Makin Babies (Boston, Framingham: real estate, condo, mortgage)

[UrbanQuest]

With the news of so many people leaving Massachusetts recently, I beg to wonder how the population remains stable. Do families in the Bay State and New England for that matter tend to be pro family. Do they usually have only 2 kids or does the epicenter of tradition in America love to still have large vibrant families. IMO the new family standard for the middle and upper middle class should be 3 children and not 2. Poor minorities should have 1 due to the uphill battle their brood will have, therefore more attention and resources can be spent to assure their self-esteem and ambition remain vibrant and intact. Poor white people can do what ever they want because their children will have that white-privelage to help them succeed in life. I don't want my kids to grow up without the vibrancy a youthfull population brings to a society. I mean yeah, the senior population shops for antiques, take vacations, exercise and practice yoga, but the focus will move more to them in defining society rather than to the young. No foodcourts in malls to keep the riff raff away (young people), towns trying to attrect age restricted communities as priority, because the expense of the young is to high (WTF).

People don't have to consider themselves baby factories. Face the facts, the reason we are even here on this planet is to procreate (responsibly). Family is beautiful and if you have to $$ have as many as you can, because your house will be gone, your boat will be gone as well as your expensive clothes and cars (these will all be forgotten). Your children will not. Hope my case made any kind of sense and please to anyone get all malthusian on me, or worse fascist. I have to admit, our people are the most giving and educated people on the planet, shouldn't there be more of us than those who wish to mutilate womens vaginas so they could never experience pleasure from a non-existant male threat. Let's do it.........

[skytrekker]

The population demographics of the Bay State and New England tend to be 'mature'. Its been this way for decades. Perhaps New Hampshire is anomaly- but much of its growth has been at the expense of Massachusetts.

Birth rates are among the lowest in the nation throughput the 6 state region (thats of course is do in large part to the older demographics) birth rates are highest among immigrants coming in from central and south America. Immigrants from Latin America and Asia have shored up the population as well- bringing new blood, different cultures and new energy to many fading towns throughout New England.

New England is pro family in other ways. The divorce rate is the lowest nationally- and the social support networks are also among the best anywhere. High birth rates are not unnecessarily an indication of familial bonding.

[baystater]

Originally Posted by UrbanQuest

With the news of so many people leaving Massachusetts recently, I beg to wonder how the population remains stable. Do families in the Bay State and New England for that matter tend to be pro family. Do they usually have only 2 kids or does the epicenter of tradition in America love to still have large vibrant families. IMO the new family standard for the middle and upper middle class should be 3 children and not 2. Poor minorities should have 1 due to the uphill battle their brood will have, therefore more attention and resources can be spent to assure their self-esteem and ambition remain vibrant and intact. Poor white people can do what ever they want because their children will have that white-privelage to help them succeed in life. I don't want my kids to grow up without the vibrancy a youthfull population brings to a society. I mean yeah, the senior population shops for antiques, take vacations, exercise and practice yoga, but the focus will move more to them in defining society rather than to the young. No foodcourts in malls to keep the riff raff away (young people), towns trying to attrect age restricted communities as priority, because the expense of the young is to high (WTF).

People don't have to consider themselves baby factories. Face the facts, the reason we are even here on this planet is to procreate (responsibly). Family is beautiful and if you have to $$ have as many as you can, because your house will be gone, your boat will be gone as well as your expensive clothes and cars (these will all be forgotten). Your children will not. Hope my case made any kind of sense and please to anyone get all malthusian on me, or worse fascist. I have to admit, our people are the most giving and educated people on the planet, shouldn't there be more of us than those who wish to mutilate womens vaginas so they could never experience pleasure from a non-existant male threat. Let's do it.........

At first I was concerned when I saw your post. I found it to have pro life overtones with a religious feeling to it. But after looking at some of your past post I don't think that the case here. Correct me if I'm wrong though.
As for producing more kids. Well there are a least 2 very good reasons why people don't have more children in MA. 1. It's just to expensive to have a lot of kids. My parents had 3 children we were always on an knife edge on what we could spend. If act we got cut a couple to times and had to spend a summer in a camp ground be cause we had no place to live. It ain't easy "making it in Massachusetts." 2. It a matter of quality versus quantity. I would as many native baystater produce a highly educated and highly prepared child that I actually afford to take to other culture (visit other countries) instead of being forced to have to make choices between a new shoes for my child or to buy a couple of boxes of mac and cheese.


