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Old 08-26-2009, 10:44 AM
 
Location: Cumberland
5,271 posts, read 8,509,061 times
Reputation: 3718

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Cpterp, overall I think you make a good point, but I find a pretty specific fallacy in your argument. When you compare Maryland to other Southern States, you cherry pick one or two out and make the comparison. So what if :

Maryland isn't like South Carolina or Mississippi (two you used recently)
The coal fields of Southern WV aren't like South Carolina or Mississippi.
The bayou of Cajun country isn't like SC or MS
The suburbs of Atlanta aren't like SC or MS
NYC isn't like SC or MS
London isn't like SC or MS

See what I mean. The comparison you make when extended out to its logical conclusion fails to have any descriptive value at all if used to determine "Southerness."

The Southern region is large, diverse, and contains many different people, from different places, with different customs, economics, demographics, etc. Their are commonalities, but not enough to find even one place that is the "model South" to use for comparison.

What then? How do we proceed? Well most social geographers look at a variety of cultural traits and historical patterns. But most of all they look at self-identity. In that respect, It doesn't matter if 900,000 Montgomery County transplants agree that Maryland feels like New Jersey. The minority of our citizens that make up a majority of large rural parts of our state self identify as Southernerns and can trace their cultural identity and history back to the founding of our country. Might a time come when these people are completely overwhelmed and this identity is lost? Perhaps, but we are not there yet. And until that happens parts of Maryland deserve at least gruding acceptance as Southern.

 
Old 08-26-2009, 11:19 AM
 
2,955 posts, read 3,684,394 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by westsideboy View Post


What then? How do we proceed? Well most social geographers look at a variety of cultural traits and historical patterns. But most of all they look at self-identity. In that respect, It doesn't matter if 900,000 Montgomery County transplants agree that Maryland feels like New Jersey. The minority of our citizens that make up a majority of large rural parts of our state self identify as Southernerns and can trace their cultural identity and history back to the founding of our country. Might a time come when these people are completely overwhelmed and this identity is lost? Perhaps, but we are not there yet. And until that happens parts of Maryland deserve at least gruding acceptance as Southern.
Interesting thought (to me). Somewhere along the way I read a theory holding that today's descendants of Marylanders whose families came to the US before the American Revolution generally thought of themselves as being Southern, whereas today's descendants of Marylanders whose families came to the US after the revolution typically thought of themselves as being Northern. This gets a little vague, however, because we all have lots of ancestors if we trace back that far, some of whom may have come before the Revolution and some after.

I was born in Baltimore, but have lived in North Carolina for the last forty years by choice. My Maryland family always thought of itself as being very much Southern. I fit right in, culturally, the day I arrived in Raleigh. I must also add that I have very fond memories of Baltimore, growing up . . .
 
Old 08-26-2009, 12:38 PM
 
Location: Cumberland
5,271 posts, read 8,509,061 times
Reputation: 3718
I think the other poster's descripition of Western Maryland as belonging in the Appalachian region is accurate. We share the geography, demographics, relative isolation, economics, and self-identity with our mountain neighbors.

The Appalachian Regional Commission groups Western Maryland, SW PA, northern WV, and SE Ohio as Northern Appalachia, as opposed to the regions of Central and Southern Appalachia (just a note - all three of these regions contains parts of states often referred to as the Southern USA.) Northern Appalachia has historically had a stronger industrial sector, more small cities and towns, and more "white ethnics" that immigrated in the late 19th and early 20th century than the other Appalachian regions.
 
Old 08-26-2009, 02:50 PM
 
542 posts, read 1,326,849 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by westsideboy View Post
I think the other poster's descripition of Western Maryland as belonging in the Appalachian region is accurate. We share the geography, demographics, relative isolation, economics, and self-identity with our mountain neighbors.

The Appalachian Regional Commission groups Western Maryland, SW PA, northern WV, and SE Ohio as Northern Appalachia, as opposed to the regions of Central and Southern Appalachia (just a note - all three of these regions contains parts of states often referred to as the Southern USA.) Northern Appalachia has historically had a stronger industrial sector, more small cities and towns, and more "white ethnics" that immigrated in the late 19th and early 20th century than the other Appalachian regions.
Thanks. I took a look at the map at the website for a further look. What I've also found interesting is that people in the South tend to say "Ah-pah-lah-chun", and people in the North tend to say "Ah-puh-lay-chun". Don't know if that holds true, but I remember hearing the difference between my travels, and graduating from a college in Southern Appalachia.
 
Old 08-26-2009, 03:19 PM
 
40 posts, read 128,193 times
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To me, Maryland is very much the mid-atlantic. I lived in a number of states growing up before settling in the Eastern Panhandle of WV, just outside Hagerstown. I lived in the area through college. For the past two and a half years, I've lived in Biloxi, MS. I'm now looking to relocate to the Waldorf area. I can't imagine anywhere in Maryland feeling like Biloxi. The mid-atlantic may be a hodgepodge of cultures, etc., but for me, whenever I'm in the Eastern Panhandle of WV or Maryland, Virginia, Pennsylvania or DC, the culture is very similar. The region just has a different feel and pace than Mississippi, although I like both areas of the country.
 
