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I have to agree with you somewhat on this subject. We have done things we thought were energy saving and prudent in the twenty years we have lived in our current home. We tore out the old kit................................ Especially now when their oil bills have risen 300%! That's the big problem here.The oil rose far too quickly for people to even try to implement a conservation plan.
That is so true. Who really knew it would just explode like this?
And I would have to add that not everyone can improve the insulation in their homes, change the way its heated OR design their own homes. That is a luxury that lots of people who have lived here for decades cannot afford or will be able to ever afford.
I agree. You are correct.
There are quadriplegics for example who can not hang blankets on their interior walls to add insulation to their walls.
I have seen a lot of folks in Maine who pile up trash bags of autumn leaves, around the foundation of their homes to help with winter warmth. But as you say, there are folks in Maine who may be absent during autumn, and therefore can not have access to leaves and / or lawn clippings.
In our move to Maine, we had budgeted ourselves some funds with which to build our selves a home. Our budget was far below most today's home buyers.
The 'luxury' of building your own home, sounds like a joke. The 'luxury' would have been to have bought an existing home.
... Americans need to get off the wealth-for-show merry-go-round and start facing the fact that our economy is in a serious decline for the moment. I think all of us will be affected by this.
Just "do the best you can", and you'll get by, as will we all.
Americans do tend to use their wealth in wasteful methods.
When we lived in Scotland, our home's heating system was plumbed to radiators in every room. That system was capable of heating the entire home up to 55*. It simply was not capable of heating the home any warmer than that. Every room had a fireplace and we burned coal / peat, in whatever room we occupied.
I think that many Americans would wig-out if their home heating systems could not get warmer than 55*.
Ha ha, I read this thread thinking about moving to Maine from Phoenix. I feel sort of stupid. I don't even have to turn the heater on in the winter if I don't want to. We complain about air condition bills but they only go up to about 400 a month. Maybe 500 in an old house but the brand new houses are sometimes only about 280 or so. Housing is really cheap right now because of the crash, not as cheap as Maine but getting there. If you all can't take the cold maybe you should come down west. lol
I'm starting to worry about those heating bills myself. I'm not rich by any means. I might have to wait and see what the oil is going to do in a year or so.
I really feel for you guys.
Twiggy:
I have similar dreams. My 2 cents: I like wood heat, Swedish or Russian masonry heater. Swedish is described in Jan/Feb 2003 issue of the magazine "This Old House", it is very efficient- half hour of wood burning will keep 1 room warm for 24 hours, size 7ft by 3ft column.It won't heat the entire house, you need one for each room, so it is more suited for a new construction. Can not be used for cooking.
Russian masonry heater, not the old type, but the one, they re-invented in the 20-30th of the 20 century, you can use it to heat the entire space (must be 1 story only, I think), you can cook and bake and sleep on top of it, if you put a feather bed for softness. For best results requires special pear-shaped cookware, as most of the heat for cooking comes from the sides of the brick oven, not the bottom as conventional, and it is a lower temperature cooking, all vitamins and nutrients stay in the food. It is made of brick and the scheme of building it here, row by row from the bottom up Ðóññêàÿ ïå÷ü XX âåêà — «Òåïëóøêà-15» (http://www.besthome.ru/arrange/info/heating/heating_274.html - broken link)
Toilets are only composting type, like they have in Australia and Norway.
Here is one sold by Home Depot BioLet 30 NE, Non-electric composting toilet - 30 NE at The Home Depot
I personally like Envirolet, they come in electrical or non-electrical types. It is a shame to use clean water for flashing toilets, and in the cities we end up re-using the same water after it goes through Waste Plant Treatment and becomes drinking water again, contaminated by drugs, radiation from chemotherapy,etc... how disgusting...
There is a family in MA, which build their solar house in 1982, use solar water heater and refrigerator box without use of electricity, solar greenhouse for growing food and root cellar for more than 20 years. You can see pictures and read about it here: Daystar: The Four Mile Island Solar Home
I hope, soon I will be able to implement some of it myself. Meantime, I kindly ask all of the wonderful people on Maine forum to help me to find more information on efficient living or at least share the knowledge on how farmers used to live here before 1938 (when oil was discovered in Saudi Arabia and all the petrol- dope started). In addition, I am interested in learning farming the old fashioned way, no tractors, only occasional use of animals, like horses and mules or donkeys, and how to care for them ( esp for horses). How to store food, how to make ham, etc, how to collect ice from the lakes , etc .Please feel free to send all pertinent information, you come across. I am afraid, that people lost these essential skills, the mankind honed for 1000s of years, in a very short 70 year period on petroleum dope.
