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I agree with most of the pros and cons, although some apply to Boston and the OP asked about the state.
Pro: The Boston area due to its combination of great universities and their offshoots (tech firms, biotech firms, to a lesser extent finance firms, management and policy consulting firms) has the highest percentage of interesting people per capita of any city I have visited (I travel a lot). But that is Boston area (or maybe even Cambridge area) and some of the western suburbs, not the whole state. Maybe the Amherst area is also pretty strong regard, but certainly not Pittsfield, Gardner or North Adams.
The cost of living is very high in the greater Boston area as has been pointed out, but is it also unusually expensive in the Pioneer Valley, for example?
The Berkshires are lovely and with Tanglewood, Jacobs Pillow, Kripalu and offshoots, there is a lot of culture for a rural-ish area. However, the area is probably relatively expensive because of all the NY and Boston money.
Higher education CON: UMass Amherst is another school that shows up on my professional student resume. I went there in the '90's, so it's possible that some things have changed, but during my stint there, I found the university to be poorly managed, with far too many employees (not all of them, but too many) fitting the stereotype of the lazy state employee who wants a paycheck for no work. Way too many employees seemed to have a truly atrocious attitude toward students, treating students with open hostility as they seemed to view students as a nuisance because all those students wanting this and that in the way of competent providing of even basic services meant that the lazy employees might actually have to occasionally lift a finger and do a little work.
Agreed. I worked there for a while in the 80s just before I got my master's and I was in a stupid office job. We were treated like idiots. It came right down from the top--too many highly paid do-nothings at the top and a lot of lowly, bitter drudges who took their resentments out on the students. Lots of wasteful spending--and people knew it but no one did anything.Very poor management.That's a shame because it was once a great university. It's known as a party school too and not much is ever done about it. It is a CON for MA.
Fast-forwarding to the modern day: The "Zoo-Mass" party reputation fizzled out a lot in the last decade as the school raised its admission standards and bulldozed frat row. It's still a large place, and the remaining frats still breed some of the proud coke-heads of capitalism's future, but having done my undergrad and master's degree there I have seen it change a lot! In some ways for the better - like new state of the art buildings and replacing some of the terrible old ones. The honors college has improved and expanded, and incoming students seem to have a higher average IQ, generally above that of a guinea pig, which didnt used to be the case. Students seem to have more pride in the place, whereas it used to be the ultimate fall-back school, talked about in shamed tones, while whining about how "Amherst is a cow-town" (can't wait to go home to Billerica this weekend!), reflecting that metro Boston geographic ignorance and provincialism Con I mentioned in my previous post, and about the schools they couldn't afford or didn't get into.
In reality, it has never been that bad academically, but you get out what you put into it! One unique feature that looks good on the transcript - with the Five College Consortium, UMass students can take classes at Amherst, Hampshire, Mt Holyoke, or Smith Colleges at no extra charge! Also, in the last ten years, tuition and fees have pretty much doubled since I was an undergrad there. It's still economical vs private schools but $20,000/year is certainly not chump change to most middle/lower middle class families.
Also, I totally agree with you on the mis-managed administrative departments. At UMass, you are nothing but a number to the admin machine, and the unhappy worker drones aren't exactly excited to help you navigate the hurdles. That has not changed one bit since the 80s!
It is a shame the school isn't better respected. Over the years I've concluded it's due to several factors - a culture in MA that deifies private institutions and makes their kid think they are "failures" if they "settle" for UMass: legislators who all come from private institutions as their alma mater, and so don't see the value in funding public higher ed, and so grievously underfund and cut the budgets (shameful cuts- for awhile uber-wealthy MA ranked 48th in public higher Ed funding, one of only a few states to CUT their budget, we were behind Alabama); it's a small state and all those kids who say they're "from Boston" (when asked, the answer is usually Hingham or something), who were trained to hate themselves for "settling" for UMass, hate the "cow-town" of Amherst, have no pride in the school, and since it's such a small state can easily go home every single flippin weekend to solidify their metro Boston provincialism (CON) and hang with their high school friends forever. It makes UMass a pale shadow of a flagship campus compared to the pride you see at state universities that are properly respected and funded (e.g. U of Michigan; the CA system; UNC / Chapel Hill, among many others) by their students and their state citizens and legislators. Educational quality at UMass is high, but the school has wrongly been treated as an albatross for so long that it will take awhile to raise its profile!
i am often surprised at the number of students paying out of state tuition to attend UMass. anyway my kids attended it and graduated with no debt because we were able to pay for it because it was affordable. and they moved on to NYC for grad school and jobs. it served them well, very well.
