Maryland a NORTHEASTERN state (Baltimore, Rockville: deal, distance, population)

[Infinite_heights77]

Jews are still white in my classification, so the white population in Baltimore City is definitely higher if you add up the 2 percentages you provided below.

I've said this before and I'll say it again: being a Democrat in Maryland isn't anything like being a Democrat in NYC or San Francisco. MD is a Democrat state not because its native population is overly liberal, but because its most populated areas are full of federal workers. Also, one huge Democrat constituency is the Black American, of which Maryland has a lot of.

*Interesting comment! So, basically, Maryland is actually a Red State/Conservative that has been masquerading as a Blue State in Blackface?

Originally Posted by EddieOlSkool

Well, there unfortunately aren't hard and fast numbers for this. You can deduce it from looking at Bmore's voting in 2012, though.

The city as a whole is 28% White (including Jews which are 11% of the population). Bmore went for Romney at 11%, which isn't much but when you consider that the city is mostly Black and barely White (and if you leave Jews out who are mostly Democrats), it shows that the city's Romney support, while very low, isn't out of the norm for how Whites voted elsewhere. It pretty much shows a non-Jewish White population of about 17%.

Contrast this with Pittsburgh and you have a 5 to 1 ratio in favor or Democrats in a city that is mostly White (even excluding Jews), and you have a support for Obama much higher.

This is of course, assuming everyone votes, and of course we know that isn't possible, but it also shows that if we take a city that is barely White and still had SOME Republican votes vs. a city that is mostly White and barely had any Republican votes, you can see how Bmore and Pittsburgh's White populations may not see eye to eye politically. Is there a guarantee of this? No. But when you show me that Pgh is very White and barely Republican whereas Bmore is barely either, it starts to show a different picture, unless we assume no Blacks voted in Bmore.

I've said this before and I'll say it again: being a Democrat in Maryland isn't anything like being a Democrat in NYC or San Francisco. MD is a Democrat state not because its native population is overly liberal, but because its most populated areas are full of federal workers. Also, one huge Democrat constituency is the Black American, of which Maryland has a lot of.

In Maryland, Germans make up the largest White ethnic group. If you look at county level data, the more German a county is, the more Republican. And while cities are always going to be more liberal (I never disputed that), some will be just more than others. Comparing ratio of White to Republican in Bmore vs. Pgh shows that Bmore isn't as liberal when it comes to Whites.

[U146]

Originally Posted by EddieOlSkool

Have you ever heard of the Midland? Just because something is Southern, doesn't mean the default status is Northern.

Bmore isn't fully Southern nor Northern, which is why it's smack dab in the middle (well technically it's slightly in the lower half of the country).

And if we go by the entire state of Maryland, calling it Northern certainly isn't accurate. The Eastern Shore? Not Northern. Western MD? Appalachian. Southern Maryland? Those Tidewater speaking folk, HA. Really, central MD is the area that can be called Northern-ish, but only if you think being Northern means being "not Southern". Really, a ton of transplants makes not a place Northern, it makes it diverse and varied with a unique culture not belonging to one region. If we consider the most populated areas of Maryland along I95 and 270, then MD is diverse, varied, and has no culture belonging strictly to one region. Maryland is so varied in that corridor that calling it simply "Northern" limits how full of different culture it actually is.

Western Maryland is in the same league as Southern Pennsylvania. It is most certainly not Southern and much more Northern. As far as Baltimore goes, it is more Northern than it is Southern. The state of Maryland as a whole is about 1/3 Southern, 2/3 Northeastern. You can debate it all you want but I was just in DC and Baltimore no way in hell was it Southern at all culturally or linguistically. Also outside of DC and Baltimore the state is mostly of German ancestry much like Pennsylvania. Think what you want, it's really pathetic that you're still here trying to convince the masses of Maryland's Southernness.

[ialmostforgot]

West is most difficult to categorize as "northern" or "southern". Take the accent of Frank Nethken, a former Cumberland mayor. Is that accent southern?

[ialmostforgot]

Originally Posted by U146

Western Maryland is in the same league as Southern Pennsylvania. It is most certainly not Southern and much more Northern. As far as Baltimore goes, it is more Northern than it is Southern. The state of Maryland as a whole is about 1/3 Southern, 2/3 Northeastern. You can debate it all you want but I was just in DC and Baltimore no way in hell was it Southern at all culturally or linguistically. Also outside of DC and Baltimore the state is mostly of German ancestry much like Pennsylvania. Think what you want, it's really pathetic that you're still here trying to convince the masses of Maryland's Southernness.

