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Old 08-11-2012, 08:33 PM
 
Location: State of Superior
8,632 posts, read 14,234,184 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nightbird47 View Post
This is true. We've always been a drug using society. Men who worked burtally hard jobs all their life way back when got by with some ale or home brew at the end of the day, or as a pick me up. "Patented' medicines were the respectable ladies brew, officially 'medicine' but often alchol with a few opiates laced in it. Midwifes told over stressed mothers to give crying babies a drop of laudinum, made from opium, to quiet their crying.

Nobody thought of it as bad until the side effects of drunken husbands and hungry kids since dad drank his wages were brought out. Then there was the yingyang switch to all being bad which were easing ourselves out of.

If possible, a middle ground is what we need. If you want a beer after dinner to relax for the evening, sure, or maybe a joint. If you have to drink to function, then its too far. Ditto the joint. Ditto LEGAL drugs handed out as candy.

I see most drugs as no different than the ladies sip of her bottle of 'medicine'. If it helped her cope with a lot of kids and work and a demanding man when he came home, then fine. And in moderation. If she ended up downing it just to cope with an uneventful day then not so fine. I'm glad that some find psych drugs help and let loose their creativity. Me, they killed it. I feel like rewriting the stuff I wrote then and labored over so hard. There is no emotional connection to them. It's like looking off at a screen, where what I do is draw one into my scenes and open up a window. Off them I have my free flow back. I quit making jewelry. I stopped drawing. I didn't do much writing until thanks to the oops we can't give you a refill til next month problem the clinic had, I started cutting the dose and saving up a stash for such contingencies and found less worked a lot better. Eventually that came down to none with careful control of triggers and stress.

I know I'm in a minority, but I also know I'm not alone. But there needs to be more than handing out pills. Before pills, should come a complete physical. What medical conditions exist? Equal and full consideration of the effect of medication on an existing condition should be made and its up to the patient who has to live with it what is allowed. If they say no, its no. They are not being uncoopretive, they are the ones who get to live with the results. And what makes like *matter* always matters. Why do people quit meds? Because someone made them take them, or wouldn't listen. Instead of here's your new pill it should be a discussion. When you walk into a pdoc's office, you don't give up all your rights of choice. And one should never assume they know all that should be known about the drug, mostly just what the manufactures say. And the very absolute minimum dosage that works, with other things which aren't drugs to supliment, needs to be the standard. Forget that 200 mg of lamictal is an 'effective' dose. On who? What if for one its 50 mg, and someone else its 300? Then the one that doesn't NEED more than 50 should not get it.

And if drugs are given, a full follow up needs to happen every month. This means either less pills or mor docs. People don't want to spend an hour a month on their health? Then they don't get any. Would you treat a cancer patient with chemotherapy with a do it yourself kit and say come back in three/four/six months? Something that resets your brain needs even closer watch and cooperation.

Part of the judgement should be the choice of the individual. If your not hurting yourself, and can function sufficently, those things which make life meaningful *should* and *do* matter. If a drug makes them all dissapear and life is meaningless, this is not of help, but of destruction.

I'd still question the use of keep awake drugs for those driving long hours. Piloting a jet fighter in a war, maybe you need to keep goingt, but the truck driver needs to stop and get some sleep. Just as I question those who live on over the counter things which say don't drive but they do. Reaction time, perception of the road, and other things are compromised. Pay truckers the same, but insist on a strict driving limit and let them sleep. There have been too many accidents where those who drive trucks or other vehicals who do not have sufficent perception of the road to be driving. Just like you shouldn't be driving and texting, eating your lunch, putting on makeup, or watching a movie.

After I removed them from my system I realized *I* had been a danger to the road when driving on meds. My attention span was minimal. My memory was shot. I commonly slept about three or four hours and stayed up for thirty six hours, and friends were worried. But the doctors solution was ambien? (took three, dumped the rest) I was lucky the car died and I quit driving after that. I think anyone taking them should have to be medically evaluated for safety before they get behind the wheel. Reaction time, sedation and awareness of surroundings matter most. We don't let people drink. Why do we when it comes in a pill?

