Is marijuana use out of control in Los Angeles? (small business, market)

[nelsonajack]

Originally Posted by californio sur

You reveal a reactionary position. You're not Republican are you?

and thats where he stops responding must be republican

I don't smoke marijuana but I think it should be legalized and I'm not too concerned with it spreading. Alcohol is far more dangerous and causes many more problems/deaths than weed could ever dream of.

However I will say I find the whole weed culture very irritating. Screaming 420 is not clever, cool, or funny.

Originally Posted by SOON2BNSURPRISE

When it comes to Gay marriage, what happened to the rights of Religion? We believe in freedom of religion and that the governent will not enact laws to go against religion. Marriage is part of the church.

Last I checked I get a marriage license from the government.

[Mr. Humble]

As many legal dispensaries as there are in L.A., it's nowhere near the number of liquor stores. Just think how much better off L.A., the state, the country, the world would be if the opposite were true. Less violence, domestic or bar room, fewer deaths on our highways, we'd all be better off if more people were stoned than drunk.

[ZenMaster2008]

I watched a documentary on legalizing Marijuana and they had some interesting facts. They said Californians purchases 33% of all marijuana in the US (legally). If they were to tax the sales as they currently stand they'd get somewhere in the ballpark of 1B per year in tax money. That is going off memory since I don't feel like digging up the actual stats.

[Mr. Humble]

The only thing I can figure is the tobacco and liquor lobbies are so powerful in this country they can prevent legalization. Also, unlike tobacco and booze, marijuana can easily be cultivated at home; and therefore they can tax it all they want but how will they prevent everyone from growing their own, which will wreak havoc with tax revenues......

"It's all about money, ain't a damn thing funny." Just like everything else in this country.

[bluevelo]

We live in the most drugged society in history if you look at all the 'scripts, in particular, for legal psychotropics medications for depression, mental illness, etc.

That said, my experience being around regular, long-time pot smokers - those say in their 40s and 50s - is that pot either a) makes people lazy and stupid over time or b) if they're that way to begin with, it makes them worse.

The difference between things like alcohol and illegal drugs vs. most scripts is that the legal stuff doesn't have the potential to impair you socially or while driving a motor vehicle as pot does.

I don't think it makes sense to fine or toss drug abusers of the light stuff (pot and alcohol in prison) but perhaps a year spent picking up trash on the weekends - with a much harder prison term awaiting if you don't do your time - would go a long ways toward cleaning up abuse of the milder drugs.

As for things like meth, etc... we should be enforcing far harsher penalties than jail for their manufacture, sale and use, as this stuff drives a great deal of dangerous crime in our society.

I'll be voting against legalizing pot. Its a very bad idea.

P.S. I'm not a Republican, I'm actually a libertarian, but there are certain things - like legalizing pot "because its everywhere to begin with, man" that are really dumb ideas, but as I said, everyone I've seen on pot acts and gets stupid, just like they do on alcohol.

[Bunjee]

I think there's lots of pie-in-the-sky thinking in the legalization community. Many of us who oppose legalization do so on the basis of simple nuts and bolts. The alcohol industry was legal before prohibition and continued through it. There was no transition. The pot industry has always been underground and to think that all these drug cartels are just gonna walk away from billions of dollars is nonsense. Will they submit to taxes and regulation? Oh, yes they will! as they continue to peddle wares. Criminal activity will continue whether the drug itself is legal or not, and in fact will require a more complex, costly policy-making administrative arm of government to oversee it.

Will mom & pop operations themselves submit to oversight, FDA regulation and taxation? Sure. But there are thousands upon thousands of home growers who won't. You can make your own beer, you can share it, but you can't just on a lark call yourself a business and sell it. That would still be criminal activity, it will continue and will have to be fought. Tax revenues put rainbows in people's eyes. But there are real life conditions. For example, we know smoking pot deposits up to 4 times the amount of tar in the lungs as tobacco, which is heavily taxed based on its effect on general health. How would potsmokers react to the possibility of their legally obtained herb costing more than their formerly illicit purchase?

These are only outlining examples of enforcement of policy alone, nevermind the intricacies of regulation itself that would be ramified in lawsuits, liability concerns, certification of quality and production, zoning laws. Even seemingly innocuous herbal remedies submit to rigorous oversight. This is--let's name it fairly--a mind altering drug. It is an intoxicant.

But I anticipate a comparison. I do some work for a company that distributes fine liquors. Believe me, they are heavily regulated in ways that a guy with a garden would not welcome. But that guy with his garden better break out his pen and checkbook if he wants to do business, because business is serious business when it comes to drugs. Be honest, how many will submit? Criminal activity will continue, just policed by a different department. It will take decades to shake out the kinks, but with proper planning it can be smoothed. Something as simple as a return policy has to be codified with legal foundations. Do I see any of this anticipated in legalization rhetoric? None. That concerns me enough to vote against it simple on the basis of as yet poor forethought. Presuming no moral barriers, let's have a serious discussion of mechanics first, and these issues are really in pro-legalization's court to address (or acknowledge, of course) as real.

Three years, is my challenge. Three years to work out problems, disputes, questions, concerns. Personally, I have no interest in controlling anyone. What I want is to control chaos in our already costly legislature with proactive, mature dialogue.

[esmith143]

We live in the most drugged society in history if you look at all the 'scripts, in particular, for legal psychotropics medications for depression, mental illness, etc.

The least drugged is more like it. Throughout most of the history, nearly everyone drank beer starting at the age of 5, in such quantities that would put most modern drunkards to shame (most of the time, you couldn't drink water, because it was too polluted by human waste, and milk was reserved for toddlers, everyone else drank beer instead.) You couldn't find a sober person in 16th century London to save your life.

In the last couple of centuries, we've been painting ourselves into a corner by banning more and more mind-altering substances. First, opium, then pot, then LSD, then meth, then more and more relatively harmless substances like anabolic steroids or ephedrine. At this rate, fifty years from now, I'll need a prescription to buy a cup of coffee (it's got caffeine in it, and all sorts of other addictive and potentially dangerous chemicals!)

[Mr. Humble]

Originally Posted by bluevelo

The difference between things like alcohol and illegal drugs vs. most scripts is that the legal stuff doesn't have the potential to impair you socially or while driving a motor vehicle as pot does.

I don't think it makes sense to fine or toss drug abusers of the light stuff (pot and alcohol in prison) but perhaps a year spent picking up trash on the weekends - with a much harder prison term awaiting if you don't do your time - would go a long ways toward cleaning up abuse of the milder drugs.

As for things like meth, etc... we should be enforcing far harsher penalties than jail for their manufacture, sale and use, as this stuff drives a great deal of dangerous crime in our society.

I'll be voting against legalizing pot. Its a very bad idea.

P.S. I'm not a Republican, I'm actually a libertarian, but there are certain things - like legalizing pot "because its everywhere to begin with, man" that are really dumb ideas, but as I said, everyone I've seen on pot acts and gets stupid, just like they do on alcohol.

And that will be one uninformed vote.