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Old 08-06-2009, 10:32 AM
 
Location: Warner Robins, GA
919 posts, read 2,337,333 times
Reputation: 446

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Quote:
Originally Posted by MadManofBethesda View Post
Huh???

Someone is going to have to explain that reference to me.

Aside from the fact that I am unfamiliar with 10oz bottles/cans of beer.....

What would make a 10oz Bud Light southern?
They are only available in a few select regions... One of which is Southern MD... Majority of the population in SOMD drinks them over any other beer... They taste better than the 12oz can for some reason... If you are ever in SOMD buy a 12 pack...

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/s...toryId=5336207

Last edited by tercel95; 08-06-2009 at 10:45 AM..

 
Old 08-07-2009, 12:20 AM
 
Location: Germantown, MD
1,359 posts, read 3,357,289 times
Reputation: 569
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephen 81 View Post
Obama did well in Charles County because it is a heavily African-American county. There are probably dozens, if not more than a hundred, heavily African-American counties from Mississippi to Virginia where Obama did equally well. So Obama's high vote percentage doesn't make a county less Southern.

If the South is defined as poor, Protestant, slow-growing and Republican, then no, Southern Maryland isn't the South.
I agree that the black population heavily influenced the vote, but remember they only make up 35% of the county. Mississippi has the largest proportion of African-Americans of all the states, yet was one of Obama's worst states. Also, Kent County (80% white) on the Eastern Shore voted for Obama (albeit barely).


Quote:
If the South is defined as poor, Protestant, slow-growing and Republican, then no, Southern Maryland isn't the South. But then neither are Louisiana, Atlanta, or Raleigh.
Those are generally the characteristics shared by many Southern states (in rural areas anyways). However, Virginia, Florida, and North Carolina would be exceptions to "slow-growing." I don't think Atlanta or Raleigh are really comparable to Southern MD since they are cities.
 
Old 08-07-2009, 07:55 AM
 
23 posts, read 77,618 times
Reputation: 22
I think it depends on where you're from. Me and my wife are from PA and NY and MD feels like "Southern lite" to us, not as much Southern as Virginia on south, but still Southern in many ways. I bet folks from NC think of MD as more Northern. I call it the DMZ, a mix of both. It's Northern enough where I can live here but not Northern as I would like it to be.
 
Old 08-07-2009, 10:01 AM
 
Location: Cumberland
5,269 posts, read 8,501,227 times
Reputation: 3713
Cpterp, I hope what we are realizing is that the South is not a monolythic region. Any trait you try to apply to prove or disprove "Southerness" is not going to correctly identify the entire region.

The South is not Catholic? Try telling that to Louisiana, an undisputed part of the South with a long storied Catholic heritage.

The South is rural and slow growing? Not around Atlanta, Raleigh, Charlotte, Nashville, Dallas, Houston, etc. This includes both cities proper and rural/suburban areas around them that are growing (much like Southern Maryland's relationship with D.C.)

The South votes heavily Republican? Check out a county level map of the election and you will see lots of blue counties spread throughout the South. Not to mention a boatload of red ones in the North.

The long and short of is you can't cherry pick out one trait to prove or disprove a region's identity, reality is more complex than that.

In the end I am sure nothing anybody says, or any amount of data is going to change your mind, but you have to accept that Southern traits are present in Maryland. If it makes you uncomfortable admitting that parts of Maryland belong in the Southern region, fine, but I don't think you are going to get much further trying to argue it away.
 
Old 08-07-2009, 11:55 AM
 
Location: Germantown, MD
1,359 posts, read 3,357,289 times
Reputation: 569
Quote:
Originally Posted by westsideboy View Post
Cpterp, I hope what we are realizing is that the South is not a monolythic region. Any trait you try to apply to prove or disprove "Southerness" is not going to correctly identify the entire region.

The South is not Catholic? Try telling that to Louisiana, an undisputed part of the South with a long storied Catholic heritage.