Maybe this would make people think about the candy pill mentality big pharma pushes and doctors too happily go along with.

At the very least, those who do NOT like pills should be given the respect to seek other means of dealing with an illness. And if something is necessary to jumpstart a break, its and all meds are intended only short time and tapered off by the plan. And other methodologies should be encouraged which either eliminate or curtail the use of chemical controls for those that they work only by sedating. For three years that was the whole real effect I got from my pills until someone who knew me pointed it out and I demanded something else.

I think anyone on pills should have someone who knows them, who will give an honest answer, tell them how others see their behavior. You might be surprised. I've found you can tell if someone is on meds you knew before since the meds change them so much, and the person they were beyond the illness can get lost in the shuffle.

And I happen to agree that in a dangerous area where you need ALL your radar working, taking a pill that lulls you is dangerous to yourself. You need every survial instict on, not shut down.

(Maybe a chain mail shirt under the uniform. No kidding here. An SCA friend did that. The weapon of choice was knives, and when he jumped up after an intended robber with the knife stuck in his shirt, with the nearest heavy object to throw, they left and never bothered him again.)
Glad we fundamentally agree on what was,is, and what it all should be....For most people the help is not themselves ,cause if it was they would not abuse their intake of just about everything. They say all in moderation, and that's good, but it never happens . In my own family ( all are dead now ) I saw what eating way too much sweets, sugar, and no control of the amount. Overweight really killed my mother ( type II Diabetes and as a result nerve damage Ie; in a wheel chair, an elderly woman at over 230 -250 lbs, that when in the hospital, they used a crane, and EMS calls resulted to two trucks , for the extra manpower . What did finish Her off was massive trauma, lung cancer ( no checkups as required cause of her weight ) and I was in Canada in a blinding snow storm . Took weeks to get out of the wilderness in the dead of winter. Over weight and junk food......that took my double cousin at 50, who already had heart problems, tho minor, but he would not stop eating at convenience stores 3-4 times a day ( especially after the divorce) . When I went back to Iowa to visit , the last time ,I saw a walking time bomb, and sure enough it happened in the movie theater and not driving a truck, he loved movies, and here I was in Alaska when I got the call. My other regular cousin , he must have had some deep problems ( along with gambling ), we never knew, then one sunny Sunday morning he drove to the cemetery and put a revolver to his head.
So , lets see, now it leaves one other double cousin and me, thats it. She too is overweight, and sure knows better ( PHD prison school teacher ) because She wound up retired from her child / adult faimly criminal problems and mostly she was a expert witness for the state, tough work would not be for me. I wish She would loose some weight, who am I to talk so should I about 20 lbs .
Now the end of the story. All of them never drank anything stronger then sodas , none of them smoked , and in my mother's case, she always took her pills, but could not loose wt. for over 65 years. They all were honest but liberal, none religious ( as am I ), and for the most part lived a conservative life in a small Iowa farm town.( I left when i was 21 ) so now the truth . Number one ,other missuses to your body can kill you besides pills. Number 2 , they all loved to eat, and all the wrong stuff, Midwest farm Food and lots of it. so lifestyle in fact was not the killer.
Here we go, Me , I did everything wrong, or so it seemed. I drank in excess for many years, I was married three times, I never slept more than a couple of hours, always a phone in each ear, living the good life in Chicago, a high pressure broker that loved to work kinda Guy. I smoked big cigars for 55 years, never cigarettes . I traveled , I lived many places in North America.I had many, many girlfriends in three Countries, I was , maybe one of the most interesting men in the world .LOL. So you see, I guess its all about moderation, and timing.
The last ten years, I retired, I lost near a Million in the commodities market, I bankrupted a business, one I took 40 years to build, all 55 credit cards, and everyone of my Classic/ Brass era Cars, my hobby for so so many years. I am sure there is more much more infact. lets see, I wound up in AA, I got gall stones, I had panic attacks ever increasing year after year so many trips to the ER I can,t remember. My third marriage is for all practical reasons is dead. I 2 years ago found out from my ENT, going down the highway " Well your test was bad, you have Tonsil cancer, I will get back to you soon as I can, busy you know", I demanded more tests , always waiting, popping the Xanax several times a day while I waited for answers, always days or weeks of not knowing, I felt I was going insane ! I knew I needed to do somthing myself, I had to. I threw out all my Cuban cigars, quit cold Turkey, as I had with the Vodka 7 years ago.
I had to take stock of the remains, on the positive side , My new modern minimalist home overlooking Lake Superior was nearly done after 4 years of working in it. I told all the doctors to go pound sand, I checked myself in to the Mayo Clinic . I had done my reading, I went to the man that invented the procedure, robotic Tonsular surgery and as well I had 37 nodes removed, clean ! I got a letter from my Doc...Cancer free,!! ..I saved my own life.
The pain was the worst I had ever experienced, they had to give me lots of go to sleep stuff , double most people, I was a tough subject. The recovery from that alone was like tremors from Heroin , the with draw from Xanax terrible, I was over dosed on serotonin Meds. I could not eat, I lost 35 lbs, I felt miserableness behond anything my Local Intern had ever seen. Then 6 months later, I felt better I stayed with the withdraw med ( I forget how to spell it, and its dark in my office ) . Its been 2 years this Christmas , I still have attacks, I have cut down on dosage, also I take 1000mg a day for what ever I have had for 40 years, maybe IBS, maybe not, no one knows.
There is really no moral to this story, but there is hope, grateful, lucky some days sad, some days on top of the world. I see the Shrink less now, and we are in counseling but its not working, but, you know , I don't care. I just finished painting my big JD tractor today , I also finished my woods runner a tintop suzuski samurai, and its wonderful, I bought a new Mini Cooper last week, its red ...live is good !
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Old 08-14-2012, 01:57 AM
 
