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No, we don't all have the resources to deal with it. You're pointing to those who survive dreadful circumstances, but there are as many, if not more, who do not.
Whatever the reasons; genetic, environmental, life experience...the sad truth is that a good many people fall completely apart, act irrationally and even just simply lose the will to live when they find themselves in a crisis. I've seen it too many times to believe otherwise.
Everyone's goal is to never get into such a bad circumstance that will test our mind to its extreme limits. WE must learn to manage our ups and downs, that's the only way many of us will survive. The drugs help a lot, but should not become a total crutch, which they can be as the effective ones are very addictive. That then becomes yet another problem we have to deal with.
For most of us of sound mind, the big issues always seem to start with money, or the lack thereof. The second is a bad marriage, which, usually stems from the first problem and only intensifies it.The third is change, which is always going on, we just sometimes don't realize it.If all the changes were positive ones we could handle it, but, they seldom are..... getting over a series of bad experiences will test our abilities ,sometimes to the limit. Finding self control to get beyond these bad times is the answer, we must look back at ourselves, from the outside in, maybe then we can see the way out. yes, sometimes the way out is more than we can handle, you can never run away from your problems, only manage them, maybe thats the best we can hope for.
I'm glad that's worked for you so far, but there are so many things which we cannot control that relying upon your "inner" self is ultimately doomed to failure. You cannot will yourself into good health, force someone else to love you, prevent circumstances from overwhelming you, nor can you stave off death simply by the force of your own power.
Eventually, self-reliance hits the brick wall of reality.
It sure does, that's all a part of my defense. WE must learn to manage the good with the bad. I know of no other way to survive. There are plenty of suicides among those who believe in God as their higher power.
As I said in another post here, help is needed, be it professional, drugs, and or friends along with spouses. I do not say you must go it alone, far from it. However, if we can not learn to manage, we will fail. It is the choices we make in our lifetime that often puts us where we are, its the realization that we will get older, we will have failing health ( thats where I am at these days on both fronts), that we may loose interest in a marriage or, the other way around, the failures in business,being dependent on others,be it fiscal, fatal, death in the family, drugs, booze, gambling, and or any other loss of our ability to function in society and in health, that we must overcome along with looking back at ourselves and seeing where we went wrong, and how we might be able to fix it, or, in the worst case survive it. I have never been there, but being in prison for a long while must be one of those . I value my freedom to the highest degree, if I could not handle it, I know I would go insane, and shut down, or worse.
Everyone's goal is to never get into such a bad circumstance that will test our mind to its extreme limits. WE must learn to manage our ups and downs, that's the only way many of us will survive. The drugs help a lot, but should not become a total crutch, which they can be as the effective ones are very addictive. That then becomes yet another problem we have to deal with.
For most of us of sound mind, the big issues always seem to start with money, or the lack thereof. The second is a bad marriage, which, usually stems from the first problem and only intensifies it.The third is change, which is always going on, we just sometimes don't realize it.If all the changes were positive ones we could handle it, but, they seldom are..... getting over a series of bad experiences will test our abilities ,sometimes to the limit. Finding self control to get beyond these bad times is the answer, we must look back at ourselves, from the outside in, maybe then we can see the way out. yes, sometimes the way out is more than we can handle, you can never run away from your problems, only manage them, maybe thats the best we can hope for.
Of course nobody WANTS to find themselves in dire circumstances, but they come anyhow. There's nothing you can do to avoid it in many, many cases. Surviving them often becomes a matter of maintaining equanimity because that's all you have left. When life throws you some things that you cannot change, cannot do anything about and leaves you with just the option to ride it out and see where it goes, acceptance is your only defense and the only way to maintain any joy at all.
For a lot of the people I've known over the years, especially those who prided themselves on being able to influence their own destiny, those self-reliant supermen and women who were always in control, always up for improvement, that's the point where they typically broke down entirely. Not having practiced acceptance, having always striven to make things "better" and unable or unwilling to call upon some power stronger than themselves, when they found themselves in situations beyond their control, they were unprepared and inexperienced in the tools of survival. Many of them cracked, broke and died.