You are StLouisan and have no knowledge of this east-of-the-Mississippi state. Don't expect your maps to get very far.

How can the city whose residents went to make sure their new neighbors were also southern be a northern city?

“When I moved to Bolton Hill from Cincinnati in 1951, there was a thick Southern accent here,” says Shivers, the 80-year-old local historian, who still lives there. “It had its own culture and you had to get used to it. The main reason to meet people was to find out where they came from. They were very interested in one’s background and if there was any Southern heritage to it. If you measured up, you were fine.”

[ialmostforgot]

"Also outside of DC and Baltimore the state is mostly of German ancestry much like Pennsylvania"

If by "German" you mean "Black" and "English", sure. North of DC and Baltimore are the more German areas. Remember that Germans also formed a part of Southerners' ancestry. Montgomery country is a German-ancestry place (not sure if it always was--now there are mostly transplants in the area) and in the '70s it had a southern accent.

[ialmostforgot]

Originally Posted by EddieOlSkool

Philly is Mid Atlantic because you can see remnants of the South. New York is not because there is nothing Southern about it whatsoever. Not the accent, not the culture, not the mannerisms, nothing.

Neither NY State or NYC are a transition point whatsoever. It's either Great Lakes, West New England, or pure NYC.

Remember that the middle colonies became the middle states, which became the Mid-Atlantic states. It was between New England and the South, not the North and the South.

[ialmostforgot]

Originally Posted by bryan macdonald517

Of course Maryland is now and always has been a northeastern state. Geographically Baltimore is closer to Toronto , Canada than to say Columbia, SC. Cold temperatures, ice, and snow every winter. A blue state politically. Union state during the civil war. Maryland did have African slaves but so did New York, Pennsylvania, Massachusetts, and new Jersey. I don't consider new york the south either.

It's closer to Canada than the gulf South because Canada has a "tongue" that sticks as far south as Pennsylvania.

It has ice every winter like VA, KY and TN.

It's snow totals are around 15-18" on the Western Shore outside of Baltimore and the high altitudes of the Western part of the state. Much of the Eastern Shore, like tidewater VA, receives less than a foot of snow.

Most whites are Republican except for DC workers.

It tried to secede, but was held under martial law so that DC was not surrounded by the confederate states.

It had many thousands of slaves and did not abolish before the Civil War like New York did. Just before the Civil War, New Jersey had 18 slaves.

It was not always a northeastern state. That happened in the '70s or '80s.

[ialmostforgot]

^Didn't realize that that account only had one post.

[EddieOlSkool]

Originally Posted by andrew_s

Depending on where youre at in Florida that might not be the south, but if your in cracker country then comparing deep south to upper south is once again like comparing apples to oranges. I love how people use the deep south as a barometer of southerness. Sure its what most people associate being southern with, but son there are many sub cultures throughout the south and while there are strong similarities there are also strong differences.

The Carolinas arent anything like Lousianna so I guess they arent southern anymore either....

After experiencing Louisville, KY, I have come to this conclusion:

Louisville is the Baltimore of the Midwest. Because it is hotly debated as whether it is Northern or Southern, it has a Southerny/not so Southern dialect, it has the exact same climate, it has a lot of the same White ethnic populations (Italians, Jews), and many people there get offended if you call them Southern. Interestingly enough, while it has a higher population than Baltimore, it is rarely debated much on these forums, and that's probably because on a national scale, it gets very little recognition.

[U146]

Originally Posted by ialmostforgot

You are StLouisan and have no knowledge of this east-of-the-Mississippi state. Don't expect your maps to get very far.

How can the city whose residents went to make sure their new neighbors were also southern be a northern city?

“When I moved to Bolton Hill from Cincinnati in 1951, there was a thick Southern accent here,” says Shivers, the 80-year-old local historian, who still lives there. “It had its own culture and you had to get used to it. The main reason to meet people was to find out where they came from. They were very interested in one’s background and if there was any Southern heritage to it. If you measured up, you were fine.”

Really, I have no knowledge at all? I've been all over the Eastern United States and I've been to MAryland several times. It was never Southern any of those times. You think you've won haven't you? You seem to think only a local knows the truth. I've been there enough times to draw my own conclusions and FYI you are the minority of people living there that considers it Southern.