Flattening the curve is working! (Malibu: high school, statistics, eat)

[goodheathen]

Originally Posted by JohnG72

easily the most activity since the shutdown. Wife and I thought we’d take a drive up PCH. It was packed...like traffic the whole way through Malibu. That’s as far as we got due to the heavy traffic. TONS of motor cycle clubs.

And you weren’t joking about OC:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.ocr...ure-lifts/amp/

Looks like the wheels are coming off the whole shutdown order. Like I said earlier, if CA govt keeps this up, the cops won’t be able to enforce the rules. Even if people are still getting it and dying, most people understand it’s only a calculated risk if they are in good heath. Very few die or even get hospitalized unless they already had poor health.

It shouldn't be that hard to prevent if some parking is blocked off and road signs and broadcasts make the public aware of long delays.

For the average person, yes, the risk of death or serious complications is quite low. However, tens of millions of people have risk factors for worse, including millions who don't know it and probably look robust. Any rapid spread of COVID-19 in a population therefore is a major health threat.

[seain dublin]

Originally Posted by goodheathen

Once again, there is no upcoming hunger crisis in the United States or LA in particular. Throwing in "what about the children" doesn't change that.

The United States, at least in major affected areas, did make people stay home during the Spanish Flu, and no vaccine came to the rescue. There's no such thing as "death-free," pandemics kill more than anything, and that word is very dubious if the USA (along with Canada, I suppose) is unaffected. Know your facts before ranting.

Actually there already is. Many people are dependent on their school districts feeding their kids.

Now add in people who have been out of work, some for 4 weeks who are very frustrated as they can't access the EDD system. If they try and call after can't getting online, they can't even wait on hold, too many callers so it disconnects the call.

I'm sure you have seen the lines of cars for the food banks.

You're confusing hunger crisis with food shortages.

Originally Posted by Mike930

Taking temperatures is better than not doing it. You’re (The general “you”) already going into stores with people. Why not eliminate the ones with a fever? The asymptomatic are already there.

The restaurants are already open for take out. There’s no difference between waiting for the food and eating it there.

Exactly, been saying this since it started. Someone sits in their house for over a month has no problem ordering takeout, cook your own food. I have a relative here who due to some health issues and being a senior hasn't left her home now in over a month, that's smart.

But orders take out a lot, even from fast food restaurants. When I said is that a good idea(given her risk), she responded "well they wear gloves"..sigh.

[goodheathen]

Originally Posted by seain dublin

First off that is very admirable of you to think of your hairdresser at this time. Because of what you shared about raising your kids on your own you identify with what it is like to be a single mom with no help. You mentioned you hoped all her other clients were doing the same. Hopefully some are, most likely most aren't.

You're wrong about how someone's lifestyle has nothing to do with this. It totally ties into it. You think your hairdresser's first concern isn't how are we going to survive? Eat and have a roof over our heads?

Did you live here in LA during the 92 riots? I sure did and worked down in South Central at the time. I noticed you didn't comment about what I said about the boarded up store windows. Why do you they're doing that? Think hard. What's your plan if civil unrest starts to occur right there in the Valley and other places? Have you even thought that far ahead that it could be possible.

That's your inner European talking (and repeating yourself). I haven't heard of a true riot happening in the USA in decades that wasn't race-related.

No, I really don't think you are aware of the impact on the economy, not in any real detail. The Great Depression of the 1930s took almost 12 years for the US to make a full recovery due to the US entering WW2 in 1941. Your children are now working adults, do you want to see them have to struggle through those years?

Do you even know about how many hospitals are handling this and our overwhelmed? That the Javits Center in NY which was set up for 4,000 beds is now closed. That hospitals have furloughed staff. Have a family friend who is a nurse back east, she has been furloughed as have her coworkers to part time every other week. No mention here anymore about the LA Convention Center, how it was so needed letting us all think it would overwhelm all LA hospitals, this was after we were in lockdown.

Fewer people are seeking health services than should be or can. They're 'toughing it out' at home. Building that capacity was smart. Also, I think NYC emergency departments still have problems seeing patients promptly. It's just common sense that, when more than a tiny percentage of the population is ill with a contagious disease that's worse than the common cold, the healthcare system and just about everything else will have trouble functioning well.

If old people don't want their children to suffer professionally and can afford to do so, they should retire early and open up spots on the workplace ladder.

I unquoted many things I agree with, but not the implication that it's time to reopen most of LA.

[CA4Now]

Originally Posted by goodheathen

That's your inner European talking (and repeating yourself). I haven't heard of a true riot happening in the USA in decades that wasn't race-related.

Amen to that.

[Mike930]

Originally Posted by goodheathen

It's okay in theory. In practice, think about it. 1) It promotes a myth of no-fever, no-problem. 2) It's a health risk to the temperature checkers. 3) It creates interpersonal conflicts 4) It slows down entrance time 5) It wastes physical resources 6) It's redundant if someone is running errands, unless for example a wrist is stamped with for example a green mark like clubs do. I think stores realized that and hence I've not heard of any place around here doing it.