The South is rural and slow growing? Not around Atlanta, Raleigh, Charlotte, Nashville, Dallas, Houston, etc. This includes both cities proper and rural/suburban areas around them that are growing (much like Southern Maryland's relationship with D.C.)

The South votes heavily Republican? Check out a county level map of the election and you will see lots of blue counties spread throughout the South. Not to mention a boatload of red ones in the North.

The long and short of is you can't cherry pick out one trait to prove or disprove a region's identity, reality is more complex than that.

In the end I am sure nothing anybody says, or any amount of data is going to change your mind, but you have to accept that Southern traits are present in Maryland. If it makes you uncomfortable admitting that parts of Maryland belong in the Southern region, fine, but I don't think you are going to get much further trying to argue it away.

In my opinion every single city and state is unique. For example New York is not the same as Boston, Baltimore isn't the same as Philadelphia, and Mississppi isn't the same as Alabama, but there are certain common characteristics that unite certain regions, and I would think that you would agree. If you noticed in my post I used the words "most" and "many," not "all." I know Lousiana is not Catholic, and Atlanta and Charlotte doesn't have "slow-growth" (as I mentioned in my post). Frankly, I don't deal in absolutes. However, the South does vote heavily Republican, at the very least in most presidential races.

I also never said that none of Maryland was "Southern." My original premise was that Maryland as a whole was heavily dominated by "Northerness." I wouldn't disagree with anyone who told me that Maryland was mostly "Southern" 200 years ago, particularly around the time of the Missouri Compromise. I agree that the lower Eastern Shore does have Southern characteristics, but Southern Maryland (particularly Charles and Calvert) have lost most of the "Southerness" that they had before (as I posted previously before the tobacco buyouts and the gambling industry shutdown).

I actually appreciate listening to others opinions on the topic. I feel disagreements (which power 90% of the threads on this site) are a good thing, and are a way for people to educate each other. I'm not an "expert" on anything, and I have definitely learned more about my state (and other places) since I first participated on this site. I also really have an appreciation for statistics, especially after having interned with the CB.
 
Old 08-07-2009, 12:55 PM
 
Location: Dudes in brown flip-flops
660 posts, read 1,534,478 times
Reputation: 345
Quote:
Originally Posted by cpterp View Post
I also never said that none of Maryland was "Southern." My original premise was that Maryland as a whole was heavily dominated by "Northerness." I wouldn't disagree with anyone who told me that Maryland was mostly "Southern" 200 years ago, particularly around the time of the Missouri Compromise. I agree that the lower Eastern Shore does have Southern characteristics, but Southern Maryland (particularly Charles and Calvert) have lost most of the "Southerness" that they had before (as I posted previously before the tobacco buyouts and the gambling industry shutdown).
I agree with you that Southern Maryland has been losing its historical "Southernness" over the last decade or two. In my mind, though, it's not really becoming Northern so much as just losing its cultural identity. When I think of the Northeast (focusing solely on white people, obviously there is a rich history of people of color in this area as well), I think of Germans in rural areas (at least in PA and the MD Piedmont) and Greeks/Italians/Jews/Poles/Irish in the suburbs and cities.

Demographically, in terms of ethnic and racial background (large numbers of African Americans and whites of English heritage) and growth rates (high), I feel like Charles County has a lot more in common with the Atlanta exurbs than anything in New Jersey, despite New Jersey being significantly closer. Charles County is less Southern than the Atlanta exurbs, you are right, but I think if you showed people Waldorf and asked "Does this look like you are 30 miles from Atlanta or 30 miles from Boston", people would say Atlanta.

Of course, I am from Northern Virginia, so what do I know
 
Old 08-08-2009, 03:12 PM
 
Location: Maryland
96 posts, read 93,874 times
Reputation: 34
TO ANSWER the POST!

Yes they do , if you are in Charles, Calvert and definetly St.Marys counties in Maryland you are in the south,........at least they think so!
 
