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Old 03-03-2014, 05:02 PM
 
Location: North of Boston
559 posts, read 745,746 times
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I am several towns away (used to live in Saugus...thank god we left) but still closer than I'd like. I wish it was a regional vote. A Casino effects more than one city/town however one town is able to make that choice for its neighbors.
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Old 03-03-2014, 05:36 PM
 
Location: Massachusetts
6,301 posts, read 9,585,524 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shizim View Post
I am several towns away (used to live in Saugus...thank god we left) but still closer than I'd like. I wish it was a regional vote. A Casino effects more than one city/town however one town is able to make that choice for its neighbors.
Agreed, for a state that is supposedly economically healthy, it seems to truly be grabbing at straws.

The entire area along the Blue line including neighboring Lynn has so much potential to become a nice affordable area for people working in the city. I hope this gets overturned somehow.
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Old 03-03-2014, 07:34 PM
 
7,912 posts, read 7,740,728 times
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Originally Posted by n1ey View Post
Save your nonsense. You sound and look like a troll. Now, you are trying to protect your self-image.

Derby Street is a stone's throw from Route 3, which is the major highway and connects directly to 93. You can see the on-ramp from the Mall entrance.

The ZBA was consulted for variances after the plan was developed. It was crafted against the plans of the town. Did you actually read the article?

Bill

You trying to infer as if the town ignored everything which I take it you must be a resident. Again within the context of what I illustrated what exactly would you have preferred? I can show you various areas of development across Mass and new england as a whole.

You want pedestrian friendly right? Ok show me a design you like. If one does not exist by all means draft one up yourself with a cad program.

If it was indeed drafted against the plans "of the town" then kindly show us all where that is illustrated. Was there legit opposition to this as there was with the commuter rail or was this said in hushed tones?

I think it is great for people to be involved in government but the basics is that they have to show up. I cannot even begin to express as to how many projects are worked on that directly matter to people and they would rather watch television or do something else rather then be directly informed.

Where I live we debated the use of a community center and solicited opinions about what should be done with respect to making a new one. out of 17,000 people in town it was two others in addition to myself that arrived.

So by all means if you feel that this was so wrong then why weren't there lawsuits and injunctions etc.

While RT 3 obviously connects to 93 that by no means creates traffic in Hingham. If you want traffic look at Rt 95 or Rt 93 once it gets to the Braintree split. I've taken both for months. At no point did I see it back up to Hingham at least during the morning commute. Evening a tad.
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Old 03-03-2014, 07:57 PM
 
7,912 posts, read 7,740,728 times
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" Settling in an cheaper area with a very small economy, when compared with Boston, essentially just eliminates most of your career opportunity. What is gained? Perhaps access to some cheap college style housing that you can afford on your retail salary. Less traffic. Less population density. However, the cost in prospects makes such a move a mistake that could have inter-generational consequences, in my eyes."

Not really. Not by a long shot. The competition for employment in Mass (especially the 128 belt) is extremely high. Companies operate nearly anywhere in the country and anywhere in the world. The idea of place being a factor is shrinking (see Cluetrain Manifesto, why Quicken Loans moved to Detroit over Brazil, why Nuclea moved to Pittsfield from Cambridge etc)

I personally know people that have left Mass to find work. Now they have experience and that experience stands out vs someone without it. Regardless of how long it stands out vs someone that is say unemployed.

Food IS cheaper. How do I know that? I have to travel for work. It costs much less to go out to eat down south then up here. Closer access to food means less fuel costs. If you think fuel costs don't add up just ask yourself why does everything in Alaska cost more? Because it has to be shipped there to more remote areas.

Houston isn't a bad place by any means. Dallas on the other hand....

"I could speak to any one of the cities that I mentioned, but I'll specifically refer to Boston from here on out. The Boston Metro area has one of the best, most stable economies of any large city in the most prosperous country in the world. My point is that it is rare to be located in a better region for work opportunity than Boston, unless you scale up to NYC or San Francisco. The Bay region, however, is ranked as less economically stable than is the Boston area although it has a larger output the last time that I checked. The disparity is likely due to the fact that the Bay Area economy is less diverse than is Boston's."

