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Old 07-06-2015, 09:03 PM
 
6,852 posts, read 3,873,972 times
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Medicine, Therapy, a combination of both, nothing - each person with depression faces this choice. But each person is an individual, and no one can really tell you the best path to take.

There are people like me who have seen depression 1st hand with someone very close to me, yet I have never truly lived it myself. I have had feelings of depression but I have never lost control of the box I keep it in, although sometimes the box feels like it's expanding. I could offer you advice based on my real life experience and the tons of research I did, including talking to those in charge at the mental hospitals, halfway houses. But those are only my experience with my daughter, who even though we believed (and still do) we had a loving family and thought we "knew" our daughter, we never saw it coming.

You could listen to the professionals. Those who have traveled the education system to get a degree and officially practice in mental health. Like any profession, there are good and bad therapists and psychologists. But the profession is there to attempt to help. With our daughter we were lucky to find a psychologist that never defined our daughter, but who just understood he didn't understand but was there as a guide. He did a wonderful job.

At the end of the day, those afflicted don't truly know why they are depressed. Sure, poor family surroundings or a traumatic event can easily push one down the rabbit hole. But others find themselves in the hole looking up wondering how they got there. Mental health is complex for the patient and the doctors.

And then there's medications, given the promise of solving something without knowing how bad side effects can be, and how the medications themselves can drastically alter ones behavior. I watch our daughter cycle through 14 meds before we pulled the plug. We watched meds appear to temporarily begin to help, then something else happened and it didn't work. New side effects pooped up, from anxiety to sleepiness to you name it. It was a nightmare to watch, and no idea of the nightmare living it.

The only general advice I can possibly give, outside of typical advice (take it with a grain of salt) like hang on to hope or latch on to things that make you happy (which isn't bad advice), is to look and move forward and not look back or hang on to the past. I think the advice of looking forward works in most aspects of your life - live and learn. I heard from my daughter many times "you have no idea what I'm going through" or words like that - she's right, of course I didn't and never professed that I did. All I could do was point to happiness through the fog and hoped she'd find something.
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Old 07-06-2015, 10:34 PM
 
Location: I'm out searching for me... If you see me, let me know... ;--)
3,551 posts, read 1,997,189 times
Reputation: 8070
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nickchick View Post
It just gets so tiring because I feel like I've been waiting my whole life to be satisfied with myself (you might as well say I have). Yeah growing up has a lot to do with it. I never had much of a family so my home life sucked. Now I am older and I may have left the World War 3 house but my childhood is still coming back to haunt me. It is very likely that it helped me to be the loser I am today.
I am working on it but it's hard when I'm not getting enough help. The therapist referred me to a program but someone I know said it didn't help her and I find out that it costs. I just don't know what else to say maybe the therapist doesn't know anywhere else to go. I am now trying the program through the local community college because she said that helped her but they said they were filled up until the fall. I know things take time but I've been waiting long enough as it is...it upsets me that it takes me this long to get to this point. At this rate it seems like I won't have a job until next year if that and summer is my favorite season. I really wanted to enjoy it. It's hard to do the things I want to do without much of a personal income.
I know I shouldn't think my life is over but I feel like I'm running out of time for my life to turn around. I don't know anyone my biological age that is far behind as I am.
I don't care if I have to work a lot. I just want a summer job so I can take a vacation even if it's just a few days. Not only that it's hard to enjoy things when you are essentially a grown up child because you don't see how you really deserve it. If I don't get a job I'm really just wasting my summer and yeah there's volunteering but that idea wouldn't make me feel any better because I don't feel right unless I'm earning money. I keep trying to look on my own for work since no one is really helping me. I don't know where else to go.
I bolded your statement because what you need to say is what you are saying here. Sharing them, receiving support of how you are feeling/ doing is key.

You are not running out of time. I am 52, ugh. So, yes, I know the feeling. But you are learning, abet slowly. I read your words about how you are doing, how you don't know what to do. But you are voicing that, you are getting out there, out of your head for at least a moment.

I also know how hard it is without a job. I am in the same boat. It can be beyond difficult when you want to be part of society with a job, ability to plan things to do, vacations, a bit of spending money...etc. Keep searching for that job.

There is a level of discomfort that has to be accepted to get face all of this. There is pain that depression is and pain not being able to move beyond it. But moving beyond it involves many little (and big) steps that can't magically happen. Try to be gentle with yourself. Remind yourself that you are doing what you can.

I can see that you are. You are talking here. You have a therapist. You are searching for a job. Give yourself props for this. Believe in you. And when you don't feel it, remind yourself again that you ARE making it.

Because you are. Your strong. You have to be in these circumstances. And there are many people with depression AND other life experiences that face conflicting emotions and fears. You are not alone.