The more people inside, the worse, and if an occupancy limit means people have to wait longer outside, that's also a negative. An outdoor takeout line (to a walk-up window) is only marginally bad. I think the ultimate reasons for indoor take-out being open are 1) some people don't have vehicles that fit available. 2) many restaurants have neither drive-through service nor walk-up windows. I think California should push its restaurants with drive-through to block off parking spots that aren't reserved for trucks and recommend that any restaurants being built or remodeled (probably almost none now) have walk-up windows.

Actually, taking temperatures does work. It’s worked in Asia and I was there to see it. There’s no “health risk” at all. You don’t take everyone’s temperature individually like a doctor’s office. There’s scanners that can do it from a distance. We were coming off a plane in Hong Kong during SARS and they had something that looked like a radar gun checking everyone coming off the plane.

As far as the “negatives”, you list, people have been waiting at restaurants for tables for decades and will continue to do so. You simply limit the number of tables. Whatever the reason for Indoor take out, it exists, almost everywhere. I’ve stood in a restaurant waiting for take out with at least 10 other people in a small area. There’s no reason we couldn’t have been sitting and eating.

Some people think this is going to be an all or nothing thing and that’s not true.

[goodheathen]

Originally Posted by seain dublin

Actually there already is. Many people are dependent on their school districts feeding their kids.

Now add in people who have been out of work, some for 4 weeks who are very frustrated as they can't access the EDD system. If they try and call after can't getting online, they can't even wait on hold, too many callers so it disconnects the call.

I'm sure you have seen the lines of cars for the food banks.

You're confusing hunger crisis with food shortages.

Yes, I've heard of that. I'd call it bad, but not a humanitarian crisis or pending crisis. There's no indication that food banks and schools will stop providing enough, government benefits eventually will be sent out, and of course the lockdown is temporary. Starvation wasn't even much of an issue during the Great Depression.

Exactly, been saying this since it started. Someone sits in their house for over a month has no problem ordering takeout, cook your own food. I have a relative here who due to some health issues and being a senior hasn't left her home now in over a month, that's smart.

But orders take out a lot, even from fast food restaurants. When I said is that a good idea(given her risk), she responded "well they wear gloves"..sigh.

You chide someone for fear-mongering and then do the same thing. Gloves are overrated, but there are many reasons why takeout (which you might be conflating with delivery) is safer than dining in or shopping in a typical grocery store. No experts I'm aware of agree with you. Also, you oversimplify the practicality of cooking, regardless of how ingredients are acquired.

[Mike930]

Originally Posted by JohnG72

easily the most activity since the shutdown. Wife and I thought we’d take a drive up PCH. It was packed...like traffic the whole way through Malibu. That’s as far as we got due to the heavy traffic. TONS of motor cycle clubs.

And you weren’t joking about OC:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.ocr...ure-lifts/amp/

Looks like the wheels are coming off the whole shutdown order. Like I said earlier, if CA govt keeps this up, the cops won’t be able to enforce the rules. Even if people are still getting it and dying, most people understand it’s only a calculated risk if they are in good heath. Very few die or even get hospitalized unless they already had poor health.

Wow. If you had shown me that photo without a caption, I would have sworn it was last year. I hadn’t seen any photos.

You realize you’re going to cause a certain poster’s head to explode.

[nmnita]

Originally Posted by seain dublin

Than make it at home. If you don't have one, and don't like instant, go to Target which is still open and buy a coffee maker.

I really don't get people(I have a family member here is who over 70 and hasn't left her house in over 30 days), It's good she is taking precautions like that, but they're still getting a lot of take out, even fast food. I did say "do you think that is a good idea?", her reply " well they wear gloves"...ugh. Cook your own food at home, it's better and you're better off.

Cooking at home is better and healthier than curb side pick up or drive through but it it fun to order once once in awhile As for staying in for 30 days, to me that is carrying things way too far, but we all have to approach this in whatever way makes us the most comfortable even if others don't see it the same way. This is no right answer that fits us all.

[nmnita]

Originally Posted by Exitus Acta Probat

Sixty-one L.A. residents died of Covid-19 just today. And why? Because some people just couldn't stay at home. How pathetic.

this goes way deeper than people all staying at home. There are many ways we can get out, do our errands, even take walks and still keep away from others as well as protecting our families. Are you blaming those who were not at home or are you blaming those who choose to go out and contracted the virus?

[JohnG72]

Originally Posted by CA4Now

Is it?

At least 36,000 more people have died during the coronavirus pandemic over the last month than the official Covid-19 death counts report, a review of mortality data in 12 countries shows — providing a clearer, if still incomplete, picture of the toll of the crisis.

.....mortality data in the middle of a pandemic is not perfect. The disparities between the official death counts and the total rise in deaths most likely reflect limited testing for the virus, rather than intentional undercounting. Officially, about 190,000 people have died worldwide of the coronavirus as of Saturday.

But the total death numbers offer a more complete portrait of the pandemic, experts say, especially because most countries report only those Covid-19 deaths that occur in hospitals.

36,000 Missing Deaths: Tracking the True Toll of the Coronavirus Crisis:
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/...ng-deaths.html

How does this counter my argument that most who die are dying from preexisting conditions?

https://www1.nyc.gov/assets/doh/down...04152020-1.pdf

Nearly everyone who dies from cv had preexisting health conditions.