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I think you should keep Concord on your list. Concord Center is anything but the sticks. The center is very walkable with Helen's for breakfast, Trails End Cafe for a late farm to table dinner, Emerson Umbrella for art events, historic library, its own train stop and much more. One drawback, your budget may be a bit low for the location.
I do still have Concord on the list, and I am VERY happy to see a recommendation for it. I'm glad to hear the downtown is good, and I will investigate those places you mention.
I see from other posts, I've definitely struck a nerve with schools in Arlington. It is very helpful to see everyone's thoughts on that.
As far as 'investment," yes the house is a major investment for us, but my hope and plan is to live in the house for many, many years. I feel pretty good from what I've heard about Lexington, in terms of housing stability and it seems like if I get a house that needs some work, like a kitchen reno or even a possible addition, that those things would be very justifiable as there's almost no way to improve a house so much that you top out the value and reach a point where you get no return on the investment. (Which would be a possibility in my current house.)
I know you love to show this table and do often, but I do have a few issues with you pulling out the "non-low income group" students whenever you wish to demonstrate the great performance of the Somerville School district.
First, you are excluding huge amounts of kids from the Somerville school system when you make this claim. Looking at the DOE website, the number of "financially disavadvantaged" kids in each school is the following:
Argenzio - 30.4%
Healy - 47.8%
Brown - 15.7%
E. Somerville Community - 41.2%
W. Somerville - 37.3%
Winter Hill - 44.4%
JFK - 31.2%
So what is the point of making comparisons if you are going to pull out 40% of the kids in a school from the analysis?
Also, looking at the lists, it looks like Benjamin Brown performs the best in the Somerville district - but it is the richest school in the district so what are you proving? It only has 15.7% of "economically disadvantaged kids" - compared to 35.5% in the district, and only 13.6% First Language not English students, compared to 50.3% in the district. Benjamin Brown is 71% white (compared to 36% of in the district and has only 12.5% Spanish population (compared to 42.3% in the Somerville school district). It is following the lines that most schools do - richer and whiter and more English speaking perform better. As for some of the other schools on the other end of spectrum - the ones that are poorer and less English speaking- you are excluding a huge proportion of their population by focusing on "non-low income" kids when there is a huge amount of them present - and even with the exclusions, those schools are still not doing particularly well - they didn't even make it onto your table. So I am not sure what you are trying to prove other than you should move into the area of Somerville that would allow your kids to go to Benjamin Brown (which I am assuming is a more expensive area of town).
I know you love to show this table and do often, but I do have a few issues with you pulling out the "non-low income group" students whenever you wish to demonstrate the great performance of the Somerville School district.
First, you are excluding huge amounts of kids from the Somerville school system when you make this claim. Looking at the DOE website, the number of "financially disavadvantaged" kids in each school is the following:
Argenzio - 30.4%
Healy - 47.8%
Brown - 15.7%
E. Somerville Community - 41.2%
W. Somerville - 37.3%
Winter Hill - 44.4%
JFK - 31.2%
So what is the point of making comparisons if you are going to pull out 40% of the kids in a school from the analysis?
Also, looking at the lists, it looks like Benjamin Brown performs the best in the Somerville district - but it is the richest school in the district so what are you proving? It only has 15.7% of "economically disadvantaged kids" - compared to 35.5% in the district, and only 13.6% First Language not English students, compared to 50.3% in the district. Benjamin Brown is 71% white (compared to 36% of in the district and has only 12.5% Spanish population (compared to 42.3% in the Somerville school district). It is following the lines that most schools do - richer and whiter and more English speaking perform better. As for some of the other schools on the other end of spectrum - the ones that are poorer and less English speaking- you are excluding a huge proportion of their population by focusing on "non-low income" kids when there is a huge amount of them present - and even with the exclusions, those schools are still not doing particularly well - they didn't even make it onto your table. So I am not sure what you are trying to prove other than you should move into the area of Somerville that would allow your kids to go to Benjamin Brown (which I am assuming is a more expensive area of town).
You are correct, that is exactly why I usually select the Brown and Kennedy (JFK) (or G&P in Cambridge) when making comparisons - they are better comparisons to the suburbs. The Kennedy's younger classes are 75% non-low income.
As for "what is the point of making comparisons if you are going to pull out 40% of the kids" - that IS my point - when you compare kids in Arlington to kids in Somerville from the same socio-economic status (SES), it levels the playing field when you look at scores this way. My point is - quite a few urban school are as good as the better suburban schools, but sites like schooldigger and greatschools do them a disservice by ranking them across the board with complete disregard for their diverse mix.
