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I have no control over your immune system. I can't make you eat healthy food or exercise. Heart disease is the biggest killer, but yet we don't close fast food or force exercise, but for this virus, which we can't control or stop, we have to force healthy people to tiptoe around the unhealthy. This will never end, cause unhealthy people will always be at risk.
FYI, more people in the last two weeks have died from the vaccine then from the virus. I get it, its subjective but so aren't many covid deaths. I get it, don't believe it, but I know of no healthy people who have even come close to dying from this virus. But yet, I know of many who died (all older) within 2 weeks of the vaccine.
Seriously? Fast food habits or lack of exercise are contagious and can be transmitted from person to person?
And just stop the misinformation about people dying from the vaccine. It's total crap. You cannot imply causality from the VAERS database. It's such a basic flaw in logic that I can't believe people are falling for this.
This vaccine is still in experimental stage, which they don't tell people.
Anyone with elementary reading comprehension could understand prior to getting jabbed that the vaccine they were receiving was not yet FDA approved. At the Foxborough site this was stated on signage, within the info packet, and reiterated by the individual administering the vaccine.
But I understand why you might want to gloss over an individuals ability to consent when it doesn't align with your confused anti-vax narrative.
Additionally, your source of vaccine related deaths has failed to mention that VAERS is a voluntary tracking programing, meaning anyone can file a report; i.e., it's unverified. It states as much on the official VAERS website:
VAERS accepts reports of adverse events and reactions that occur following vaccination. Healthcare providers, vaccine manufacturers, and the public can submit reports to the system. While very important in monitoring vaccine safety, VAERS reports alone cannot be used to determine if a vaccine caused or contributed to an adverse event or illness. The reports may contain information that is incomplete, inaccurate, coincidental, or unverifiable. In large part, reports to VAERS are voluntary, which means they are subject to biases. This creates specific limitations on how the data can be used scientifically. Data from VAERS reports should always be interpreted with these limitations in mind.
The CDC does review this data, which is why the JnJ was temporarily paused, so if there are concerning trends they are likely to be noted and reviewed. Given the huge vaccination numbers we've achieved with mRNA here in MA and the domestically, it's clear the primary concern is anaphylaxis and the sites have set up protocols to address this real, albeit small, risk.
And just stop the misinformation about people dying from the vaccine. It's total crap. You cannot imply causality from the VAERS database. It's such a basic flaw in logic that I can't believe people are falling for this.
You're not convinced by 'Fact Based American' linking to a VAERS aggregator run by individuals who, according to their own blog, are seemingly sympathetic to rhetoric of RFK Jr.? Yeah, neither am I.
I'm not suggesting there is zero risk, but to ignore or be blind to the incredible bias of these obscure online sources is rather incredible. Particularly when these same individuals disregard media sources which are well researched and try to maintain sound and ethical publishing standards.
Last edited by Shrewsburried; 07-18-2021 at 10:20 PM..
Seriously? Fast food habits or lack of exercise are contagious and can be transmitted from person to person?
And just stop the misinformation about people dying from the vaccine. It's total crap. You cannot imply causality from the VAERS database. It's such a basic flaw in logic that I can't believe people are falling for this.
Yes, htfdcolt is right. VAERS is a database of adverse events, raw data. Anything unusual that happens when you're vaccinated is an adverse event - whether or not it was caused by the vaccine. Reporters are not supposed to make a judgement of causation, they're just supposed to report everything. A second step is the review of this raw information to mine for patterns of events that might be caused by the vaccine. The process is conservatively designed - that is, they want to minimize the risk that problematic side effects are missed, so the rule is - don't think, just report it.
You've got to realize that people get sick, and yes, they die, when they're not under some drug or vaccine treatment - it happens all the time - even if the treatment were a glass of water, people in the treatment population would be experiencing health issues. So the fact that you see problems being reported in such a database for a large patient population, means nothing on its own. What matters is - what is the frequency of these events in the treatment population relative to the frequency in the general population, and later - can we think of a plausible mechanism by which the treatment can cause this problem?
US states with recent per-capita Covid-19 deaths (during the week of July 15th) plotted against the percentage of their residents vaccinated. Notice that many states with the worst current mortality are actually very rural. Low population density grants a significant advantage in reducing close contacts. But despite this, they're still having a problem due to their low vaccination rates. You know, I keep hearing that vaccines are a conspiracy, but I keep seeing indications that they work - nahhh, it couldn't be. Would Tucker Carlson and InfoWars lie to me? I thought they're the ones bringing me "the real truth" that the others are afraid to report?
Last edited by OutdoorLover; 07-19-2021 at 05:00 AM..
What some people seem to not understand is that conspiracy theories go beyond Trump and they date back quite some time. There's a pretty good book called them which they looked at extremist. Some of these were anti-semites or anti-global is so it may be anti-black or what may have you. But in many respects what they do is they create a form of a belief system and then they make money off of that system. Alex Jones has been running Infowars for maybe 23 years and has consistently said that the world is going to end or they're going to be some worldwide dictatorship. He is a never-ending infomercial. In his own divorce proceedings he has specifically stated that what he says is for entertainment only and he did so to have custody of his kids.