Nickchick, Tune_It_Lower and everyone battling depression: It is never too late. We are learning about ourselves as we face this battle and if we keep searching and willing to live with discomfort, we can make changes little by little!

Last edited by Wild Flower; 07-06-2015 at 11:07 PM..
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Old 07-06-2015, 11:16 PM
 
Location: I'm out searching for me... If you see me, let me know... ;--)
3,551 posts, read 1,997,189 times
Reputation: 8070
Quote:
Originally Posted by metalmancpa View Post
Medicine, Therapy, a combination of both, nothing - each person with depression faces this choice. But each person is an individual, and no one can really tell you the best path to take.

There are people like me who have seen depression 1st hand with someone very close to me, yet I have never truly lived it myself. I have had feelings of depression but I have never lost control of the box I keep it in, although sometimes the box feels like it's expanding. I could offer you advice based on my real life experience and the tons of research I did, including talking to those in charge at the mental hospitals, halfway houses. But those are only my experience with my daughter, who even though we believed (and still do) we had a loving family and thought we "knew" our daughter, we never saw it coming.

You could listen to the professionals. Those who have traveled the education system to get a degree and officially practice in mental health. Like any profession, there are good and bad therapists and psychologists. But the profession is there to attempt to help. With our daughter we were lucky to find a psychologist that never defined our daughter, but who just understood he didn't understand but was there as a guide. He did a wonderful job.

At the end of the day, those afflicted don't truly know why they are depressed. Sure, poor family surroundings or a traumatic event can easily push one down the rabbit hole. But others find themselves in the hole looking up wondering how they got there. Mental health is complex for the patient and the doctors.

And then there's medications, given the promise of solving something without knowing how bad side effects can be, and how the medications themselves can drastically alter ones behavior. I watch our daughter cycle through 14 meds before we pulled the plug. We watched meds appear to temporarily begin to help, then something else happened and it didn't work. New side effects pooped up, from anxiety to sleepiness to you name it. It was a nightmare to watch, and no idea of the nightmare living it.

The only general advice I can possibly give, outside of typical advice (take it with a grain of salt) like hang on to hope or latch on to things that make you happy (which isn't bad advice), is to look and move forward and not look back or hang on to the past. I think the advice of looking forward works in most aspects of your life - live and learn. I heard from my daughter many times "you have no idea what I'm going through" or words like that - she's right, of course I didn't and never professed that I did. All I could do was point to happiness through the fog and hoped she'd find something.
I am sorry your daughter experienced depression and that you've had it difficult too. It cannot be easy wanting to help her but being on the outside of her depression looking in. You are so right in the fact that each person is different and giving advice based on personal experience may not be helpful. It is true, each person has to decide what is best for themselves. Sounds like this was very hard. Sorry it was and thanks for your perspective.
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Old 07-09-2015, 02:39 PM
Status: "Daring to hope" (set 5 days ago)
 
Location: Coastal New Jersey
62,571 posts, read 59,428,330 times
Reputation: 75383
Quote:
Originally Posted by DougStark View Post
You said some very important points. The medical community still does not know the exact cause of depression or what can "cure" it.

All of these serotonin enhancing medications (prozac, zoloft, etc.) offer some relief to the depressed, but they are not a silver bullet solution. In 50 years, I predict science will have a whole new understanding to this dreadful illness and will have other medications to treat it.
That's exactly what my old psychiatrist said (I was on an SSRI for depression and OCD for seven years--weaned myself off and have been managing with therapy and no meds. So-so results.) He said, "You know that you who are taking these meds are all guinea pigs, don't you? Fifty years from now, the psychiatrists are going to look back and say, 'what the hell were they doing?' But right now, it's all we know."

But, I took a tricyclic in my 20s, and that made me zombie-ish and gave me heart palpitations, so the SSRIs are an improvement.
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Old 07-10-2015, 04:21 PM
 
3,660 posts, read 2,080,530 times
Reputation: 1933
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wild Flower View Post
I bolded your statement because what you need to say is what you are saying here. Sharing them, receiving support of how you are feeling/ doing is key.

You are not running out of time. I am 52, ugh. So, yes, I know the feeling. But you are learning, abet slowly. I read your words about how you are doing, how you don't know what to do. But you are voicing that, you are getting out there, out of your head for at least a moment.

I also know how hard it is without a job. I am in the same boat. It can be beyond difficult when you want to be part of society with a job, ability to plan things to do, vacations, a bit of spending money...etc. Keep searching for that job.

There is a level of discomfort that has to be accepted to get face all of this. There is pain that depression is and pain not being able to move beyond it. But moving beyond it involves many little (and big) steps that can't magically happen. Try to be gentle with yourself. Remind yourself that you are doing what you can.

