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Old 05-25-2020, 11:57 AM
 
Location: On the water.
16,280 posts, read 9,202,044 times
Reputation: 13445

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Quote:
Originally Posted by (901) View Post
That wasn't meant to be an insult just a suggestion. Instead of taking everything you hear on your news outlet as truth, look around for yourself and see if it ads up?
Why are grocery store employees not dropping like flys? The first month or so they didn't wear mask and they seem to be doing fine.
Boy is that a weak backpedal. Sorry. It was intended as an insult. Period.

As for my news outlets: you know where I get my news? And how I evaluate?

For that matter, you don’t even know what my positions are on this virus shutdown. I’m not arguing in personal favor of any shut down. I’m enjoying the sport of eviscerating fallacious statements, claims and conclusions.

My position on all matters is: without accurate information and completely objective analysis, rightful conclusions can’t be drawn, from which rightful actions could be taken.

The facts are: mayors and governors DO have the powers they are enacting here. Whether they are pursuing best courses of actions with those powers can be argued till the cows don’t ever come home.

 
Old 05-25-2020, 12:02 PM
 
Location: moved
9,530 posts, read 5,877,024 times
Reputation: 16129
OK, let's try this: you decide that it's a salutary and essential goal, to train for a marathon. But your running-skills and overall health are inadequate. So you keep extending your daily runs, to longer and longer duration. Unfortunately your performance plateaus. You become tired, and your body is aching. But your running-length can't ever quite approach that of a full marathon. And yet, you doggedly persist... to the point of damaging your body. End result: no marathon, but busted knees, and maybe a heart-attack.

Do you understand how a metric, defined as a goal to be attained, can be unrealistic? Or that sometimes it's better to instead specify a calendar date: I will train for the next 30 weeks, and if by then, my running-capacity has plateaued, I'll conclude my training, settling for whatever then-available best-result I could get?
 
Old 05-25-2020, 12:03 PM
 
Location: On the water.
16,280 posts, read 9,202,044 times
Reputation: 13445
Quote:
Originally Posted by seain dublin View Post
SMDH, what are you are you screeching about now?


This thread really got derailed fast, really fast. Not surprised, but what happened to talking about Eric Garcetti? Haven't been to this thread in a couple of days, I thought this thread was about him and the residents of Los Angeles?

Who are you to dictate to people where they should pray or not pray? I'm not even religious but I am not telling people and NEITHER are you where they can and cannot pray. So Trump, Newsom, Garcetti good bad or indifferent because with so much going on for people these days it gets old. Extreme left wing and extreme left wing views have now gotten this country add in the ignorance of lot of Americans well not good. Well even those three don't have that kind of control over people, but you think you do? Because you don't like it?

Just because you're an old woman over 70 doesn't mean you get a pass on how you respond to people, or it is now OK because I have been on the planet longer than the majority of the regular poster on the CA boards I get a pass on being civil and mocking people, well Leslie Van Houten and Patrica Krenwinkle are also women over 70 who reside in CA....so.

Stay in your house if you are so afraid and that is YOUR RIGHT. Let's face it you are anyway. You do that as long as YOU want.

You choose to do that fine, you don't dictate to others.

Just a suggestion, not an ORDER. Perhaps step away from the news, too much of it and especially now isn't good for anyone.
Speaking of Jesus: you need to start proofreading your stuff before you post. Just saying, that’s what Jesus would do.
 
Old 05-25-2020, 12:08 PM
 
Location: moved
9,530 posts, read 5,877,024 times
Reputation: 16129
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tulemutt View Post
...Firstly, my observations about foreign trolling on this forum are based on very intense proofs of just such activities in all forms of social media.
"Very intense" proofs. As opposed to proofs of merely standard intensity?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tulemutt View Post
And secondly because several “members” I have identified have been exiled from the forums.
People get "exiled" for all sorts of infractions, presumably principally on account of launching direct personal attacks. No doubt, some posters are provocateurs, with a nefarious agenda. But to simply retort, "Hey, shut up, your viewpoint is groundless because clearly you're a Russian troll", is just a playground taunt.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tulemutt View Post
My position on all matters is: without accurate information and completely objective analysis, rightful conclusions can’t be drawn, from which rightful actions could be taken.
And as goes without saying, your own positions are rational, objective, sensible and unbiased. The opposing positions are of course the negation of that. Such a brilliantly unassailable position from which to argue, is it not?
 