Oops, forgot to insert a quote in my earlier post. My earlier post was in response to this one from Twiggy
Quote:
Originally Posted by twiggy
God I know! I just found that out yesterday! No reason for it what so ever but greed. It's just a shame! That's one this about Maine I've noticed, a lot of people seem to care about each other there. I guess they have to stick together with those winters..
I pay about 500.00 a month for elec.. in Phoenix AZ from May to Oct. for cooling the house. I'm trying to see if I moved to ME how different the cost would be. I would be building and have a different kind of house planned. A main narrow common house with 4 small cottages behind connected with a walk way. Thinking now maybe a wood stove in each unit. Maybe a wind turb or something. Building 1/2 of it myself so any suggestions would be fine. Have 3 kids, 2 of which are teens and a sterdy granny who wants to live off the land. lol Scares me a little. he he But this house plan makes it easier to build. Found some buildable land on Boothbay. Anyone familiar with that area? Any construction workers on here or has anyone built themselves or some anyway? What would you suggest for heating if you were starting from scratch? Each cottage will be small, one room a toilet and a sink. Main house would be kitchen and gathering room. Sep bath cottage. Am I crazy? he he Please give you opinions. Would love to live as much off grid as poss.. but money is an issue. Thanks Oh, house plan is such that I can build myself, no second story, no great spans. Thanks
"But HOW does one plan for a 300% increase in one's oil bill in less that four years?"
I do not know how.
"No one could have expected it or planned for it"
I agree. Though we have all known that the price of oil has been climbing for decades.
"I am happy for persons who are unaffected by such an increase -- or whose income can just absorb it. I just don't know any."
I think that everyone everywhere is effected in some manner. This is not localized to Maine.
Everyone in our culture is being effected.[/quote]
I have difficulty believing, that none of you guys learned in school, that oil is a finite resource, produced by extreme climate on Earth millions of years ago ( extreme heat, melting of the glaciers on both Poles, stagnation of the ocean, rotting matter all over the planet, resulting in 4 times more carbon in the atmosphere, as we have now, acid rains)
I estimate, that some of you are at least 50-60 years old, so don't you remember energy crisis of the 70th? When the government rationed the quantity of gas one can purchase? I knew for many years, that oil supplies will peak at the beginning of 21 century and from then on, supplies will be dwindling... I won't be surprised, that oil will cost 20$ a gallon. It is a market economy in action! Simply put it: there is no more oil exist, they can charge whatever they want.
Petroleum is very valuable in use for high tech, medicine, chemistry, research, where you only need small amounts, it is irreplaceable. However, we are, as barbarians use this precious resource to burn in our car, when we go grocery shopping or heat our cardboard houses.
It is , what it is: so called "American" lifestyle we are so proud of, when average family lives in 3000sq ft (poorly build from plywood, often not insulated, unlike most of Europe, which built from stone, brick, the walls of their apartment buildings is 3 ft deep) with over sized wasteful furnaces, has at least 2-3 cars in the garage has done more damage for the whole mankind, than any wars...We propagated this un-sustainable (in the absence of cheap energy) lifestyle by means of Hollywood movies, TV, mass media all over the world. Now China and India jump on this band wagon, spellbound by great American Dream/ Myth. Before, having a bike in China, made them rich in their country, now they want, what Americans still have for now: big wasteful houses, big wasteful cars(with a lot of bills to pay, they do not show it in the movies though...)
This explains, why we shamelessly, under false pretenses, in Iraq: we are fighting for us- to get our hands on that oil, to extend for few more years our lifestyle here in the US. What are our alternatives?
I am thinking, that our government should tell American people the truth and mobilize the great ingenuity of our people in finding more efficient, frugal sustainable ways of life, while we still have some time to change our ways less painfully. I have read, that scientists know now, that Earth has limited amount of total energy, they say , that even solar energy is not sustainable- as one has to produce those solar panels with the help, of course, OIL!!! We need to use our brain power to solve this dilemma of energy, instead of wasting more resources, while fighting for it!
What one can do right now? Save! Reduce waste, turn off that light, that TV, do not stare into your fridge, deciding, what you want for a snack, plant that tree or two or three- it is still the most efficient energy factory, changing the energy of the Sun into food and wood for heat production. Educate yourself! Educate your children! They are the ones, who have to deal with this mess we are going to leave them!