Personally if I could do away with standardized tests I would do it is a second. But since the data is there, may as well use it to demonstrate what is really correlates to - and that is SES.
For the record - I did not bring up Somerville in this thread - 2 others did
But that makes no sense. Only 8.1% of Arlington's students are economically disadvantaged versus 35.5% of Somerville. So you are pulling out a ton of Somerville kids versus Arlington kids from the analysis when you are making these comparisons. In reality, if you send your kid to Winter Hill, where 44% of the kids are poor - your child will not have the same experience then if you sent your kid to a school in Arlington. And yes, JFK is doing a good job for the number of low income students they are teaching- but you can cherry pick a number of schools in generally poor performing school districts who are doing better. Like the Elliott Elementary School in Charlestown - it does a great job despite the fact that 25% of the kids are "economically disadvantaged" - but would you go around saying people should send their kids to the Boston schools over Arlington Schools, because Elliott does better than some of the Arlington elementary schools? No.
So much misinformation in this post. Arlington is hyped on these boards for good reason. Yes it has a convenient location, but that's not the main reason house prices have skyrocketed there. The main reason is all of the grade schools have been rebuilt recently & the performance of those schools have been outstanding. The Brackett & Dallin schools are some of the best schools in the state. Arlington now has better overall school ratings than Brookline, Winchester & Newton North high school. That's what is driving young families to town.
As for not spending 700k to 900k in Arlington & insinuating that's not a good investment, well, you're off-base. These numbers you gave are fast becoming the average price, not high end any longer. New construction in Arlington runs well over 1.2 million dollars & most any home in the Moringside section of town runs close to a million. Cripes...when is the last time you drove through town....past the new Whole Foods, Trader Joe's & multiple Starbucks. It's not 1988 here any longer
Arlington, like Lexington, has a housing authority & some Section 8. Arlington does not have a large welfare/ sprawling population....just utter nonsense.
Arlington is 85% white & Lexington is 75% white. Arlington is 10% Asian. Lexington is 20% Asian. Both towns are about 5% other....pretty much the same demographics. Arlington is no more or less diverse than Lexington. The only thing in your post approaching reality concerning Arlington is that it has a larger blue collar population as opposed to Lexington & it's always been that way. For good or ill that blue collar demographic is being pushed out of town at a rapid rate.
Sorry for going off topic, but that kind of misinformation was just too much I still advised the OP to look in Belmont because Arlington does not seem quite the fit for her, but I bet in 5 years, if current trends continue, Arlington will be a top 10 school system in the state.
After reading your post I still don't think I spewed any misinformation other than the part where I was misinformed low income housing. I know there are several high-rise low-income apartments in town, but I wasn't aware they were considered senior housing. When I said Arlington is more diverse, I meant economically diverse which is why I pointed out the blue collar vs white collar population. I only pointed out Lexington's ethnic makeup to hint that it has one of the highest Asian populations in the area. The elementary schools are over 30% Asian now.
I never said Arlington schools aren't good; I only said they aren't on the same level as Lexington schools. You can pick and choose elementary schools that are high performing. Here's an analysis done by another member:
Quote:
Originally Posted by 3cents
For the fun of it, I've tabulated the median house prices (single-family, at least 3 bedrooms, sold in the past 1 year), and elementary school rankings of a few towns.
Comments:
- I agree that Melrose schools are great, for that price point of $550K.
- Why isn't everyone moving to Lynnfield?? It's just $600K and look at their school rankings! Lynnfield doesn't really work for me because I work near Alewife, so commute is a potential pain.
Here are the elementary schools rankings.
I've indicated which ones are top 10% (**), and which are top 20% (*), based on 888 total schools.
I agree that a few test score points differences can result in dozens of absolute rank position differences.
Burlington elementary
Fox hill : 400
Francis Wyman : 441
Memorial : 547
Pine Glen : 408
Melrose elementary
*Lincoln : 133
*Winthrop : 134
Roosevelt : 180
Horace Mann : 288
Herbert Clark Hoover : 194th
Lynnfield elementary
**Summer street : 3
**Huckleberry : 4
I know Lexington isn't on this list, so maybe 3cents can chime in with those results too. As you can see, Arlington is all over the board because there are "good parts" and "bad parts" of town. In reality this means "wealthy" and "less wealthy". It's my opinion that I wouldn't spend $700-900k in Arlington regardless of what the median prices are there. How is an opinion considered misinformation? I'm not insinuating anything - my home is my home, not an investment as you are assuming. I'm only here to point out certain facts and let the OP decide what's important to them. I have no personal interest in either town, but you obviously live in Arlington and get offended when people point out certain facts that you don't like.