Old 05-25-2020, 12:11 PM
 
Location: On the water.
16,280 posts, read 9,202,044 times
Reputation: 13445
Quote:
Originally Posted by ohio_peasant View Post
OK, let's try this: you decide that it's a salutary and essential goal, to train for a marathon. But your running-skills and overall health are inadequate. So you keep extending your daily runs, to longer and longer duration. Unfortunately your performance plateaus. You become tired, and your body is aching. But your running-length can't ever quite approach that of a full marathon. And yet, you doggedly persist... to the point of damaging your body. End result: no marathon, but busted knees, and maybe a heart-attack.

Do you understand how a metric, defined as a goal to be attained, can be unrealistic? Or that sometimes it's better to instead specify a calendar date: I will train for the next 30 weeks, and if by then, my running-capacity has plateaued, I'll conclude my training, settling for whatever then-available best-result I could get?
Um no.

If the metric of a marathon is valid for others but not for this one individual, the metric remains valid as proven by others’ performance.

If no runners can ever complete the marathon, then the marathon metric is not valid.
 
Old 05-25-2020, 12:17 PM
 
Location: On the water.
16,280 posts, read 9,202,044 times
Reputation: 13445
Quote:
Originally Posted by ohio_peasant View Post
"Very intense" proofs. As opposed to proofs of merely standard intensity?



People get "exiled" for all sorts of infractions, presumably principally on account of launching direct personal attacks. No doubt, some posters are provocateurs, with a nefarious agenda. But to simply retort, "Hey, shut up, your viewpoint is groundless because clearly you're a Russian troll", is just a playground taunt.



And as goes without saying, your own positions are rational, objective, sensible and unbiased. The opposing positions are of course the negation of that. Such a brilliantly unassailable position from which to argue, is it not?
I just provided a handful of links describing deep research findings on foreign trolling. Yeah: intense proof exists.

No, I’m not making “playground taunts” when I identify obvious pernicious agendas accompanied by linguistic ‘tells’.

And yes, my positions are: rational, objective, sensible and unbiased. Good of you to acknowledge.
 
Old 05-25-2020, 12:47 PM
 
Location: Living rent free in your head
35,151 posts, read 16,237,227 times
Reputation: 25736
Quote:
Originally Posted by Csonka View Post
not about other mayors or mayoralty in general

It's about does Mayor Garcetti have that power?

I say no. He can't impose ad hoc rules with no definite timeline, changing them as he goes, and remain within the confines of his authority from a legal and constitutional perspective
There is NOTHING, in any Federal law, California state law or Los Angeles municipal code that requires the mayor put a definitive end date on an emergency order. That would be tantamount to putting an official end date to World War II in 1941.

It would take a really good magic 8 ball for Garcetti to know when he can lift emergency orders, and the irony is that if he offered a date for reopening people would scream about that, So he's between a rock and a hard place and he's probably wise to not take the bait and try to guess when they can reopen.
 
Old 05-25-2020, 01:41 PM
Status: "No a member" (set 15 days ago)
 
Location: South Orange County
51 posts, read 11,358 times
Reputation: 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by quixotic59 View Post
Reality: The Federal government has no authority or legal jurisdiction over state's rights, especially during an emergency.


This was posted by one, Peter James, on his Facebook page. A coherent explanation based on legal knowledge and not "opinion".