The Boston economy is not nearly as stable as you might think. Why did the green computing center be made in Holyoke rather than Cambridge? Because the electrical costs were half and the cost per square foot was much less. There is a significant divide between eastern and western mass. So much is concentrated on the east that it just cost too much to operate and eventually we'll see more just hope on the mass pike for 90 minutes to a place that costs half as much.

"Many other cities, that seem good on paper or upon other types of superficial inspection, lack diverse economies or are not as economically vibrant as people generally perceive and they tend to be hit hard during recessions or will be hit hard when the one or two industries evolve that are practically propping up the entire job market."

But we do have two industries propping up the job market here. Healthcare and education. Take away the institutions of higher ed and health care and what does Boston really have left other than a great sports scene?

"There is also the strategy of moving to where no one wants to move to work (Alaska, Asia for instance) to command higher pay. I've been down that road, and have settled on burning most of my thirties in poverty in an expensive northeast city to put myself through professional school. It was a sacrifice but I'm happy that this is the path that I chose. I'd rather spend the time now then have no real options in my 40's and 50's, or be an economic exile."

To a point I think there's too many people that get lax and act like education ends or that somehow everything is movie.

On the other side though those with a higher education are more likely to move and Boston is clear evidence of that. What specific percentage of students actually stay? I do not believe that many. If they all stayed then Boston would have a much higher population probably going into the millions. Also consider who specifically is going to want to retire to a high cost area? If you can afford somewhere else then they'll go, if they cannot afford it they'll still go. I'm not saying they'll all take a b line to Florida but other areas have made strides to court retirees, Boston is without question not one of them. Weather, lack of sidewalks, lack of public lighting and high cost of living compound and make it this way.
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Old 03-03-2014, 10:33 PM
 
Location: Massachusetts
6,301 posts, read 9,585,524 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mdovell View Post
I think it is great for people to be involved in government but the basics is that they have to show up. I cannot even begin to express as to how many projects are worked on that directly matter to people and they would rather watch television or do something else rather then be directly informed.

Where I live we debated the use of a community center and solicited opinions about what should be done with respect to making a new one. out of 17,000 people in town it was two others in addition to myself that arrived.
It is sad, so little citizen involvement in town government in every town.
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Old 03-04-2014, 08:53 PM
 
7,912 posts, read 7,740,728 times
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At the same point I should also point out that much of it is issue based. Schools get a broad base of support and I was at a town meeting that overwhelmingly approved a budget. Open town meeting is voting so people show up more. But an actual meeting without a direct vote is far fewer. Also is that it is hard to say specifically how many watch meeting online or on television. As far as from what I can tell I don't think citizens can call in a vote for an open town meeting. Selectman maybe in emergencies but that depends on the town.
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Old 03-05-2014, 09:04 PM
 
Location: New York
23 posts, read 47,289 times
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The town that hosts a casino will get tax revenue, it's up to the town to invest that money wisely.
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Old 03-06-2014, 06:23 AM
 
Location: North of Boston
559 posts, read 745,746 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by analyzerlx View Post
The town that hosts a casino will get tax revenue, it's up to the town to invest that money wisely.
yes but they are paying the money because there is obviously a negative impact. I rather they keep thier money and stay in CT.
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Old 03-06-2014, 07:43 PM
 
7,912 posts, read 7,740,728 times
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Casinos are an odd argument. Technically we already have gambling in the state on horses, bingo hauls, scratch tickets and the lottery. This is one of those issues where someone has to be allowed to fail in order to prove them wrong.

I don't think it will work but at the same time I know the argument will continue until the end of time until one is built. Knowing this allow it. Watch it fail and then say "I told you so".


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kRW7pITY5Cg
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Old 03-08-2014, 11:09 PM
 
2,145 posts, read 5,051,343 times
Reputation: 1666
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Originally Posted by mdovell View Post
"I also don't get the nanny state comments. How does that reflect itself? I've lived in a few States: MA, VT, WI, CA, IN, and KY. The most conservative states (IN and KY) had by far the worst environments (very poor environmental regulations and enforcement) and job prospects, and not surprisingly, are less desirable places to live (so very cheap to live in) for the vast majority of people. I'm guessing these might be considered states that are less nanny-ish, though I'm not sure what is meant by the term, but if so, that doesn't seem to be a positive."