P.S. Not all of us white folk got it so easy in life. Granted I have caught a couple of lucky break because of the color of my skin. But I also worked pretty hard to get where I'm today. I think a lot of us New Englanders no matter what color or ethic background can appreciate anyone that works hard and tries to overcome adversities in their lives.

[rewhblcain]

Originally Posted by baystater

At first I was concerned when I saw your post. I found it to have pro life overtones with a religious feeling to it. But after looking at some of your past post I don't think that the case here. Correct me if I'm wrong though.
As for producing more kids. Well there are a least 2 very good reasons why people don't have more children in MA. 1. It's just to expensive to have a lot of kids. My parents had 3 children we were always on an knife edge on what we could spend. If act we got cut a couple to times and had to spend a summer in a camp ground be cause we had no place to live. It ain't easy "making it in Massachusetts." 2. It a matter of quality versus quantity. I would as many native baystater produce a highly educated and highly prepared child that I actually afford to take to other culture (visit other countries) instead of being forced to have to make choices between a new shoes for my child or to buy a couple of boxes of mac and cheese.


P.S. Not all of us white folk got it so easy in life. Granted I have caught a couple of lucky break because of the color of my skin. But I also worked pretty hard to get where I'm today. I think a lot of us New Englanders no matter what color or ethic background can appreciate anyone that works hard and tries to overcome adversities in their lives.

We are having a bad problem with Illegal immigrants here in Ma witch drives up taxes to the hilt because they are not paying taxes and the schools are jambed packed with kids that are not supposed to be here. Overrides because of this, property taxes going up. Who can afford more children when we have to pay for childrens parents who don't put into the system? Est 15,000 illegals in Framingham!

[willdufauve]

Originally Posted by rewhblcain

We are having a bad problem with Illegal immigrants here in Ma witch drives up taxes to the hilt because they are not paying taxes and the schools are jambed packed with kids that are not supposed to be here. Overrides because of this, property taxes going up. Who can afford more children when we have to pay for childrens parents who don't put into the system? Est 15,000 illegals in Framingham!

You have a problem with basic literacy (and your thinking is flawed too).

[Boomerang]

Originally Posted by UrbanQuest

Face the facts, the reason we are even here on this planet is to procreate (responsibly). Family is beautiful and if you have to $$ have as many as you can, because your house will be gone, your boat will be gone as well as your expensive clothes and cars (these will all be forgotten). Your children will not. Hope my case made any kind of sense and please to anyone get all malthusian on me, or worse fascist. I have to admit, our people are the most giving and educated people on the planet, shouldn't there be more of us than those who wish to mutilate womens vaginas so they could never experience pleasure from a non-existant male threat. Let's do it.........

Uh....no. Speak for yourself, please.
There are already too many people on this planet altogether, and as has been proven in research experimentation, crowding = stress and violence. Less people altogether and treating the people that are already here better would be my choice.

You may believe it's a fact that we're here to procreate, but I disagree. It is the nature of all things to wish to procreate and pass on their genes, but I think humans have - or should - be more evolved than this by now.

[UrbanQuest]

Originally Posted by Boomerang

Uh....no. Speak for yourself, please.
There are already too many people on this planet altogether, and as has been proven in research experimentation, crowding = stress and violence. Less people altogether and treating the people that are already here better would be my choice.

You may believe it's a fact that we're here to procreate, but I disagree. It is the nature of all things to wish to procreate and pass on their genes, but I think humans have - or should - be more evolved than this by now.

Oh, believe me, I am the last person on earth who would advocate an overpopulated planet. I speek specifically about our country and for this thread, I speak of New England(very low birthrates apperently). The middle class/upper middle class/upper classes have not an ounce of guilt to feel about having as many kids as they want. I am an avid supporter of the population connection which is an organization which advocates slowing down global population growth. As opposed to popular belief around the world, Americans are a definite plus to this planet when it comes to the ability to be flexible and empathetic. The elites who go to war for us and send our jobs overseas are the one's with the problem, not the average American. American's are the great equalizers and therefore I advocate for more of us to be around.

