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Old 12-30-2009, 11:53 AM
 
4 posts, read 15,107 times
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Aircraft noise over Schnitzelburg/Germantown?

I will be relocating to Louisville within the next 1.5 months and I have been reading many of the blogs on this site which I've found extremely helpful. I'm interested in the Schnitzelburge/Germantown area, but can't find much info on how bad the Aircraft noise pollution is in the area. I know that it is a UPS hub.

Looking at the city of Louisville, Ky on Google Maps Satellite image I notice that the Airports North East Landing Strip is directed so that planes landing from the west will fly right over head of the Schnitzelburg/Germantown areas. From some info found from a web search, this landing strip is used 41% of the time.

My Questions are as follows:

What times during the day does the majority of Aircraft landings occur, and how often?

How often do they land in the less frequent times of the day?

While in these areas, during a plane descent, what is the level of loudness? For example, can you speak normally or do you have to scream at one another to continue your conversation?

Is the lower cost to live in these areas a result of the aircraft noise?

Thanks
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Old 12-30-2009, 10:50 PM
 
27 posts, read 42,312 times
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Very good question. UPS is a bad bad neighbor, but they provide lots of jobs, so they get away with it. The regular airline planes and UPS planes go over during the day. It's loud at times (and planes are low) but bearable...usually. They (the vibrations) are rough on the historic houses, though.

What's really terrible, though, are UPS overnight planes. They claim only to go over Schnitzelburg/Germantown if a certain wind speed,etc. which is not entirely true. They are loud, low, and seemingly random day by day. The intense noise can go on all night long. It's terrible and my two years in the neighborhood were the worst sleeping years of my entire life.

It doesn't seem to affect the price of houses much. As you'll find, Louisville people put up with alot and are definitely don't-rock-the-boat kind of people. Apparently, expecting a decent night's sleep from a bad corporate citizen is rocking the boat, as the neighborhood citizens and association seem to have made no effort for this to cease. You'll notice that no one has commented in over a day, which should speak volumes to this.

I would suggest that if you want to live in this neighborhood, you get as far east in Germantown as you can.
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Old 12-31-2009, 10:13 AM
 
6,351 posts, read 20,319,212 times
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Jclaude, I've got an idea; how 'bout if UPS raises the cost of shipping your parcels to a level NO ONE can afford so that they can develop a noiseless jet engine. That way, they'll definitely go out of business and you'll have your peace and quiet back...

I also don't have time to post everyday because I have a full time job and I'm not able to post while driving my truck down the Watterson...
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Old 12-31-2009, 01:48 PM
 
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CJL2009, I appreciate that Crew Chief's post just confirmed what I posted...There is a major noise pollution problem that UPS causes in Louisville and the citizenry in the affected neighborhoods have low enough standards to think they have to put up with it.
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Old 12-31-2009, 06:29 PM
 
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Interesting. Thank you for the confirmation of my hypothesis. I assumed that this question might not be answerred immediately, since it is a sensitive subject. However, it is difficult to estimate how the noise will affect myself as each person can be affected differently. Do you consider yourself a light sleeper?

Luckily, I have the option to choose what area to live in as of now. From what I read about this area, everything sounds great, except the Aircraft noise. Could be a show stopper for me.

If the citizens of Germantown did try to change the air-traffic control such as; for example, % a landing strip is used, it would be like trying to push a wet rag up a grassy hill. Someone would have to obtain all the airport traffic information and know a thing or two about aviation. Then possibly someone could analyze the traffic patterns and propose a solution with little to no cost or penalty to UPS or the Louisville Airport (whoever's wallat is at risk). I'm not that person. Someone has probably already done it. Maybe not.?.

To keep good realations with the community it would be good idea for UPS or the Airport, whoevers responsible, to prove to the public that the current traffic pattern currently used is the best pattern to keep the majority of aircraft noise from affecting the citizens. By proof, I mean a statistical analysis regarding wind direction, speeds, etc..., and clear explanations for the logic.

Good info, Thanks again.
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Old 12-31-2009, 07:06 PM
 
27 posts, read 42,312 times
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Yes, it's true that each person is affected differently, but imagine a plane very close enough overhead (though miles from the airport) about as loud as you can imagine (can't hear to have a discussion) in the middle of the night...repeatedly.

UPS won't change anything because the citizens of Germantown don't seem to care about a blatant abuse of noise pollution. Also, the city could do something about it but the Abramson administration shields big corporations rather than reasonably regulate. It could be worse--houses in Old Louisville (the other side of I-65) cost about 3X what those in Germantown do and they have the same problem.
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Old 01-01-2010, 10:44 AM
 
4 posts, read 15,107 times
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I did a little more searching on stats and reports. The airport posts stats about how many planes, what type, how many people, and so on. The most recent report (November 2009) link is below.

http://www.flylouisville.com/clientfiles/upload/NOVEMBER%202009.pdf (broken link)

Louisville SDF airport had 11,556 aircraft operations in Nov 2009. I am interpreting this as planes that have landed and took off from the airport in a months time. There are 30 days in Nov., and 1440 minutes in a day. If the runway directed at Schnitzelburg/Germantown is use approximately 41% of the time then:

Average Plan frequency over Schnitzelburg/Germantown area = 1440minutes/(11,556 planes X 41%/30 days) = 9.1 minutes per plane in Nov. 2009

If the noise truely is loud enough to shake houses and interupt conversations....every 9 minutes...that seems like alot.
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Old 01-01-2010, 06:20 PM
 
6,972 posts, read 15,092,911 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CJL2009 View Post
Interesting. Thank you for the confirmation of my hypothesis. I assumed that this question might not be answerred immediately, since it is a sensitive subject. However, it is difficult to estimate how the noise will affect myself as each person can be affected differently. Do you consider yourself a light sleeper?