Old 08-26-2009, 05:05 PM
 
Location: Cumberland
5,271 posts, read 8,509,061 times
Reputation: 3718
I have always heard that the rough line between the Appa"latch"a pronuniation and the Appa"laysh"a pronuniation is the New river. This line is also roughly the border between the Midland and Southern dialect. In Western Maryland and the surrounding region it is definitely Appa"laysh"a.
 
Old 08-31-2009, 01:31 PM
 
542 posts, read 1,326,849 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tercel95 View Post
Southern MD is typically referred to as Charles, Calvert, and St. Mary's counties... If you go to SOMDonline it caters to those counties...
Yea but wouldn't you say AA & particularly PG have the Southern Maryland look & feel?

Quote:
Originally Posted by cpterp View Post
Fairfax Cty doesn't even look like the Piedmont.
I question where you get your observations from. Fairfax is definitely part of the Piedmont.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cpterp View Post
My parents are from NY and CT and they moved here partly because of the commonalities of those states.
Well that just about sums it all up, does it not? Non-natives who know nothing about the state than what appears on the surface.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cpterp View Post
I've lived in PG County, and it in no way seemed "Southern" to me.
Again, I question your observation. Do some traveling in PG and some research.


Quote:
Originally Posted by cpterp View Post
Talke your pick: Tennesse, Virginia (not just NoVa), North Carolina. Maryland resembles New Jersey, Delaware, and Pennsylvania more than those states.
How? It has resemblances to all those states, really. From that list, Maryland is a combination of Virginia(to suggest otherwise is laughable) & Delaware, with some Pennsylvania & Carolina thrown in. Baltimore can remind you of either Philadelphia, Wilmington, or Richmond -- or even all three. Heck, I'm from Memphis, and Baltimore shares some resemblances to Memphis. I don't know why you're so hellbent on trying to "prove" Maryland is completely Northeast, when it isn't. Oh wait, your parents are from New York and Connecticut.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cpterp View Post
I read somewhere that originally the accent was identical to Philly's, but apparently during WW1 or WW2 migrant workers from North Carolina, altered it slightly with Southern hints.
Was that "somewhere" Wikipedia? On the page about the Baltimore accent somewhere, maybe? Nevermind the fact about that statement being bogus -- Wikipedia's only correct when it supports your opinion, right?
 
Old 08-31-2009, 01:55 PM
 
Location: Warner Robins, GA
919 posts, read 2,338,379 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KeyserSoze View Post
Yea but wouldn't you say AA & particularly PG have the Southern Maryland look & feel?
I think AA county has more of a northern "colonial" feel... I do not think PG county as a whole has a southern feel at all... There are rough ghetto looking areas, more urban built up areas, and then some pretty stereotypical suburbs... PG is much more like a direct suburb of DC...

There was this 1 place off of route 4 in Upper Marlboro that I used to go cat fishing at, I guess you could consider that southern...
 
Old 08-31-2009, 04:35 PM
 
542 posts, read 1,326,849 times
Reputation: 354
Quote:
Originally Posted by tercel95 View Post
I think AA county has more of a northern "colonial" feel... I do not think PG county as a whole has a southern feel at all... There are rough ghetto looking areas, more urban built up areas, and then some pretty stereotypical suburbs... PG is much more like a direct suburb of DC...

There was this 1 place off of route 4 in Upper Marlboro that I used to go cat fishing at, I guess you could consider that southern...
Maybe I have different experiences or a different perspective, but PG seems Southern to me no matter where I went. It looks & feels like the Lowland South. I've even found Southern accents there, even though they're generally mild.

As for Anne Arundel, what gives off the colonial Northern feel to you? I The colonial stuff there points in the Southern direction. To me it has a mix of a "Maryland"/Mid-Atlantic/Lowland Southern feel.
 
Old 08-31-2009, 04:47 PM
 
Location: Warner Robins, GA
919 posts, read 2,338,379 times
Reputation: 446
Quote:
Originally Posted by KeyserSoze View Post
Maybe I have different experiences or a different perspective, but PG seems Southern to me no matter where I went. It looks & feels like the Lowland South. I've even found Southern accents there, even though they're generally mild.

As for Anne Arundel, what gives off the colonial Northern feel to you? I The colonial stuff there points in the Southern direction. To me it has a mix of a "Maryland"/Mid-Atlantic/Lowland Southern feel.
Where are you at in PG county that seems southern? Its got much more of an urban feel to it... In Calvert you can see old tobacco barns from the road and crops growing... In Calvert in St. Mary's there is just much more of a water oriented and live off the land mentality... Nothing about Riverdale, Bowie, Hyattsville, Palmer Park or Temple Hills screams south to me...
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