[miu]

I live just outside of Boston, and the whole area inside of 128 seems a lot more densely populated than when I was young in the 80's. In areas like Allston, there are condo units being built in backyards. Parking is difficult and expensive. The roads are a lot more crowded too. Maybe all this extra population you are encouraging needs to be placed out in Western MA. Also, I don't think that there are enough good jobs to go around if the population was increased. As to more kids, most parents complain about the student to teacher ratio in the classrooms. So if anything, we need less kids and then they will have a higher quality of education.

[baystater]

[quote]

Originally Posted by UrbanQuest

Oh, believe me, I am the last person on earth who would advocate an overpopulated planet. I speek specifically about our country and for this thread, I speak of New England(very low birthrates apperently). The middle class/upper middle class/upper classes have not an ounce of guilt to feel about having as many kids as they want.

Can you prove this? Most people I know in the upper classes have 1 maybe 2 children. Perhaps some middle class people may have more than 3 but I don't personally know anyone in the New England in my age group (Gen X) in the middle class or above having more than 3 children. But I do know a couple of dirt poor people from Pennsylvania and Western NJ area that have 3, 4, or more kids and they really live this $hity lifestyle where they are barely getting by. Is this what your hoping for more children brought up in substandard living arrangements?

I am an avid supporter of the population connection which is an organization which advocates slowing down global population growth. As opposed to popular belief around the world, Americans are a definite plus to this planet when it comes to the ability to be flexible and empathetic. The elites who go to war for us and send our jobs overseas are the one's with the problem, not the average American. American's are the great equalizers and therefore I advocate for more of us to be around.

This is madness. There will always be elites that lead the sheep. It's been this way from the beginning and it will continue to be.
Let take some cases in point shall we.

1. the Iraq war. Do we remember how high Bush's approval rating was at the time of the beginning of the war. It was about 75%. So it wasn't like we were unwilling to go to war in the first place. Now were we still pretty emotional at the time because of 2001. Well yes. But that was no reason not to do your research and look at the history or possible connections of terrorism and Iraq. Heck a lot of people though Saddam was directly involved in the 2001 attack. Look you can try to totally blame the media and all the misinformation the government put out at the time for the war. But seriously in the INTERNET age more people have access to both good and bad information out there. If people actually make the effort to research and try to find facts. We may not be in Iraq and we might have finally captured Osama Bin Laden or at least crushed Al Qaeda in the Afghanistan and Western Pakistan region.

2. The housing bubble/credit crisis was brought about by the "average American" who actually thought that real estate was going to go up forever. So they got themselves these ridiculous mortgages products. Where the risks were high in the belief that they could either refinance themselves out of that mortgage or to "flip" the house for a profit. Look this was not just some isolated incident with a couple of people. This was the nation at large (with a few exceptions). Everybody and his mother went against common logic and past historical data (if they bothered even to look at the data) about housing and real estate growth. Heck a lot of people didn't even read the contracts they were getting into and had no idea or care what the consequences were. Now as we can see those consequences are rather stark and foreboding for the nation as a whole. Now again you can try to blame the media or sly bankers or someone financial boogieman that tricked "average Americas". But to be honest it was people's own individual sheer greed and sheer laziness (in not reading there contract or having a lawyer go over it with them.) that have lead us to the current housing/credit crisis that will linger with us for some time.

3. Look this is an easy way to see how dumbed down the "average American" really is. What is the top rated TV shows out there? Let's see American Idol, Dancing with the stars, Survivor and Lost (correct me if there's a new show I missed.) Yes these shows bring quite a lot of intellectual stimulus to office cooler each morning. Really it's sad that we spend so much of our time watching these types of mindless shows and actually getting emotionally involved in them instead of watching a documentary or reading history or something worthwhile. Of course look what I doing right now. I'm having an argument with a nameless and faceless person on a chat board. I believe I have taken 30 mins of my time to actually craft this argument. I guess I fall in the "average American" category myself.

One last thing. As for your comment on more Americans being better for the world. Well who the Fook are you to say what who right for this planet? This arrogance is what get people to hate us across the world. Look our American culture as spread across the planet and has influenced many countries. Of course there have been adaptations but you can definitely see the influence. This influence for the most part has been CHOSEN by the people of these countries. They like our lifestyles and want to live like or similar to our standards of living. We have created and environment on this planet that may/probably will cause other places to become more open and flexible to new ideas over time.

[smarty]

Wow... sounds like we need natural disaster to help reduce the population.