Location: Colorado
2,561 posts, read 5,143,097 times
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I'm currently on Xanax..word up I suffer from extreme anxiety/depression/drug addiction was actually considering going to go to rehab tomorrow.(waste of time for me) I am actually not making fun or fun of your situation as anxiety is a horrible disorder. I have found limited amounts and I mean limited amounts because they are addicting of xanax or other forms of lorazapam are very helpful..try excercise, diet,fish.fish oil tablets,flax seed..I wish you well..fyi I have not read the posts before this...Try to avoid what I am doing now which is drinking alcohol..depressents alter anxiety levels..do as I say..not as I do..good luck.

You could try heroin...it works..it works well, but pretty muck kicks your A..! I am making light of a dark situation..but for the record Xanax is pretty decent. Stay far away from wellbutrin....zolft.prozac may help..but unfortunately often the crap that addicts you works better..for natural alternatives if it's legal in your state..try Indica type marijuna..stay the hell away from Sativa. Maybe TMI but trust me I know about anxiety. I have been to some of the so called best shrinks in Beverly Hills and even they admit psychiatry is a guinea pig science. Don't waste your time with too many SSRI's those will f...k your head head up hard. Again 5tay away from alcohol..I am qutting(God Willing) tomorrow; alcohol increases depression and anxiety...S280

Last edited by Scott5280; 08-14-2012 at 02:09 AM..
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Old 08-14-2012, 12:11 PM
 
Location: State of Superior
8,632 posts, read 14,234,184 times
Reputation: 2777
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott5280 View Post
I'm currently on Xanax..word up I suffer from extreme anxiety/depression/drug addiction was actually considering going to go to rehab tomorrow.(waste of time for me) I am actually not making fun or fun of your situation as anxiety is a horrible disorder. I have found limited amounts and I mean limited amounts because they are addicting of xanax or other forms of lorazapam are very helpful..try excercise, diet,fish.fish oil tablets,flax seed..I wish you well..fyi I have not read the posts before this...Try to avoid what I am doing now which is drinking alcohol..depressents alter anxiety levels..do as I say..not as I do..good luck.