Indianapolis has nearly a million people which is easily more than any city in New England. There's not much of a connection between desirable places and the cost of living.

In California they have Prop 13 which caps property taxes as they can only rise when a property is sold. So under theory you can have two properties back to back of the same physical entity but if someone moved in during 1985 and someone moved in last year you could see someone spending hundreds vs thousands. That's inequity and outright wrong as it rewards those that moved in "first".


In Mass there is a similar one of prop 2 1/2 that caps the raise at 2.5% or they go to a override by public vote. Again that limits what a local government can raise and therefore restricts public spending. These aren't exactly "blue" areas as you might describe. So what happens if you cannot raise taxes? Well you raise the assessment rate. So a $240k house in 1995 becomes $300k in 2000, $350 in 2005, $425 in 2009, $520 in 2012. Assessment has nothing to do with actual real value in Mass. Housing prices are artificially inflated.


As for environment I'm sure you might know that there's no laws in VT that demand that a house has to have a flushing toilet! It also has a total lack of gun laws and the majority of it's population is located in Burlington which requires hours to drive to. It's a great area but they restrict growth in order to keep the balance that way. Let's not also forget that superfund sites are in every state in the country. Hallimore in Holbrook Mass had purple grass growing! There was a oil spill in buzzards bay back a decade ago. I worked for one of the largest environmental service companies in the country and saw plenty of evidence of pollution in many of the states you mentioned.

Let's not also forget in VT most of the state is making about $12/hr. It's a great state to visit but unless you live in northern VT there's really not much for work at all. Why can't there be three to four other places like Burlington?

Nannyish? Totally. In Mass you cannot do plumbing work in walls, ceilings and floors. For decades retailers could not open up on sundays, alcohol sales were often the same way.

Keep in mind what also adds to the cost of living is having less of a tax base. Unions don't pay taxes, colleges/universities don't pay taxes, non profits don't pay taxes. Not that any of these are wrong but the massive concentration of them in eastern mass puts pressures on local governments to raise taxes on everyone else. When Harvard and MIT expand it creates issues in Cambridge, when Brown expands in Providence it creates issues as well. PILOT (payment in lieu of taxes) programs exist but it still isn't enough.

The middle class in New England works where exactly? How many professional jobs without degrees are expanding? It seems the growth is really on the polar ends.
Well, it is very destabilizing to a region (economically, socially, environmentally, etc) to have long time residents or natives unable to continue to live in their homes-forced to sell b/c property taxes increased beyond their mortgage payments in some cases. I live in CA now and also lived in MT when natives had to do exactly this.

Also, what some consider 'nanny', others consider 'advocacy'. I think, as is so often the case, that the truth is 'somewhere in the middle'. What you claim is the result of lack of tax base, are also factors that attract people to the state, support economic stability and investment and provide infrastructure and amenities [non profits/museums/universities do have endowments that provide resources to the wider community, plus the obvious investment in the economy from students].

MA may require a permit or permission for everything; at the same time, that level of scrutiny also provides a solid and reliable infrastructure and advocacy opportunity for nearly every citizen. I'm pretty sure every citizen enjoys its infrastructure-things you rely on in your day to day life that you don't even realize. And you might just find yourself needing that advocacy sometime, too!

Also, some states that don't sell alcohol on sundays are said to be conservative/religious/bible belt; while in MA it is attributed to 'nanny state'. I believe, however, that it was a holdover from religious practice. 17th century puritanical, to be exact. So, which is it? Nanny state or religious? Or is that too confusing, b/c being a blue state is supposed to preclude religious/conservative 'behaviors'?
Also, you'd be surprised at the list of countries with current blue laws in effect-Denmark, Norway, etc. For alcohol and/or retail:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_law#United_States

Last edited by lrmsd; 03-08-2014 at 11:18 PM..
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