I can see that you are. You are talking here. You have a therapist. You are searching for a job. Give yourself props for this. Believe in you. And when you don't feel it, remind yourself again that you ARE making it.

Because you are. Your strong. You have to be in these circumstances. And there are many people with depression AND other life experiences that face conflicting emotions and fears. You are not alone.

Nickchick, Tune_It_Lower and everyone battling depression: It is never too late. We are learning about ourselves as we face this battle and if we keep searching and willing to live with discomfort, we can make changes little by little!
I don't even think I'm learning slowly though. I feel like I'm doing this the same way all the time. If I was learning why am I not getting any closer to obtaining?
I know it doesn't magically happen but it shouldn't be "same sh-- different day" for so long.
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Old 07-11-2015, 03:56 AM
 
Location: Auckland, New Zealand
6,431 posts, read 3,248,569 times
Reputation: 3147
Yup, been there. My son too. He did not make it, sadly.

However, I believe there is relief to be had. In trying to understand what happened to my son i discovered that there are nutrients one can take to help improve one's brain functioning. But be careful, after years of anxiety and depression, the wrong supplements, like wrong medications, can make one worse by firing up the wrong pathways. Basically, what has worked for me is a serotonin boosting nutrient plus a GABA boosting nutrient together with a general brain functioning nutrients.

If you would like to know what these are;
L-Theanine for GABA and L-Tryptophan for serotonin.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gamma-Aminobutyric_acid
http://overcomingyouranxiety.net/nat...a-for-anxiety/

Gaba controls mood stability as in bipolar and anxiety and serotonin makes us feel good, or more accurately, lack of makes us feel depressed, sad, anxious and so on.

What I believe does not help or makes things worse are stimulants like caffeine, sugar and amphetamines.

Lack of sleep does not help either. Having enough magnesium in the diet helps sleep as does vitamin B5 and so on. Having enough D and B12 are important for mood too. Check on all micro-nutrients to ensure that you are getting enough. Take supplements if necessary but good diet is the ideal.

I take the full range of supplements for good measure but in my case, years of depression and anxiety has done brain damage and I'm trying to recover - and succeeding. I have improved tremendously in the last eighteen months and that is how long my son has been gone.

It is suggested that poor gut flora may play a role in depression and anxiety. Possibly due to resulting poor absorption? Probiotics has improved my digestion noticeably.

Lastly, mindfulness seems to help with both mood and sleep. It's a form of meditation and has been shown clinically to promote the growth of new neurons in the brain. So does omega-3.

I would suggest that therapy (CBT - Cognitive-Behavioural Therapy) would help build or rebuild healthy neural pathways, i.e. retrain your brain.

Check this site for starters;
http://www.mindfulnessstudies.com/mi...sed-therapies/

Hope this helps.

I wish you all the very best
Take care
303Guy

Last edited by 303Guy; 07-11-2015 at 04:11 AM..
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Old 07-11-2015, 08:33 AM
Status: "Daring to hope" (set 5 days ago)
 
Location: Coastal New Jersey
62,571 posts, read 59,428,330 times
Reputation: 75383
^Interesting information, 303 Guy. I'll be better for a while, or think I am, and then along comes The Dark Thing and envelopes me once again. At least I'm a pro at it and see the warning signs and call somebody. This time it came after standing waiting at my commuter train and realizing that I kept fantasizing, "Wouldn't it be just so easy to take those few steps forward onto the track as the train pulls into the station..."

I don't see much ahead for me in life except blackness. Talking to somebody now.
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Old 07-12-2015, 10:36 PM
 
Location: I'm out searching for me... If you see me, let me know... ;--)
3,551 posts, read 1,997,189 times
Reputation: 8070
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mightyqueen801 View Post
^Interesting information, 303 Guy. I'll be better for a while, or think I am, and then along comes The Dark Thing and envelopes me once again. At least I'm a pro at it and see the warning signs and call somebody. This time it came after standing waiting at my commuter train and realizing that I kept fantasizing, "Wouldn't it be just so easy to take those few steps forward onto the track as the train pulls into the station..."

I don't see much ahead for me in life except blackness. Talking to somebody now.
I'm sorry you experience this too. For me, my blackness is a life I can find career wise but then, come home to an empty, empty apt. I don't want a cat or dog to fill the place of a human but the human is not available. It just makes everything else seem pointless.