Say no to bio-fuel craziness, it is even worst disaster waiting to happened- loss of soil fertility, we must take care of the soil, that is where nutrients come from, it takes 500 years to build 1 inch of black soil, that is where food come from for all of us. Black soil can take in and tie up (sequester) the carbon, which makes our climate warmer! It is absolutely essential, do not repeat our nearsightedness with soil, as we did with oil! During 200 years, after first pioneers came on virgin American soil, we lost already 30% of soil fertility. Don't tell 50 years later, that you did not know!
There are inventions patented already. For example, one uses boron for fuel cell for cars, prototype build by GM, I believe, may be Ford- I will double check for you, if you are interested. A car can drive 300 miles without re-charge, waste product- water, and guess, who has the largest in the world boron deposits?- USA!!! There was electric cars build in the 70th, they were destroyed after 2 year running on the roads, I think 63 were sold out to public, some of them still running. There are solutions already, we need political will power to say no to Corporate Oil and their Oil lobby! Why do we need lobby? Who lobby for American taxpayers?
Ask your great-grandparents, what their life was like? They were happy and enjoyed life. I am sure, they had their share of difficulties, but we have ours now as well, in our 3000 sq ft houses and "lazy", isolated, often depressed, overwhelmed with all kinds of bills lifestyle.
Let us go back to our roots: you can't eat 2 bowls of soup in one seating and you won't wear 2 pairs of pants at the same time: stop chasing that dollar, don't be greedy, downsize, simplify. I did, and I am happier now. My gas bill last winter was around 29-30 $ a month- cooking and old gas water heater ( I plan on replacing this one soon). My climate a bit milder, than North Maine, I burned 2,5 cords of wood for my 1500 ft house( I am looking for a smaller one). I wore sweaters in the house and kept the house at 50 at night. I used heat as electricity: when we are not home is at 50 during a day to keep pipes from freezing. When we come home, we turn heat on, I have high efficiency gas furnace, which warms the house in 30 min (lukewarm ) I use thick light blankets, when we watch TV or surf Internet for warmth. We use a space heater for 15 min to add heat in the bathroom in the morning, before taking shower. We use an electric blanket for 30 min to warm up our beds before going to bed, turn them off when go to bed, after that it is warm under goose down comforter at night at 50. I, technically, do not need to do that, but it is much nicer to jump in a warm bed. By the way, it is ok to use this regimen for children, even small ones, their immune system will be healthier. Just start acclimating them slowly, starting in fall, do not put too much clothes on them... In Germany once, I saw a mother in a fur coat on a chilly day, but her 5 y o child was very lightly dressed, no hat, short, denim jacket with no lining... When asked, she said, that it is acceptable for children to be dressed like that, according to child's doctor, they are healthier this way! I for one, used to like 80 degrees in the house in winter, look, what I have done! It is MY decision to be frugal with heat, you can find yours!
I want to end on a positive note, we can do it!
Here's one for you. The earth is bathed in the same electromagnetic plasma energy that powers the sun. Want proof ? That's how lightning is generated and the auroras. Nicola Tesla knew how to tap in to that low voltage high amperage pool of electricity over 100 years ago. There is more than enough energy surrounding this planet to power it forever for nothing. We just have to tap it....it really IS that simple and that available.
I have difficulty believing, that none of you guys learned in school, that oil is a finite resource, produced by extreme climate on Earth millions of years ago ( extreme heat, melting of the glaciers on both Poles, stagnation of the ocean, rotting matter all over the planet, resulting in 4 times more carbon in the atmosphere, as we have now, acid rains)
I estimate, that some of you are at least 50-60 years old, so don't you remember energy crisis of the 70th? When the government rationed the quantity of gas one can purchase? I knew for many years, that oil supplies will peak at the beginning of 21 century and from then on, supplies will be dwindling... I won't be surprised, that oil will cost 20$ a gallon. It is a market economy in action! Simply put it: there is no more oil exist, they can charge whatever they want.
Petroleum is very valuable in use for high tech, medicine, chemistry, research, where you only need small amounts, it is irreplaceable. However, we are, as barbarians use this precious resource to burn in our car, when we go grocery shopping or heat our cardboard houses.