Of course nobody WANTS to find themselves in dire circumstances, but they come anyhow. There's nothing you can do to avoid it in many, many cases. Surviving them often becomes a matter of maintaining equanimity because that's all you have left. When life throws you some things that you cannot change, cannot do anything about and leaves you with just the option to ride it out and see where it goes, acceptance is your only defense and the only way to maintain any joy at all.
For a lot of the people I've known over the years, especially those who prided themselves on being able to influence their own destiny, those self-reliant supermen and women who were always in control, always up for improvement, that's the point where they typically broke down entirely. Not having practiced acceptance, having always striven to make things "better" and unable or unwilling to call upon some power stronger than themselves, when they found themselves in situations beyond their control, they were unprepared and inexperienced in the tools of survival. Many of them cracked, broke and died.
We all are not bullet proof ( like we were when young) the end will come for us all at some point, many times unplanned. . Much of what I am saying on these posts comes from counseling. Their Job is to help you through the depressions and bad times. They all strive to restore your since of self control and your hidden flexibility that's always been there, it just need to come out again. The older you get the harder it is to do. Its easy to feel trapped in our advancing age, that's where most of the depression comes from.
We all are not bullet proof ( like we were when young) the end will come for us all at some point, many times unplanned. . Much of what I am saying on these posts comes from counseling. Their Job is to help you through the depressions and bad times. They all strive to restore your since of self control and your hidden flexibility that's always been there, it just need to come out again. The older you get the harder it is to do. Its easy to feel trapped in our advancing age, that's where most of the depression comes from.
All of what I'm saying comes from hard experience. I've been involved in more wars and natural disasters than anyone else I know and I've seen the worst that can happen, including the total breakdown of "civilization," mob violence and economic and physical devastation on a Biblical scale. I've held hands and picked up pieces, patched bullet holes and set broken limbs, searched for survivors and helped carry the dead; shepharded, cajoled, defended and threatened people to get them moving and out of danger. I've been involved in both destruction and re-building. I've taken away hope and given it back again.
If I haven't learned anything else, I've learned that the idea that we can control our circumstances, that we can actually affect our own future, is a lie. It's a chimera, a facade, something which gives us the illusion that we're doing something when, in fact, much of our lives are like a leaf floating on a raging river. You can call it fate, destiny, circumstance, being in the right place at the wrong time or the hand of God, whatever you like, but I've seen too much misery, too much turmoil, too much death and destruction brought to people by events or other people far, far beyond their ability to even predict, let alone control, to ever again fall for the lie that we have any power over our futures at all. The whirlwind can, and will, collect us all before it's done and there's not a damn thing we can do to prevent it. Each and every one of us, anywhere in the world at any time, lives dangling over the precipice, caught in the pull of the next abyss and we don't even know it.
And, I've found that the ONLY way to survive it is to accept it and cling to the peace which comes from that acceptance. It is only when we are free from hope that we are truly free, only when we put aside our own ambitions, hopes and dreams to help others caught up in madness that we can find our own redemption.
But, that's just my take on things. You or others may disagree.
Sorry , but I do disagree. I understand where you are coming from, being involved in matters no one can control and lived to tell about. I have always subscribed to the " if it's meant to be" part of what you say. Usually however that has been in matters where I did not win, like something I really wanted on Ebay, or I discovered that I had a cheating Wife, ( that one was hard) , or a deal did not go through, a House I made an offer on and it fell through. Those kinda things, major life changing events at the time, but we all get over it , usually fairly quickly, that in itself can be a defense tactic.that we created to ease the pain of rejection, or not.
I still believe if you have not convinced your self of yourself ,in your self, you will not succeed, that's . where it starts, with positive thinking. Funny thing, since I last posted earlier, I had a 4;00 with my counselor, it lasted an hour and I did all the talking, wife did little, that's where I have problems today,I got little from the session , but that's another matter for an other day.
No, we don't all have the resources to deal with it. You're pointing to those who survive dreadful circumstances, but there are as many, if not more, who do not.