You could try heroin...it works..it works well, but pretty muck kicks your A..! I am making light of a dark situation..but for the record Xanax is pretty decent. Stay far away from wellbutrin....zolft.prozac may help..but unfortunately often the crap that addicts you works better..for natural alternatives if it's legal in your state..try Indica type marijuna..stay the hell away from Sativa. Maybe TMI but trust me I know about anxiety. I have been to some of the so called best shrinks in Beverly Hills and even they admit psychiatry is a guinea pig science. Don't waste your time with too many SSRI's those will f...k your head head up hard. Again 5tay away from alcohol..I am qutting(God Willing) tomorrow; alcohol increases depression and anxiety...S280
I must agree about Alcohol sure glad I quit before the xanax became a problem. They say that Benzos are the hardest drug to get off of, more so than heroin and alcohol combined, same goes then if you take any of the benzo and or Opiates for long period's of time as well as large amounts, Just works against ypu
you.ust to feel better, which actually
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Old 08-14-2012, 07:58 PM
 
Location: Colorado
2,561 posts, read 5,143,097 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by darstar View Post
I must agree about Alcohol sure glad I quit before the xanax became a problem. They say that Benzos are the hardest drug to get off of, more so than heroin and alcohol combined, same goes then if you take any of the benzo and or Opiates for long period's of time as well as large amounts, Just works against ypu
you.ust to feel better, which actually
Just read your post..damn straight from what I hear as well as that benzos are more addicting than heroin..I have been combining the three for a while.gonna (God willing) cut out all tomorow. Thanks for the response,,Again do as I say..not what I am actually doing. To anyone suffering from anxiety,severe bipolar ect. adhere to to both above warnings. Personally I am getting off everything until I can get on .05 amounts of benzos safely..goinghit the beach or ocean for some therapy..in between time kind of sucks,,but LISTEN SERIOUSLY PEOPLE..ADDICTION SUCKS!!! I basically lost the love of my life last weekend..for an anxiety ridden,alcoholic/junkie..very dangerous places. I can't and will not preach to people on this board as that would be pure hypocracy..just listen to those of us who have made mistakes..poor decisions and try to do the opposite..To those normies( a term used for non addicts/alcoholics) that suffer from anxiety depression watch your selves...I used to think and still do believe at times I am undestructable..don't pull a scott..anxiety is no joke,,benzos do work!!! use caution..END RANT Have fun and enjoy being alive..sounds corny..once that is finally understood and acheivable it will sound less and less that way. I could quite possibly be one of the most fffd idiots depression wise on here..but I truly come from a good place deep down inside..For those of you really struggling with heavy thoughts,actions,ect been there,,,say a prayer..it can't hurt..all the best.S.
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Old 08-15-2012, 09:46 AM
 
Location: Lompoc,CA
1,261 posts, read 4,788,478 times
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I have been on 1 mg of Atvian for 2 yrs. at night. I have tinnitus,I use it to help get to sleep.Not anxiety. I think it depends on how you use benzos. I plan to never go up. And ive gone down or off with no probs. Must be the low dose. I cant imagine
being on high doses during the day?? Whoa!


Greenchili
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Old 08-15-2012, 02:03 PM
 
Location: State of Superior
8,632 posts, read 14,234,184 times
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Everyone is a little different when it comes to drugs. I know people who will go to sleep if they take uppers. From personal experience and in consultation with other medical people , some people should remain on a small dosage of Benzos, maybe for the rest of their lives. The withdrawal along with the mental state can be a very bad place to be in. For the rest of the population slowly weening off a drug, like Xanax is the best way to go. Again, there are exceptions, nothing is cast in stone , except the evils of addiction be it over use of alcohol , smoking,eating or excessive drug use both legal and otherwise.
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Old 08-15-2012, 02:38 PM
 
Location: Cushing OK
14,545 posts, read 18,225,322 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by darstar View Post
Everyone is a little different when it comes to drugs. I know people who will go to sleep if they take uppers. From personal experience and in consultation with other medical people , some people should remain on a small dosage of Benzos, maybe for the rest of their lives. The withdrawal along with the mental state can be a very bad place to be in. For the rest of the population slowly weening off a drug, like Xanax is the best way to go. Again, there are exceptions, nothing is cast in stone , except the evils of addiction be it over use of alcohol , smoking,eating or excessive drug use both legal and otherwise.
I tend to react as if I took too much to normal doses of pretty much anything. When I go to the dentist, they have to do the novacane three times since it wears off so fast, and the dentist said my body processes drugs quickly. I have to be allowed a few before I can get up when they're done Im so zonked. Sleeping pills knock me flat for about three hours and then I'm wide awake for hours. I have told doctors this but they genereally don't get it. I found even half the 'normal' dose of welbrutan made me very hyper. When the hyper wears off I go into zombie mode. Thus, unless nothing is a lot worse, I have a very short list of medications I'll take.