...compared to the pride you see at state universities that are properly respected and funded (e.g. U of Michigan; the CA system; UNC / Chapel Hill, among many others)
Apropos of "proper funding" I was surprised to learn how little public funding U of Michigan gets! Very prestigious, yes, and attractive to out-of-state students. The out-of-state tuition is a big revenue source to the flagship campus, also--I guess--alumni donations (as with any private univ or college.) But the state funding was something like 8% of the budget of the Ann Arbor campus.
Social Security payments received, as well as Veterans Administration disability compensation, are not taxable in Massachusetts.
and
Income from most private pensions or annuity plans is taxable in Massachusetts. However, the following is a list of some specific pensions that are exempt:
Pension income received from a contributory annuity, pension, endowment or retirement fund of the U.S. Government or the Commonwealth of Massachusetts and its political subdivisions.
Pensions from other states or their political subdivisions that do not tax such income from Massachusetts or its political subdivisions may be eligible to be deducted from Massachusetts taxable income.
Massachusetts was on our short list of states we were looking at when we retired, and one of the reasons was that Massachusetts doesn't tax federal pensions. Both my wife and I are federal retirees.
Pros: the colleges, the beaches, Boston on the whole, great food, great weather, Halloween, town centers, the music (Cambridge & Boston, BSO, Tanglewood, Tweeter Center), dives and bars, art, scenery
Cons: class and racial segregation, impoverished areas, Route 1 from the North Shore down through to RI, Route 9, Boston Redevelopment Authority, fear of places further than an hour away
Pros: the colleges, the beaches, Boston on the whole, great food, great weather, Halloween, town centers, the music (Cambridge & Boston, BSO, Tanglewood, Tweeter Center), dives and bars, art, scenery
Cons: class and racial segregation, impoverished areas, Route 1 from the North Shore down through to RI, Route 9, Boston Redevelopment Authority, fear of places further than an hour away
Boston Redevelopment Authority? Are you thinking of its historical overreaches--Government Center & West End, etc.? In recent years BRA seems like any other arm of government, some wins, some losses, but hardly something to list as a statewide 'con'.
Also question the 'Route 9' listing. I love route 9 between Worcester and Williamsburg. The eastern part, the "Worcester Turnpike", is admittedly traffic clogged although, to me, always an instructive example of the power of local zoning to either encourage strip development, as in Natick and Framingham, forbid it, as in Wellesley, or allow at certain nodes, as in Brookline and Newton. Also as an example of early '30s highway engineering that, for some reason, has never been updated in a comprehensive way. Same bridges, entrances, exits, traffic signals, narrow lanes (for Model A Fords, I guess.)
Boston Redevelopment Authority? Are you thinking of its historical overreaches--Government Center & West End, etc.? In recent years BRA seems like any other arm of government, some wins, some losses, but hardly something to list as a statewide 'con'.
Also question the 'Route 9' listing. I love route 9 between Worcester and Williamsburg. The eastern part, the "Worcester Turnpike", is admittedly traffic clogged although, to me, always an instructive example of the power of local zoning to either encourage strip development, as in Natick and Framingham, forbid it, as in Wellesley, or allow at certain nodes, as in Brookline and Newton. Also as an example of early '30s highway engineering that, for some reason, has never been updated in a comprehensive way. Same bridges, entrances, exits, traffic signals, narrow lanes (for Model A Fords, I guess.)
BRA one is half-joke, half-literal. I think a lot of long time Boston residents like my family hold a certain ire towards them, and the way urban "renewal" has happened in the city has sometimes left a sour taste in peoples mouths.