PS - FWIW the housing stock in Arlington is much older and smaller than in Lexington. The lower prices reflect that. The OP should pay attention to density if that's important to her - Lexington has mostly 20,000 sf lots whereas Arlington has 6,000 sf lots. The houses in Arlington are also much older and smaller. These are things she will have to see for herself when she comes to visit.
But that makes no sense. Only 8.1% of Arlington's students are economically disadvantaged versus 35.5% of Somerville. So you are pulling out a ton of Somerville kids versus Arlington kids from the analysis when you are making these comparisons. In reality, if you send your kid to Winter Hill, where 44% of the kids are poor - your child will not have the same experience then if you sent your kid to a school in Arlington. And yes, JFK is doing a good job for the number of low income students they are teaching- but you can cherry pick a number of schools in generally poor performing school districts who are doing better. Like the Elliott Elementary School in Charlestown - it does a great job despite the fact that 25% of the kids are "economically disadvantaged" - but would you go around saying people should send their kids to the Boston schools over Arlington Schools, because Elliott does better than some of the Arlington elementary schools? No.
I guess we can agree to disagree. I very well may say that you can send your kid to Elliot specifically and get the same education as in Arlington. I don't know the school but it's a very real possibility. To me, if you can show that your child will get a great education and still experience a diverse environment - it's the best of both worlds. I went to schools that were 25%-35% low income, but my parents, like me, were very focused on education and being involved in education, and we did quite well. So did my friends with similar families.
As for not having the same experience at Winter Hill vs Arlington - that is quite true, I visited that school and my kid's would not go there for a few reasons. But you need to define "your child would not have the same experience". I'm not only ok with diversity - but I seek it to some degree. The homogeneity of some suburbs is part of the reason I don't want to live there. Also, in our current experience there are a few kids in our classes that are disruptive and at least half of them are not low-income and could afford to live in Arlington. There are even a few bratty kids from wealthy families and I don't need more of that either.
I would look at the usual suspects. Newton, Belmont, Lexington. Take a look at Winchester too, it's got great schools and is next to Lexington. Concord is basically my ideal town but I agree with you, it would make for quite a long commute into Boston or Cambridge. I suspect your kids would do just fine in Arlington schools as well, although I understand the concern (it's more of an up and coming school district than one that has been established for decades). Of all those towns, Arlington would give you the most house for your buck though. Just a warning, some friends were telling me about a family they know looking to buy in Lexington this year with a budget similar to yours and they made 9 offers (most over asking) and still have no house. The housing market has been insane this year so I'd broaden your search instead of focusing on finding a single perfect town. You seem hesitant about moving here but from your description of what you'd like, I think you'll be happier than in semi-rural PA.
I guess we can agree to disagree. I very well may say that you can send your kid to Elliot specifically and get the same education as in Arlington. I don't know the school but it's a very real possibility. To me, if you can show that your child will get a great education and still experience a diverse environment - it's the best of both worlds. I went to schools that were 25%-35% low income, but my parents, like me, were very focused on education and being involved in education, and we did quite well. So did my friends with similar families.
That I agree with. I actually grew up in a low income environment myself in an urban public school district. I am very supportive of economic diversity too in schools and do believe you can get as good an education in some of the urban schools as the suburban ones. The problem with sending your child to a high performing elementary school in a lower income district is that sometimes the middle and high schools are not as good as they merge all the kids together - from the good and the bad schools. And it is harder to move your children into a different school district when they are older. In Boston you can hope your child gets into Boston Latin and all your problems are solved! I am not sure how the middle and high school is in Somerville.
That I agree with. I actually grew up in a low income environment myself in an urban public school district. I am very supportive of economic diversity too in schools and do believe you can get as good an education in some of the urban schools as the suburban ones. The problem with sending your child to a high performing elementary school in a lower income district is that sometimes the middle and high schools are not as good as they merge all the kids together - from the good and the bad schools. And it is harder to move your children into a different school district when they are older. In Boston you can hope your child gets into Boston Latin and all your problems are solved! I am not sure how the middle and high school is in Somerville.
This applies to many suburbs too. Some towns have 1 or 2 good elementary schools with a not-so-great high school. Some people don't plan ahead and try to move their kids in middle school with disastrous results (see this thread).
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