Old 08-08-2009, 06:41 PM
 
13 posts, read 41,221 times
Reputation: 12
Can't we all just get along

The only thing I wish to add is "Since when is slow growing a bad thing?" Personally I prefer the wide opens spaces of country living than the rushed and hectic 'get out of my way or I'll run you over attitude' of the urban and suburban areas. We all need food to live and I prefer mine grown on the farm and not some lab so I am all for areas growing slow. There is barely enough farms left to feed us as it is. I also find people more genuine and friendly. Again these are my experiences ... your mileage may vary
 
Old 08-08-2009, 08:05 PM
 
Location: Germantown, MD
1,359 posts, read 3,357,289 times
Reputation: 569
Quote:
Originally Posted by cygnus-x1 View Post
Can't we all just get along

The only thing I wish to add is "Since when is slow growing a bad thing?" Personally I prefer the wide opens spaces of country living than the rushed and hectic 'get out of my way or I'll run you over attitude' of the urban and suburban areas. We all need food to live and I prefer mine grown on the farm and not some lab so I am all for areas growing slow. There is barely enough farms left to feed us as it is. I also find people more genuine and friendly. Again these are my experiences ... your mileage may vary
I agree rural areas (which don't neccesarily have to be Southern) have friendlier people and a slower paced way of life, instead of the rude dod-eat-dog world of urban areas.

Trust me, "smart growth" is a good thing, and Maryland isn't totally oblivious to its rapidly declining number of farms. For instance in Montgomery County the government is very protective of its farmland. I read about one landowner who couldn't tear down an old building on his property since it used to be a homestead and the county decided to declare it "historical," but when the county does things like this people rant on about how "socialist" the county and state are. MoCo is also taking new iniatives to restrict sprawl (which almost extends to the Frederick county border now), and focus on developing dense, transit-oriented communities (basically more Bethesdas and Silver Springs). Also, just this week Governor O'Malley was in Prince George's County trying to help protect owners of the county's small horse farms from developers by extending incentives to them.

"There is barely enough farms left to feed us as it is."

Haha that's what Thomas Malthus thought, but technology proved him wrong. Trust me, there's no shortage of farmland in this country. Maybe in Maryland there is, but the Midwest has more than enough for the growing NEC.
 
Old 08-09-2009, 03:19 AM
 
2,331 posts, read 3,913,507 times
Reputation: 362
Quote:
Originally Posted by cpterp View Post
I agree rural areas (which don't neccesarily have to be Southern) have friendlier people and a slower paced way of life, instead of the rude dod-eat-dog world of urban areas.

Trust me, "smart growth" is a good thing, and Maryland isn't totally oblivious to its rapidly declining number of farms. For instance in Montgomery County the government is very protective of its farmland. I read about one landowner who couldn't tear down an old building on his property since it used to be a homestead and the county decided to declare it "historical," but when the county does things like this people rant on about how "socialist" the county and state are. MoCo is also taking new iniatives to restrict sprawl (which almost extends to the Frederick county border now), and focus on developing dense, transit-oriented communities (basically more Bethesdas and Silver Springs). Also, just this week Governor O'Malley was in Prince George's County trying to help protect owners of the county's small horse farms from developers by extending incentives to them.

"There is barely enough farms left to feed us as it is."

Haha that's what Thomas Malthus thought, but technology proved him wrong. Trust me, there's no shortage of farmland in this country. Maybe in Maryland there is, but the Midwest has more than enough for the growing NEC.
Whatever you say.

I strongly believe Smart Growth is a Joke for Suburban Maryland. What has become of Smart Growth; Deduction of Business Growth and Economic Wealth in Montgomery and PG County, Deduction of Middle and Upper Class Population. The End Results are more People and Businesses Choosing Virginia instead of Maryland because in reality Nothern Virginia(or any other Major Upscale US Metropolitan Regions) is not practicing this so-called Smart Growth aka Anti-Growth Scheme like the Special Interest So-Called Enviromental Groups and Lousy Politicians are trying to pull the wools overs the eyes of Maryland Voters and Taxpayers.
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