A long time ago there was a really great Professor out of the University of Virginia who made a website that looked at every single organization that had any proclamation of faith. It was amway to zoroasterism.
There's a strong difference between denial of faith in anything and an affirmation in the belief in something else or denial of existence. In other words I don't believe in God vs I believe there is no God.
Correlation does not mean causality. Just because one thing happened and another thing happened doesn't mean that they're connected..
Hospital records have clearly shown that they were a direct correlation between not getting vaccinated and coming down with a stronger Delta V. The reason why vaccinations works is that it blocks it out. If we allow for significant portions of the population to get infected then that means a virus to mutate and a virus cannot mutate in someone that is vaccinated.
Just like the debates on the max. The reason why there was a little bit of some confusion is some people think that masks me and you all go out and get kn95. Which I obviously would create a huge deficit and supply for First Responders. There are masks that you can make yourself and we did have other forms that aren't as good but it's better to have at least something rather than nothing. Then we had the Bates over testing and if we could have tested earlier and more accurately we could have isolated a bit more of this.
Trying to say that you are a protected class and you don't like vaccines and that by itself means that you should be segregated off but still have the same access and every weight and shape frankly doesn't make sense. Health code matters. In 2019 I want on a great cruise and I had a great time but the cruise industry heavily emphasizes cleaning your hands it's like a constant public service announcement. So what they're doing now is with reopening there are now places saying that either you show that you were vaccinated or you carry a *very*significant travel insurance policy.
That's the other problem with conspiracy theorists none of them have the balls to put their money where their mouth is. Ask yourself this if somebody starts talking about conspiracies. If there's such a grand scheme of worldwide Global control of every facet of society ask yourself why wouldn't they be able to Snuff out people like Alex Jones? Because frankly what they're saying isn't true and nobody really cares what they have to say.
If you want a question science that's fine as we have evolutionary science at moves along. In the 1960s they might have said that it was good to put butter on burns but we certainly know better now. We eliminated lead from gasoline and paint from the 1970s onward so of course yes we always find new things out but that doesn't mean that something is inherently wrong or a conspiracy against a given group of people.
More than half of Massachusetts and Connecticut has been vaccinated and yet we don't see the economy grinding to a halt are we don't see massive amounts of people at the hospitals especially those with the vaccine why is that?
@mdovell "That's the other problem with conspiracy theorists none of them have the balls to put their money where their mouth is. " Oh, I firmly believe that *most* of the prominent conspiracy theory promoters like Tucker Carslon and Alex Jones don't believe what they are saying. They never acknowledge it when their nonsense is shown to be lies and when their predictions don't come true. They've just found a job that brings them easy money and influence - just foam at the mouth and then point out that people won't hear this anywhere else, and suddenly, they become a must see/hear/read information source of "the hidden truth". When Alex Jones was sued, he didn't even try to argue that his Sandy Hook nonsense was true, his defense was that he was mentally ill. When Tucker Carlson was sued, similarly, there was no attempt to argue in court that these things are true, his lawyers instead argued that no reasonable person would take his statements seriously, and that viewers understand that it's just hyperbole. These are not men who have any sincere belief in what they're saying.
Last edited by OutdoorLover; 07-19-2021 at 06:31 AM..
Simply being able to make a website or a publication does not mean it's true.
For quite sometime someone was putting Chick tracks at the free newspaper areas in downtown springfield. I knew what these were and saw them long ago. It was not on the level of burning crosses but religious content pushing the edge.
We can talk about right wing and left wing all we want but what we really don't want to see is people taken advantage of that might not have known any better. I don't like seeing it with false hope either. I saw an old book about Laetrile from the 1970s at a antique store. Sometimes quack science can follow conspiracy theorists. I used to listen to WWCR back around 04-07. Yeah...um mixed nuts is the best way I can say it, it can be scary.
Simply being able to make a website or a publication does not mean it's true.
For quite sometime someone was putting Chick tracks at the free newspaper areas in downtown springfield. I knew what these were and saw them long ago. It was not on the level of burning crosses but religious content pushing the edge.
We can talk about right wing and left wing all we want but what we really don't want to see is people taken advantage of that might not have known any better. I don't like seeing it with false hope either. I saw an old book about Laetrile from the 1970s at a antique store. Sometimes quack science can follow conspiracy theorists. I used to listen to WWCR back around 04-07. Yeah...um mixed nuts is the best way I can say it, it can be scary.
So, you want to limit free speech because it "gives people false hope" and it "can be scary?" What would your ancestors have thought of that?
So, you want to limit free speech because it "gives people false hope" and it "can be scary?" What would your ancestors have thought of that?
There's a difference between critique and calls for censorship, which should not be confused with the 1a.
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