be honest, it's just not gonna happen where every homeless person gets a modern apartment. Especially in California because the cost to build is too high.

It's also due to the cost of land in southern California.

And then there are ongoing issues like this.

"For the second time in five months, a federal judge Thursday refused to approve a proposed settlement agreement between Los Angeles County and a coalition of businesses and residents claiming government response to the area's homelessness crisis has been historically lax.

The judge rejected the county's promise to commit an additional $850.5 million to fund beds, services, outreach efforts and interim housing. That money would be on top of $293 million the county had previously committed in hopes of providing 6,700 new beds.

But US District Judge David Carter again balked at the number of beds that would be created by the agreement and said greater accountability and oversight was needed."

https://www.cbsnews.com/losangeles/n...sness-lawsuit/

[dustin183]

Originally Posted by CA4Now

It's also due to the cost of land in southern California.

And then there are ongoing issues like this.

"For the second time in five months, a federal judge Thursday refused to approve a proposed settlement agreement between Los Angeles County and a coalition of businesses and residents claiming government response to the area's homelessness crisis has been historically lax.

The judge rejected the county's promise to commit an additional $850.5 million to fund beds, services, outreach efforts and interim housing. That money would be on top of $293 million the county had previously committed in hopes of providing 6,700 new beds.

But US District Judge David Carter again balked at the number of beds that would be created by the agreement and said greater accountability and oversight was needed."

https://www.cbsnews.com/losangeles/n...sness-lawsuit/

Let's look at any place in the US not just SoCal. In general it's expensive to build a house by modern methods. Even in a place like Alabama or Ohio it would still cost at least say $200/sf. You have to dig a foundation and install plumbing and elec and HVAC and build the structure and etc etc.



There are much cheaper methods as our ancestors have done, in every corner of the globe, since the beginning. We can modernize those a bit with better waste and water. Maybe have a cluster (say 10-20) of mini adobe homes or something that all tie into a shared solar panel/battery setup for electricity. Stuff like that. Part of the problem is that modern homes usually need a sizeable lot of say 3k sf or more. You could shrink that way down with tiny homes.

Anywho, I know there is a better paradigm that can work to lower the cost way down, even in SoCal. You can go outside the dense parts of the city to where the land is cheaper.



There is a "tiny home movement" these days but even those are too expensive imo. They are basically regular modern homes just shrunk down.



I'm talking about building the way our ancestors did whether its with adobe/clay or log cabin etc. Depending on the low cost materials available.

[Tulemutt]

Originally Posted by dustin183

Let's look at any place in the US not just SoCal. In general it's expensive to build a house by modern methods. Even in a place like Alabama or Ohio it would still cost at least say $200/sf. You have to dig a foundation and install plumbing and elec and HVAC and build the structure and etc etc.



There are much cheaper methods as our ancestors have done, in every corner of the globe, since the beginning. We can modernize those a bit with better waste and water. Maybe have a cluster (say 10-20) of mini adobe homes or something that all tie into a shared solar panel/battery setup for electricity. Stuff like that. Part of the problem is that modern homes usually need a sizeable lot of say 3k sf or more. You could shrink that way down with tiny homes.

Anywho, I know there is a better paradigm that can work to lower the cost way down, even in SoCal. You can go outside the dense parts of the city to where the land is cheaper.



There is a "tiny home movement" these days but even those are too expensive imo. They are basically regular modern homes just shrunk down.



I'm talking about building the way our ancestors did whether its with adobe/clay or log cabin etc. Depending on the low cost materials available.

House [building forum]

https://www.city-data.com/forum/house/

You’re waaay off topic here.

[dustin183]

Originally Posted by Tulemutt

House [building forum]

https://www.city-data.com/forum/house/

You’re waaay off topic here.

What I'm saying is that in LA county (which is a big county) there is cheap land and we need a new housing paradigm to provide adequate housing. Why not live like the Native Americans who lived here for centuries? How much would those houses cost to build?

[CA4Now]

When Jose de la Torre began delivering pizzas for Papa Johns in 2019, he made $15 an hour and shared a one-bedroom apartment in the Florence-Graham neighborhood with half a dozen other people.

After two years on the job, his hourly rate was the same but his work schedule had been cut — to about 30 hours a week instead of the full 40, he said. Meanwhile, his everyday living expenses had gone up. He began sleeping in his Nissan Altima, parking it near the Papa Johns in Lynwood where he worked.

“I made the choice,” De la Torre, 53, said. “It was either my car and eat, or rent.”

De la Torre’s situation is not uncommon among current and recent fast-food workers, who make up 11% of all homeless workers in California and 9% in Los Angeles County, according to a report released Tuesday (5/2/23) by Economic Roundtable. The nonprofit research organization estimated that there are 10,120 fast-food workers in California who are homeless.

https://www.latimes.com/business/sto...t-food-workers