I've never been west of Worcester except on my way to Keene, NH (so I'm my own Con haha), so I wouldn't know. I just personally don't care for Route 1 or Route 9, the traffic, the malls, the strip malls, the mini malls, the car dealerships. It stresses me out, they sort of rip through towns, and can be an eye sore. But of course you make all valid points as to in their history. And of course you could say the roads and construction can sometimes be a con. 95 from 93 to the Mass Pike has been under construction, literally, since I was born.
This reminds me a bit of a few misconceptions some have of western mass.
1) There's a huge difference between the pioneer valley and berkshire county. Anything near I91 is the Pioneer Valley. Factor in that rivers were the highways of the country before cars were made things did develop there
2) The most report areas of Mass are not in western Mass but actually around the 2/2A area from the Erving State Park to Fitchberg. I ended up taking 2 back instead of I90 and it was pretty apparent. Actually that whole circle of 2, 202 and 190 can be pretty remote. When the Quabbin was created it destroyed a number of towns and actually divided the state to a point.
On the side I agree with CB. I knew a few that for some reason could not get residency which boggles my mind. Instate is fine but no one that is a full time student should be denied in state tuition.
By the way although this can be away around the tolls to a point it really isn't worth it. I could have shaved an hour off my trip by taking the pike back.
This reminds me a bit of a few misconceptions some have of western mass.
1) There's a huge difference between the pioneer valley and berkshire county. Anything near I91 is the Pioneer Valley. Factor in that rivers were the highways of the country before cars were made things did develop there
2) The most report areas of Mass are not in western Mass but actually around the 2/2A area from the Erving State Park to Fitchberg. I ended up taking 2 back instead of I90 and it was pretty apparent. Actually that whole circle of 2, 202 and 190 can be pretty remote. When the Quabbin was created it destroyed a number of towns and actually divided the state to a point.
The Boston Globe often confuddles the Pioneer Valley and the Berkshires. The Pioneer Valley is defined by the Connecticut River, which, being New England's longest and largest river, is at least a somewhat distinct geographic feature that anyone who has ever paid attention to a map of New England has probably noticed. Case in point, the Globe's recent, and otherwise well portrayed series on small-town heroin abuse, http://http://www.bostonglobe.com/li...jUP/story.htmlwhich describes Turners Falls as "nestled in the Berkshire foothills," without a mention of the fact it is located DIRECTLY ON the Connecticut River. Face/Palm
One successful business that seems to have intentionally capitalized their very moniker on this confusion is Berkshire Brewing Companyhttp://http://www.berkshirebrewingcompany.com/ , located on the Connecticut River valley floor in South Deerfield (a good 30 miles east of the Berkshire County line), smack dab in the middle of the Pioneer Valley. Good for them, but I bet it gives people in the actual Berkshires a chuckle (or a groan!).
mdovell not sure what you are saying about the Rt 2 corridor ("report" = "rural" or "remote" ?). There are many rural towns around there, but I'd add it really doesn't begin to seriously get remote that way until west of Gardner, a quite substantially large town for the area, which quite arguably is actually the farthest western edge of the metro Boston commuter belt in north central MA, past which most normal people are unwilling to drive that far. It is where town populations begin to seriously drop off as you head west. Fitchburg-Leominster-Gardner is a substantial population center with over 200,000 people, at the western reach of the Boston metro. West to The North Quabbin region is a patchwork of rural plus the quite densely developed towns of Athol and Orange but it doesn't compare in remoteness to the Hilltowns west of the Connecticut River (Hilltowns are arguably the Berkshires geologically, but you're still not there yet- certainly not culturally or going by the county lines!), which are inarguably the most rural part of the state. Also yes The Quabbin definitely divides the state in a weird way that's for sure!
To put the matter to rest for good, every Massahole knows the Berkshires start just past 495! Next time you end up in Ayer or Westborough or Leominster or something, just ask around at the local dive - hey guys what's it like living in the Eastern Berkshires? It's crazy how faaah ya live from Baaaston! I could nevah live this country banjo life!
Last edited by FCMA; 08-18-2013 at 07:15 AM..
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