It is , what it is: so called "American" lifestyle we are so proud of, when average family lives in 3000sq ft (poorly build from plywood, often not insulated, unlike most of Europe, which built from stone, brick, the walls of their apartment buildings is 3 ft deep) with over sized wasteful furnaces, has at least 2-3 cars in the garage has done more damage for the whole mankind, than any wars...We propagated this un-sustainable (in the absence of cheap energy) lifestyle by means of Hollywood movies, TV, mass media all over the world. Now China and India jump on this band wagon, spellbound by great American Dream/ Myth. Before, having a bike in China, made them rich in their country, now they want, what Americans still have for now: big wasteful houses, big wasteful cars(with a lot of bills to pay, they do not show it in the movies though...)
This explains, why we shamelessly, under false pretenses, in Iraq: we are fighting for us- to get our hands on that oil, to extend for few more years our lifestyle here in the US. What are our alternatives?
I am thinking, that our government should tell American people the truth and mobilize the great ingenuity of our people in finding more efficient, frugal sustainable ways of life, while we still have some time to change our ways less painfully. I have read, that scientists know now, that Earth has limited amount of total energy, they say , that even solar energy is not sustainable- as one has to produce those solar panels with the help, of course, OIL!!! We need to use our brain power to solve this dilemma of energy, instead of wasting more resources, while fighting for it!
What one can do right now? Save! Reduce waste, turn off that light, that TV, do not stare into your fridge, deciding, what you want for a snack, plant that tree or two or three- it is still the most efficient energy factory, changing the energy of the Sun into food and wood for heat production. Educate yourself! Educate your children! They are the ones, who have to deal with this mess we are going to leave them!
Say no to bio-fuel craziness, it is even worst disaster waiting to happened- loss of soil fertility, we must take care of the soil, that is where nutrients come from, it takes 500 years to build 1 inch of black soil, that is where food come from for all of us. Black soil can take in and tie up (sequester) the carbon, which makes our climate warmer! It is absolutely essential, do not repeat our nearsightedness with soil, as we did with oil! During 200 years, after first pioneers came on virgin American soil, we lost already 30% of soil fertility. Don't tell 50 years later, that you did not know!
There are inventions patented already. For example, one uses boron for fuel cell for cars, prototype build by GM, I believe, may be Ford- I will double check for you, if you are interested. A car can drive 300 miles without re-charge, waste product- water, and guess, who has the largest in the world boron deposits?- USA!!! There was electric cars build in the 70th, they were destroyed after 2 year running on the roads, I think 63 were sold out to public, some of them still running. There are solutions already, we need political will power to say no to Corporate Oil and their Oil lobby! Why do we need lobby? Who lobby for American taxpayers?
Ask your great-grandparents, what their life was like? They were happy and enjoyed life. I am sure, they had their share of difficulties, but we have ours now as well, in our 3000 sq ft houses and "lazy", isolated, often depressed, overwhelmed with all kinds of bills lifestyle.
Let us go back to our roots: you can't eat 2 bowls of soup in one seating and you won't wear 2 pairs of pants at the same time: stop chasing that dollar, don't be greedy, downsize, simplify. I did, and I am happier now. My gas bill last winter was around 29-30 $ a month- cooking and old gas water heater ( I plan on replacing this one soon). My climate a bit milder, than North Maine, I burned 2,5 cords of wood for my 1500 ft house( I am looking for a smaller one). I wore sweaters in the house and kept the house at 50 at night. I used heat as electricity: when we are not home is at 50 during a day to keep pipes from freezing. When we come home, we turn heat on, I have high efficiency gas furnace, which warms the house in 30 min (lukewarm ) I use thick light blankets, when we watch TV or surf Internet for warmth. We use a space heater for 15 min to add heat in the bathroom in the morning, before taking shower. We use an electric blanket for 30 min to warm up our beds before going to bed, turn them off when go to bed, after that it is warm under goose down comforter at night at 50. I, technically, do not need to do that, but it is much nicer to jump in a warm bed. By the way, it is ok to use this regimen for children, even small ones, their immune system will be healthier. Just start acclimating them slowly, starting in fall, do not put too much clothes on them... In Germany once, I saw a mother in a fur coat on a chilly day, but her 5 y o child was very lightly dressed, no hat, short, denim jacket with no lining... When asked, she said, that it is acceptable for children to be dressed like that, according to child's doctor, they are healthier this way! I for one, used to like 80 degrees in the house in winter, look, what I have done! It is MY decision to be frugal with heat, you can find yours!
I want to end on a positive note, we can do it!
Now I'm worried...... That was quite a first post. Welcome, I think.
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Off the grid
Now I'm worried......