Whatever the reasons; genetic, environmental, life experience...the sad truth is that a good many people fall completely apart, act irrationally and even just simply lose the will to live when they find themselves in a crisis. I've seen it too many times to believe otherwise.
I've seen it too so I think I know what you mean. Forgive me for not explaining it further, but we all are given the resources to deal with things--we just don't always use them or keep them--sometimes too many things happen in a row too quickly and with each succeeding event, your capacity to deal has gotten less and less. I've had some major stress in the last 3 years--spouse came out gay, I got knifed at school, found a stalker or rather he found me and that was scary, flunked a major test that I needed to pass, and some sexual shenanigans at school that I was not part of but I had a big hand in helping to clean up the mess. This all within five months. I sailed through all of these without much trauma but it later caught up with me when my older dd almost got herself killed in a car accident--there was not an accident but a near miss and the next day at school I could not stop crying--it was awful--then I sunk into a major depression for about a year or more and am now dealing with mom's alzheimer's.
Nowadays I have a much harder time dealing even with the little things but I think my brain chemicals are out of whack so I'm working on building my health back up. Yes, all of this took a great toll on my health but I have hopes I can build it back up again and that's what I meant by having the resources to deal with big stresses.
Another thought just occurred to me when I reread your post. Sometimes when it seems that people are being weak or acting irrationally? It may not be what it seems--it may be what needs to be. The day I couldn't stop crying looked like a mental breakdown to my co-workers and maybe it was but the next day I was back at work as even tempered as usual b/c I had done what I needed to do to deal with the situation. A year before I still would have felt bad, but it would have been more of a feeling of relief at the near miss than the continual picture running thru my brain of what might have happened. But then the next day it was gone.
I've seen it too so I think I know what you mean. Forgive me for not explaining it further, but we all are given the resources to deal with things--we just don't always use them or keep them--sometimes too many things happen in a row too quickly and with each succeeding event, your capacity to deal has gotten less and less. I've had some major stress in the last 3 years--spouse came out gay, I got knifed at school, found a stalker or rather he found me and that was scary, flunked a major test that I needed to pass, and some sexual shenanigans at school that I was not part of but I had a big hand in helping to clean up the mess. This all within five months. I sailed through all of these without much trauma but it later caught up with me when my older dd almost got herself killed in a car accident--there was not an accident but a near miss and the next day at school I could not stop crying--it was awful--then I sunk into a major depression for about a year or more and am now dealing with mom's alzheimer's.
Nowadays I have a much harder time dealing even with the little things but I think my brain chemicals are out of whack so I'm working on building my health back up. Yes, all of this took a great toll on my health but I have hopes I can build it back up again and that's what I meant by having the resources to deal with big stresses.
Another thought just occurred to me when I reread your post. Sometimes when it seems that people are being weak or acting irrationally? It may not be what it seems--it may be what needs to be. The day I couldn't stop crying looked like a mental breakdown to my co-workers and maybe it was but the next day I was back at work as even tempered as usual b/c I had done what I needed to do to deal with the situation. A year before I still would have felt bad, but it would have been more of a feeling of relief at the near miss than the continual picture running thru my brain of what might have happened. But then the next day it was gone.
Yes, cumulative stress can wear us down and prevent us ever finding that joy and peace which allows us to weather storms. I've BTDT too. In fact, specific issues and a life-time of stress caused a major crash and burn about a decade ago.
Naturally, I shouldn't speak for others, but in my case, the only thing which kept me from chewing the shotgun was an outside power larger than myself. My own internal resources, my familiar points of contact, the support mechanism's I'd grown used to, were dried up and I had nothing left BUT God. It wasn't me who lifted me from the mess I'd made, in fact, I COULDN'T have done it at that point. My resurrection was nothing less than miraculous and it wasn't because of anything I did or failed to do. The point is that had I relied just on myself, I'd have died.
