Confederate flag raises eyebrows in Palos Verdes Estates (Los Angeles, Beverly Hills: neighborhoods, high school)

[Silver_Surfer]

Originally Posted by sean1the1

Right!!! It's amazing that we have this argument that everyone knows what the real reason for the argument is, but some can't man up about it. Sad to say the least or weak I should say.

I think it's safe to say people move to Los Angeles/The West Coast to get away from people who believe flying that flag is okay.

[jm1982]

Originally Posted by Silver_Surfer

I think it's safe to say people move to Los Angeles/The West Coast to get away from people who believe flying that flag is okay.

Some people are actually native to this land and didn’t move here .

[Hiruko]

People should learn to mind their own damn business. There are much more important things to worry about than whatever flag some old man wants to fly at HIS house.

[green_mariner]

Originally Posted by Hiruko

People should learn to mind their own damn business. There are much more important things to worry about than whatever flag some old man wants to fly at HIS house.

It tells me what kind of person lives there, and that is something I worry about.

[Hiruko]

Originally Posted by green_mariner

It tells me what kind of person lives there, and that is something I worry about.

I've talked about Confederate heritage issues with you before. You seem to have a bizarre obsession with this issue across many different subforums. If you invested as much energy into something productive as you do into condemning people who display the flag, you could actually make some positive change.

[ryanst530]

Originally Posted by green_mariner

It tells me what kind of person lives there, and that is something I worry about.

What are you so worried about?

[Jowel]

Originally Posted by Silver_Surfer

Please stop lumping all journalism into "the media". Actual journalists shouldn't be placed in the same all-encompassing group as Breitbart and others.

I do see and agree with that distinction. Some of the sources, such as Breitbart, tell outright lies about various issues. The issue with the quality of journalism among the traditional broadcast and print media outlets is that while they may be telling some factual information, it is often only half of the truth and not the whole truth. It all depends on the quality and biases of the source and the individual reporter though. And someone not close to the situation who takes it as gospel truth may be missing a lot of nuance that make up the part of the truth not told.

Originally Posted by green_mariner

I live in the South as well. I get to see the issue of the Confederate flag up close. I have been living in Georgia since the mid 1990s. For a time the southern cross version of the Confederate flag was part of Georgia's state flag. When I learned about the Civil War and the Confederacy over the years, it was enough to be against the Confederacy. It was enough for me to have a disdain for the Confederate flag.

I live in what you would call the "Deep South". I am about 45 minutes west of Atlanta. I've seen Confederate flags flying where I currently live. I've lived in other places, but due to some odd events, I'm back, living in the county where I went to middle school and high school. What I saw alot of during high school were alot of kids wearing Dixie Outfitter t-shirts, Confederate flag and all. This really disturbed me. I kept thinking "You know the CSA seceded because they wanted slavery". And some of the kids were otherwise nice, polite people who weren't calling me the "N" word (I dealt with alot of racism in high school, alot of it perpetuated by those who had a love of the CSA). I did call a few persons out on it. I would often get the "heritage not hate" line.

I am aware of the presence of racism everywhere in America, and not just bad race relations between Blacks and Whites. However, as someone who lives in the southeast, racism is present here. I've dealt with openly racist individuals myself. I lived in the Pacific Northwest for a time (as did the my family). We saw less open racism there than in the South.

I've never been to West Virginia or Maryland. When it comes to Appalachia, I've gone to the parts of Appalachia within Georgia, North Carolina, and Tennessee. I've been through part of Kentucky as a kid, but I went "through" it.

When it comes to political correctness and being against it, I at least need to mention this. Flying the Confederate flag just to go against political correctness does not make sense. There is at least some consideration that needs to be made. I look at the Confederate flag in a similar light as the Nazi flag. It is one thing to speak your mind. It is another to just be crass and hateful. I'm trying to get people think about what they are doing. I look at this from a moral perspective.

It's unfortunate that some places may still seem more racist, and I'm not doubting your experiences. Please do keep in mind that just like the friendliness of place, in my opinion the level of racism varies from one place to another. And as this thread shows, even in areas that aren't stereotypically racist (the South gets a bad rap for this but it can be prevalent in the Northeast, Midwest, and West). As far as people who flaunt having confederate flags and say it's not racist, despite the deep connotations with racism, I would distance myself from them because they probably have other issues going on with them as well that are less than pleasant personality attributes.

[green_mariner]

The man who flew that flag claimed it was to honor all Americans who died in the Civil War. This is the thing. The Confederate flag does not represent all Americans. It represents the Confederacy. It does not represent the Union soldiers who died in the Civil War. That excuse that man gives is just really stupid. It represents the Confederate cause. And that particular cause was rooted in keeping slavery. It is a dishonorable cause.

And to anyone who says "other societies practiced slavery", I have this to say: This about what happened right here is America, and in particular, the South. The Civil War is about what happened in the USA.

And to those who claim that Lincoln didn't like Blacks and felt they shouldn't be in America: So what? This is about what the Confederate cause was about, not Lincoln's cause. The Confederate flag represents the Confederate cause, not Lincoln's cause.

And for those who say that northerners weren't much friendlier to Blacks: So what? This discussion is not about the north. It is about the Confederate States of America and the Confederate flag. It is about the Confederate cause and what it's about.

The way I see it, there is nothing morally sound about flying the Confederate flag. That man can come up with any kind of weak excuse he wants. The fact is, just because you CAN do something doesn't mean you SHOULD. No one is going to jail him for flying that flag. It is his choice. However, anyone who wears Dixie Outfitter shirts, or who flies Confederate flags from their yards and trucks, be prepared for strong reactions. Be prepared for people to tell you what that flag represents. Be prepared to be viewed as a racist, considering what the Confederate flag actually represents. Do not try to use the phrase "heritage not hate". Alot of people don't buy that excuse. At the very least, understand and admit that the Confederate cause was about keeping slavery and that the Confederate flag represents the Confederacy and its cause.

[green_mariner]

Originally Posted by ryanst530

What are you so worried about?

I live in an area where there are some people flying Confederate flags. I went to school with kids who wore Dixie Outfitter t-shirts. Some of them had a very ignorant, and in some cases, combative, mentality. Some were openly bigoted and racist individuals, some whom took their hate out on me. I have plenty of reason to not want that kind of vibe around me.

Question: Why does it bother you that I'm bothered by individuals flying Confederate flags, considering what the Confederate cause is all about?

[Silver_Surfer]

Originally Posted by Hiruko

People should learn to mind their own damn business. There are much more important things to worry about than whatever flag some old man wants to fly at HIS house.

I bet you would've said the same thing to African-Americans fighting for civil rights in the '60s.