You are not alone- though when I have these powerful negative feelings, that does not matter so much... still, I care and others do too. Best wishes.
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Old 07-12-2015, 11:33 PM
 
Location: I'm out searching for me... If you see me, let me know... ;--)
3,551 posts, read 1,997,189 times
Reputation: 8070
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nickchick View Post
I don't even think I'm learning slowly though. I feel like I'm doing this the same way all the time. If I was learning why am I not getting any closer to obtaining?
I know it doesn't magically happen but it shouldn't be "same sh-- different day" for so long.
What I hear you say is you don't feel you have understanding/ knowledge about what is happening with your depression. That you keep experiencing the same thing but not moving beyond it? (If I am wrong, let me know)

You start where you are. Start with the same sh--. Accept it. What we resist, persists. There was a time a minister asked me didn't I just want to lead a calm life? Duh, yeah. But I had to accept that the calmness was not part of me at that time.

Second, and this is important, know you are separate from all the crapola, all the same sh--... it is not you, your physical self. There is a special person that is experiencing this pain and frustrations. See her as valuable because she is. YOU are. For me, this is tough lesson! Hard to stop thinking of myself in the same negative terms I always have.

I've come a long way. I had so many, many, many years of crying, not knowing why. Of fears I could not acknowledge, did not know on a conscious level they were there. Pain and frustrations and worries... that was me. I can say that is not me fully now...over 20 years later. (gulp!)

I say this in reflection of myself and my life. If any of this doesn't fit you, I understand. Don't want to imply what you are feeling.

Be patient with you. And kind. You have time. I realized years ago- 1995? that I had time to figure it out. Before that I was this big mess inside feeling my time to understand this all was running out. I felt very old. It does take a lot of time. But learning, beginning to learn about our inner world is the most important thing we need to do.

One last related thought. As children, a big part of their learning is learning to be themselves. Learning what they can do. Learning how to relate to the world. I think I missed all of that because of my family life. I disassociated it all, was a wall flower in my own life. That is why this is so hard. Learning to learn is second nature (sort of) for kids. For me, it is a huge curve!

Hope you have a good Monday!
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Old 07-15-2015, 03:00 PM
 
Location: Cushing OK
14,545 posts, read 18,413,482 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wild Flower View Post
I understand your feeling you don't know how you will ever get to where you need to be. Me too. My best advice is to keep on working towards it. You never know what is up ahead and by searching for what you need. Life always changes and you can influence it to change for the better!


And I agree about the medicine too. My depression is related to how I grew up. I felt so distant from my family. It was as if I was not acceptable or worth loving. And the thing is that all of that was not spoken words on my part. It was feelings that I had no clue weren't true. And if you don't know what you are feeling is not true, you can't change. You can't talk about things that are unspoken even to yourself. I am finally talking about how I am still feeling those feelings.

What helped me was a crisis line that the counselors actively listen to me and give me the support I missed growing up. I have come a long way! I am going to keep making progress, understanding who I am and what I need to do to feel part of this world... instead of apart from the world!

P.S... the more you can tell your therapist what you are feeling, how you are doing, the better. That may sound second nature but I spent a lot of time in therapy not talking about the real problems. But then again, I did not know what my feelings were truly, even six years ago. So, how do you talk about them then?? Tell your therapist about what you shared here. It is important to be supported in the worst of the feelings.

Best wishes. You can make it!
I self diagnosed myself as manic depressive (the term at the time) at about 18. I didn't look at it as a curse. I understood my cycling very well. I'd be happier, then would get quiet and deep. I'm mope a bit but learned to look at the mope. It may seem wrong and terrible to some other person that I'll get very quiet and mayby shut them out, but I accept that as how I am. Those deep moments I learned to write it out, just not about the 'issue' or anything which is part of it. And don't edit. Handwrite. All sorts of things come clear that way. Sometimes the 'down' isn't situational, but a mood shift. I get quiet and deep then. I feel slightly apart from the universe. I come up with a lot of my art and projects then.

I actually seldom feel 'depressed'. But when I do and the world has slowed down, I can pick it apart. I know that in a few hours the down will go away on its own.

It wasn't until stress and personal drama made it impossible to ever get out of the dark. That's when I was first diagnosed with Depression and then bipolar. Thats when I first took meds.

Meds don't work right on me (old surgery, and don't absorb them right or maybe all at once). Eventually I decided I was going to take myself back, slowly backed out the meds and am doing fine, thankyou. I still like to be alone, but then some of us are just made that way. I don't go on wild shopping sprees or just quit paying my bills. Other health concerns are a bigger problem now and more limiting. I feel so much more stable when I'm allowed to let my mood wander since it evens out.

I'd say if a doctor puts you on mood stabalizers without talking about what the depression is about, if you have real issues, or those which feel real which bring it on, and doesn't use a therapist who deals with those issues first with the patient, they are leaving out half the problem. And if you force the ups to dominate, then maybe these real issues just get buried.

For a lot of people who deal with a 'system of care' the mantra is therapists are expensive, and pills are cheap and this sort of thing does more harm than good.
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