I've been told I'm not unusual, but its not the 'usual approach' and the pdocs I've seen never got that I'm not 'normal'. Regular ones mostly have. I guess its because they just *assume* the client is not able to think. I no longer have any trust in pdocs unless they look over MY medical history first. But what I have noticed is that its too easy to give addictive drugs to people showing addictive behavior. They go away and don't make trouble and need an unplanned appointment.

It's not always obviouls either. Say my friend went to a regular doctor asking for xanex since her life is currently so terrribly stressful, which is true.

She is so addicted to benedryl that she virtually can't sleep without it even if it makes her anxiouls and hyper. She's used it for years and is taking much larger doses now. She tried her husband's xanex and was using those too, and had to back her way out (her husband is in a nursing home now) This is the kinds of things which should also go into deciding on a med. If someone has shown addictive behavior, then should a med which is addictive be given to them, given their track record? Now my friend has no plans to need one, but she and her addictions are very common.

If your body chemistry is not 'standard' its very hard to communicate that pills do not act 'normal' to you when the business at hand is dispensing them.
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Old 09-06-2012, 06:21 PM
 
Location: Phoenix
1,798 posts, read 2,432,646 times
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This Zoloft is good stuff man! I thought I'd give a progress report on it. I've been on it for about 4 weeks now, and I'm feeling a little better each day I wake up. It's definitely not the placebo effect anymore. They bumped me up to 100 mgs a couple weeks ago. I think I'll stay on this dose for a while. The diarrhea effects seem to be subsiding a little, much of that is caused by my morning coffee though, but I got to have my coffee in the morning!

But I'm just feeling real content lately, I even bought a new car a few days ago, a big old Mercury Grand Marquis. It drinks a little gas but sure has a smooth ride. I still have a hectic life with school and work, but I seem to be able to relax at the moment, just taking a deep breath of air gives me a feeling of well being. I'm doing better at work too, I'm not having rage attacks and anxiety nearly as much.
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Old 09-06-2012, 07:53 PM
 
Location: Lompoc,CA
1,261 posts, read 4,788,478 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by New Horizons View Post
This Zoloft is good stuff man! I thought I'd give a progress report on it. I've been on it for about 4 weeks now, and I'm feeling a little better each day I wake up. It's definitely not the placebo effect anymore. They bumped me up to 100 mgs a couple weeks ago. I think I'll stay on this dose for a while. The diarrhea effects seem to be subsiding a little, much of that is caused by my morning coffee though, but I got to have my coffee in the morning!

But I'm just feeling real content lately, I even bought a new car a few days ago, a big old Mercury Grand Marquis. It drinks a little gas but sure has a smooth ride. I still have a hectic life with school and work, but I seem to be able to relax at the moment, just taking a deep breath of air gives me a feeling of well being. I'm doing better at work too, I'm not having rage attacks and anxiety nearly as much.
Coffee does the same to me...LOL...but gotta have it. And I dont even do full strength,just 1/2 reg and
1/2 decaf.
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Old 09-27-2012, 05:17 PM
 
Location: Phoenix
1,798 posts, read 2,432,646 times
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Quick little update. The Zoloft is most definitely helping me, through school and especially at work. I took two exams this week and didn't freak out like I have in the past! I just took my time and utilized the whole 3 hour allotment. I even made a high B on one of my Accounting exams. I realized too, I don't have to make an A on every single exam. The important thing is that I know the content.

And at work I find myself not reacting to customers problems anymore. Just because they have problems doesn't mean I need to make it my problem. I feel like I'm more separated emotionally from them and that's a good thing at my job.

The doctor and I decided to go up t 150 milligrams, it might help with my persisting OCD habits. He also prescribed some sleeping pills for when I really need to get a good night's sleep. I might pop one tonight.
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