And, I've seen that same scenario repeated time after time after time in places I've been. It's those who understand their helplessness, but turn their attention to others who not only weather storms, but prosper. Those who rail against the injustice of it all or pretend they can "fix" it themselves or who find themselves cut off and alone are the ones who falter, who loot and steal, who prey upon the weak in times of crisis. Lacking joy and peace in the midst of disaster themselves, they go out and steal it from others. Or, they just sit down and quit. Turning inward, instead of outward, they find nothing in there but emptiness.
As an example, let me tell you of an old man I met in the aftermath of Katrina.
I arrived in the Covington/Mandeville, LA area on the north shore of Lake Ponchartrain about 5 days after the storm went through. That was about as early as anybody got there because you just couldn't get through. My disaster relief team's mission was to do volunteer chainsaw work, cutting trees off houses and providing access in and out of homes. The area we worked initially had been inundated by about a 4 ft storm surge which came in off the lake and swept everything before it for several blocks, in addition to a rash of tornadoes and hurricane force winds. The damage was dreadful.
One day while we were working on a house, an elderly gentleman walked up to see if he could help. I recall that he told me he was something over 80 years old and he'd spent the last week or so just going around the neighborhood helping whomever he could help. His own house had been virtually destroyed, but he wasn't worried about that right then. He was worried about his neighbors. At the end of our conversation, he allowed as how he was about ready to go down to the area around Buras, LA and look for his sister. That was where the storm had made landfall, at the peak of its intensity, and nobody had heard from her since. (He didn't know at the time that he could not get to Buras because the roads were flooded out.)
His calmness and concern for his neighbors was rooted in a firm, life-long relationship with Jesus Christ, the source of his strength. Instead of focusing on his own needs, which were substantial, he was focused entirely on others and he made it through the aftermath of the storm in fine fashion, relying on God to take care of him and everything else. He was quite a remarkable and memorable man.
But others, not so firmly rooted, just sat in what was left of their lives and waited for...something. They didn't know what they were waiting for, but they had no other idea about what to do. I met some who just wept because that's all they could do. All the things they'd learned to count on, from telephones to electricity, from police and fire protection, family, friends, all the support mechanisms of a civilized and industrialized country were just simply gone and they had nowhere to turn. Instead of helping others, they counted the cost and the cost overwhelmed them to the point of helplessness. Their self-reliance had let them down.
I've seen similar things over and over and over again and could go on telling stories for the next week, some better than that one and some far worse. But, the point is that happiness and joy are not found within when times like that come, and they will come. It's found outside yourself and those who don't know it are the ones who will be waiting for people like me to arrive and straighten things out again.
By the way, I saw your rep comments and thank you very much for them. But, you should know that all I've seen and done was voluntary. I didn't "have" to do any of it.
And you rely believe all that stuff ? I doubt it when the chips are down no one will be there to save you , you must do it your self. have you not heard of positive Thinking.? Furthermore , God or Jesus will not buy food for your table, nor will such thought really help you when things get ruff. But, I see you are indoctrinated, so its a waste to go further ...as you fall in the river and drown, All the god talk will not save you, you will just drown. Maybe That is what you are saying, its just your turn to go down...forever.
stillkit, did you ever try to describe a beautiful sunset to a blind person?
I totally agree with you that people are happier and deal better with circumstances when they help others and look to a higher power. Scientific studies even bear this out. Those who have more resources to deal with their own stress though are going to be more help to those who need it though and I can again cite an example from my own experience. I work with physically, emotionally, and mentally handicapped teenagers every day but as I get stronger in myself, I can see how much more help I am to the kids I work with everyday. I can think faster and more creatively and I'm not always walking around in the mental fog that I protect myself with when I'm hurt. I'm sure others can relate. Even at my worst though I can look at them and thank God for my own blessings--they are amazing and marvelous people and all are here for a purpose but what some of them have to go through just breaks my heart.
Also I'm horrified that you think that I suggested that you have to help people. I'm can't bring back up what I said, but I think I was talking about the pain you had to go through, and no one in their right mind ever asks for that, lol. We take it as it comes, the bad with the good, but only a saint would ask the Lord for more challenges.
Last edited by stepka; 12-14-2011 at 07:34 PM..
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