Today’s PSA:
“But my liberties and rights!”
I’m glad you asked about that, because I’m a lawyer. In fact, I’m a lawyer who specifically deals with liberties and rights on a daily basis.
First of all, you have been temporarily inconvenienced, not oppressed. You have not lost a single right. Not one.
Your right to assembly, you say?
Your right to assemble is fully intact. Yes, it is. That right is the right of free association, not the right to gather wherever you feel like it whenever you feel like it. It means that the government can’t prohibit you from joining organizations and expressing your collected views.
And they aren’t. Not one governmental entity out there is saying you can’t be part of Citizens for Pro-Plague Nuttery or yell about how angry you are about wearing a mask.
What they are saying right now is that you can’t hold public gatherings of more than a certain number of people.
The Supreme Court has long upheld “time, place, and manner” restrictions on things like public gatherings. Those don’t infringe upon your rights, according to SCOTUS, if they are within a certain well-defined framework.
Honestly, this is less draconian than quarantines of the past. Most of you don’t know that because we haven’t had to do this in a very long time, like 75 years long time. But back before we had vaccines to a lot of things, if the government so much as suspected you had measles or smallpox, you would get your house sealed up and you didn’t go *anywhere* for two or three weeks while they shoved a few casserole dishes under the door. They’d put a big sign on the door that says “no entry or exit” and if you tried, some burly men would “politely explain” to you why that was not permitted. You didn’t go out for essentials. You didn’t go out for a walk. And they didn’t have Netflix or Instacart back then.
There is no constitutional right to own a business or go to work. Not in there. I’m sorry some of you are suffering, and I feel for you. I legitimately get that some of you are going to lose a lot from this and possibly everything you built. But it’s not a right. You didn’t have that right before, which is why people go bankrupt or get laid off or have their business ventures fail.
Again, you have been temporarily inconvenienced, not oppressed.
But let’s say for the sake of argument, you have had an actual, honest-to-goodness right infringed. You haven’t, but let’s just say you did.
That’s not the end of the story. The government *can* infringe on your rights. Oh yes, they can, and legally so.
How much the government infringes on your rights only changes the level of scrutiny the Court applies. If they are going to fully deprive you of a fundamental right, they need to have a compelling reason to do it and their actions need to be narrowly tailored to the harm being prevented. Public health and safety, especially where it comes to highly infectious diseases, has been upheld as a compelling governmental interest that can override fundamental rights including the right to free exercise of religious beliefs.
And stay-at-home orders are narrowly tailored, too. You can go out to stores for essentials, you can leave your house to go for a walk, you can get food delivered to you. You can go for a drive just to get out if you want. It just closes non-essential businesses that by design put lots of people in a confined space. That is narrowly tailored to the things causing the pandemic to spread the most.
It is not liberty to require human sacrifice to the gods of capitalism. It is not liberty to indirectly kill people. It is not liberty to put people in danger.
You do not have a right to endanger me and my family because you want to have a beer with the fellas at the corner pub.
You do not have a right to commit negligent homicide.
The government has very limited ability to shut down lawful businesses except for violations of the law/licensure. The entire planet is re-opening, yet libs would like us to not work at all.
 
Old 05-25-2020, 01:53 PM
 
Location: On the water.
16,280 posts, read 9,202,044 times
Reputation: 13445
Quote:
Originally Posted by CaminoDelAvion View Post
The government has very limited ability to shut down lawful businesses except for violations of the law/licensure. The entire planet is re-opening, yet libs would like us to not work at all.
I guess you haven’t been paying attention to reality and history.
 
Old 05-25-2020, 02:42 PM
 
Location: Los Angeles
3,812 posts, read 2,064,572 times
Reputation: 4625
Quote:
Originally Posted by CaminoDelAvion View Post
The government has very limited ability to shut down lawful businesses except for violations of the law/licensure. The entire planet is re-opening, yet libs would like us to not work at all.
LuvSouthOC...oops I mean CaminoDelAvion: Not true on both points.

https://www.businessinsider.com/coun...ough-may-31-19

Last edited by Astral_Weeks; 05-25-2020 at 02:54 PM..
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