Domtar - Woodland (Portland, Washington: loan, retired, money)

[Maine Writer]

Unions could stand to get rid of paying for work not done. If someone is called in for a five minute job they're paid for hours of work. I can see some travel time and the time worked. Paying for three hours that aren't being worked is unreasonable.

[retiredtinbender]

I would have to agree that unions thwarted us. But don't discount other things like OSHA. And there are more that my caffeine low brain can't come up with at the moment. There are more gov't regs on how workers are to be taken care of, babysat, and paid. Lawsuits against business for a quick payoff by reutable (sarcasm injected) ambulance chasers. All these agencies, grouops, etc were good to a point. But after a while they seem to take on more and more and redefine and refigure and come down from the mount with more rules and regfulations. Costs go up to pay for it all. Then someone sees that they can do it cheaper and without all the bull squeeze in Monteray. Then they figure out rolling brown-outs and look to China, India, Pakistan. Throw in the computer world wide web, paperless society and this world economy, and mills close. IMHO. Boy, I kinda over-simplified that! For y next lesson....

[cmperry]

Originally Posted by Maine Writer

Unions could stand to get rid of paying for work not done. If someone is called in for a five minute job they're paid for hours of work. I can see some travel time and the time worked. Paying for three hours that aren't being worked is unreasonable.

Again this is a provision that is signed by both parties during negotiation. The reason this specific article exists was so the company can get employees to come in on their scheduled day off if the need arises. In my experience the 5 minute job is mostly folklore..most generally your kept 4 hours minumum

[Maine Writer]

Originally Posted by cmperry

Again this is a provision that is signed by both parties during negotiation. The reason this specific article exists was so the company can get employees to come in on their scheduled day off if the need arises. In my experience the 5 minute job is mostly folklore..most generally your kept 4 hours minumum

The main gate calls the house on nights and weekends for those five minute jobs. It's not folklore, it's fact at our house.

[cmperry]

that may be true...but I've never been called by the main gate in 15 yrs (foreman calls,this may indicate we're familiar with different mills)). I've also seen very,very few 5 minute call-ins. Maybe more prevalent in the trades,other mills, not sure.

[cmperry]

maybe this is an example of unions being more of a cost at different locations. I think every mill has its own factors that contribute to its success or failure,unions may play a bigger part in that in one mill and not so much in another.

[maine4.us]

I am afraid that the influence of big unions is on the decline. I was a union president at one time, and I became so disgusted with the whole process that I am not a union member anymore. Until I retire in Maine, I work in a "right to work" state. Therefore unions do not have the clout they do in other places. The biggest threat a union has is a strike. Think about it, when can you remember the last major strike that ended in the Taft-Hartley act being used? It is unimaginable that GM workers would go on a strike today. That would be the nail in the coffin. Unions made great strides for American workers, and I support them. The rest of the world doesn't see it that way, especially the 3rd world, communist or developing nations. Unions have made the American lifestyle what it is today. In the future, with the much detested "global economy", they may put American workers at a disadvantage. Toyota makes autos in the US in non-union factories, yet they charge the same for their autos as those produced in union shops. Walmart will close stores rather than allow unions.
The unions just might be the cause of their own demise.

[cmperry]

Originally Posted by maine4.us

I am afraid that the influence of big unions is on the decline. I was a union president at one time, and I became so disgusted with the whole process that I am not a union member anymore. Until I retire in Maine, I work in a "right to work" state. Therefore unions do not have the clout they do in other places. The biggest threat a union has is a strike. Think about it, when can you remember the last major strike that ended in the Taft-Hartley act being used? It is unimaginable that GM workers would go on a strike today. That would be the nail in the coffin. Unions made great strides for American workers, and I support them. The rest of the world doesn't see it that way, especially the 3rd world, communist or developing nations. Unions have made the American lifestyle what it is today. In the future, with the much detested "global economy", they may put American workers at a disadvantage. Toyota makes autos in the US in non-union factories, yet they charge the same for their autos as those produced in union shops. Walmart will close stores rather than allow unions.
The unions just might be the cause of their own demise.

As a former union president you must worry about the future rights of unrepresented workers....I hope??

[cebdark]

Originally Posted by retiredtinbender

I would have to agree that unions thwarted us. But don't discount other things like OSHA. And there are more that my caffeine low brain can't come up with at the moment. There are more gov't regs on how workers are to be taken care of, babysat, and paid. Lawsuits against business for a quick payoff by reutable (sarcasm injected) ambulance chasers. All these agencies, grouops, etc were good to a point. But after a while they seem to take on more and more and redefine and refigure and come down from the mount with more rules and regfulations. Costs go up to pay for it all. Then someone sees that they can do it cheaper and without all the bull squeeze in Monteray. Then they figure out rolling brown-outs and look to China, India, Pakistan. Throw in the computer world wide web, paperless society and this world economy, and mills close. IMHO. Boy, I kinda over-simplified that! For y next lesson....

Well personally, I think you ran that lesson pretty well! Worker's Compensation would be another biggie. My father used to hire on full crews when he ran a job, but toward the end of his career (which officially ended 1 year before he died in 1997) he found himself having to do more sub-contracting because of the costs.

[RHB]

Where I work, we are trying to bring the union in (NAGE). As one of my history teachers used to say "absolute power corrupts absolutly" and that's what is happening where I work. Like anything else, there is good and bad aspects to everything.

Still praying the close down is a short temporary.