Luckily, I have the option to choose what area to live in as of now. From what I read about this area, everything sounds great, except the Aircraft noise. Could be a show stopper for me.

If the citizens of Germantown did try to change the air-traffic control such as; for example, % a landing strip is used, it would be like trying to push a wet rag up a grassy hill. Someone would have to obtain all the airport traffic information and know a thing or two about aviation. Then possibly someone could analyze the traffic patterns and propose a solution with little to no cost or penalty to UPS or the Louisville Airport (whoever's wallat is at risk). I'm not that person. Someone has probably already done it. Maybe not.?.

To keep good realations with the community it would be good idea for UPS or the Airport, whoevers responsible, to prove to the public that the current traffic pattern currently used is the best pattern to keep the majority of aircraft noise from affecting the citizens. By proof, I mean a statistical analysis regarding wind direction, speeds, etc..., and clear explanations for the logic.

Good info, Thanks again.

I'd be careful who you listen to on here. JClaude is a new poster here, and his fist 10 posts have been all extremely negative. You will see lots of online negativity especially on newspaper forums.

Bottom line: germantown is a great neighborhood. Certainly look into it. There is a reason home values in this area are still rising, and it has an incredible housing stock and neighborhood character.

The airport noise is usually worst at the NW end of the neighborhood, near Shelby and Eastern Parkway. As stated, this can be rough at times especially at night, but it is not too bad. I lived ror a year on Texas Ave and had very little problems with noise. But then again, I am from Chicago originally and used to sirens, freeway hum, and general urban background noise. It is a nonissue for parts east and northeast in the neighborhood, especially the newly popular areas off Goss Avenue.
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Old 01-01-2010, 11:02 PM
 
27 posts, read 42,312 times
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My post is, in the moderator's opinion, extremely negative. However, if you read between the lines in his own post, you will see that he doesn't disagree with my previously-made points. I never once said anything negative about Germantown as a neighborhood (other than that the neighborhood association doesn't stick up for its citizens) and advised the o.p. to look east in Germantown (same as the moderator did). A side note: I am not a country boy, not used to city sounds. As the o.p. found with research, there are a great deal of planes that use the flight pattern in question and I assume also eventually ended up figuring out the answer to the initial query.

Another post I made on a different thread, which the moderator is viewing as negative, refers to the public nuisance known as the Swift plant in Butchertown. The pervasive tone of the thread was that the neighbors should simply put up with excessive (I am not exaggerating to say that even driving through the area at times can make ones nostrils burn.) smells and various violations.

If speaking up against various pollutions and quality of life issues is being extremely negative, than guilty as charged. Louisville is made up of far too many people who think that's just how it is and that they have to just accept it. Thankfully, some people who know it doesn't have to be this way (mostly transplants) are becoming more vocal. It's nice to see the content on Ville Voice and Broken Sidewalk, critical and reasonable. It would be welcome to see this forum be more balanced than simply empty cheerleading. Several of the issues I have responded relate directly to decisions made or not made by the Abramson administration, e.g. Cordish, the arena, shielding big corporations from quality of life issues, etc. Many people in Louisville have major issues with the mayor and it is peculiar that is considered odd to express opinions here that actually critically and seriously look at major matters.
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Old 01-02-2010, 06:59 PM
 
6,972 posts, read 15,092,911 times
Reputation: 3404
Quote:
Originally Posted by jclaude View Post
My post is, in the moderator's opinion, extremely negative. However, if you read between the lines in his own post, you will see that he doesn't disagree with my previously-made points. I never once said anything negative about Germantown as a neighborhood (other than that the neighborhood association doesn't stick up for its citizens) and advised the o.p. to look east in Germantown (same as the moderator did). A side note: I am not a country boy, not used to city sounds. As the o.p. found with research, there are a great deal of planes that use the flight pattern in question and I assume also eventually ended up figuring out the answer to the initial query.

Another post I made on a different thread, which the moderator is viewing as negative, refers to the public nuisance known as the Swift plant in Butchertown. The pervasive tone of the thread was that the neighbors should simply put up with excessive (I am not exaggerating to say that even driving through the area at times can make ones nostrils burn.) smells and various violations.

If speaking up against various pollutions and quality of life issues is being extremely negative, than guilty as charged. Louisville is made up of far too many people who think that's just how it is and that they have to just accept it. Thankfully, some people who know it doesn't have to be this way (mostly transplants) are becoming more vocal. It's nice to see the content on Ville Voice and Broken Sidewalk, critical and reasonable. It would be welcome to see this forum be more balanced than simply empty cheerleading. Several of the issues I have responded relate directly to decisions made or not made by the Abramson administration, e.g. Cordish, the arena, shielding big corporations from quality of life issues, etc. Many people in Louisville have major issues with the mayor and it is peculiar that is considered odd to express opinions here that actually critically and seriously look at major matters.
This is a much better post. There is not empty cheerleading here. Just beware that anytime you are a newcomer and all you have is negativity, and you ressurrect old threads and add negative thoughts....well, people will be skeptical. Certainly all thoughts are welcome here though, as long as posts are civil and thoughtful.
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