Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Have you tried doing the dances the dancers do? It's not that easy. I think they're athletic. Scimpily clad yes, but they're not just laying around in their skimpy costumes. I was wondering what the Cardinals thought of each Marlin being paraded out by the Carnival girls. They really looked ridiculous. And Ali to throw the first pitch was so sad. Honor him in some other way. Seemed to accentuate how sick he is now instead of honoring him. And the national anthem. Didn't work in the 60's, still doesn't work now. We get it - they're trying to cater to Hispanics to get them to come to games. But come on - it still is America's national pastime. Couldn't they leave one thing American - the national anthem? I like Jose Feliciano, but I think he can only hit a certain range of notes so he "rearranged" the anthem to suit his voice and claimed he put his spin on it. We have Latin performers who can hit the notes of the anthem the way it's supposed to be sung. They should've used one of them. I think the game matched the festivities. About a 2 on a scale of 1 to 10. I do think the stadium is gorgeous!!!
you don't even know these girls....What would you rather see?? An empty pool??
whether i know these individuals personally has nothing to do with it - i'm not talking about 'them', i'm talking about a principle - a sports game is not the place for sexual display.
and since you asked, if there must be a pool in a ballpark (makes no sense to me, but ok, maybe it's a unique innovative marketing idea for the new ballpark) - if there's a pool there it should be for people to swim in; not be there for the purpose of being a sexual display area.
and whether the dances are easy or hard is not the point - the ONLY reason they are there is to shake their asses for men to look at -- it's a sexual display - has nothing whatsoever to do with the game, or cheerleading for the teams playing the game.
Miami's large immigrant & transplant population makes it hard for sports teams to gain traction in the area like they do in more provincial, traditional cities like say Chicago or Pittsburgh. I read somewhere that only 1/5 of Miami's population are locals (born and raised in the area). Even the Dolphins who are the "Gold" standard for sports teams in Miami have had trouble in recent years with attendance. It's the nature of the beast in South Florida, this is also why civic involvement is so low in the area. Too many people with strong ties with another city or country, not enough "Miamians".
Exactly. New Yorkers still love their mets and yankees, jets fans, Cubs Fans, Red Sox fans etc.. they are all over Miami. Immigrants still love their home countries which they left more but that is the way it is. Besides many of them don't like certain sports, people born in Argentina wont like Baseball or Football much but might like Basketball etc..
I think in about 10-15 more years you will see much stronger fan bases for Miami sports as the people in my age group are getting out of college and grad school etc.. and are still fans of the Miami teams no matter where we are in the country. If you watch Miami teams away games more and more times there are fans of Miami teams in other cities for this reason. 10 years ago you would never find a Marlins fan in DC now you will find them.
The Dolphins recently have had their problems due to a terrible product and front office. Before their recent struggles they have never had an attendance problem and they were the exception to Miami sports being a historical franchise with long history in the area. Florida is a football state, with a long history of Football etc.. That is why they have always been the "Gold" standard not only in Miami but one of the better franchises in the NFL until the 2000s came around. Its been downhill ever since and its a shame. At least we now have the Heat which have really shown us in Miami what a well run organization can be like, at least recently.
The Heat are becoming the Dolphins now IMO. That is a good thing. They are establishing their history well and being around over 20 years now they have established a good fan base. They IMO are easily one of the top 5 ran sports franchises in this country on all aspects one could look at a team.
Anyway I was at the game last night. The Stadium is fantastic. One of the best I been too. It is great to have a real baseball stadium. Parking was fine until it was time to leave the garage, I think with time it will get better. As for what the stadium can do to the neighborhood I think some improvement can be expected. A lot? No, but I expect some.
As for last night, I expected more about the Marlins and their short yet fairly impressive history but I did not see that. I get what they are trying to do though. They are trying to get people to come to games and make it more of an event than about baseball and honestly in the transplant market we have here that might be a decent try. Even when the Miami Heat have had bad to mediocre seasons their attendence has never been horrible, because going to a heat game is more than just basketball it is a place to see people, its an "event" and I think the Marlins are trying to make it somewhat like that. I was not a big fan of the pregame things they did, I wanted more Baseball. But its one time, who cares, I am happy about a great ballpark and excited to go back. I will say the Energy Team needs to go! First they suck, second that does not belong in baseball. I am a fan of the sea creature thing race though. Thought it was funny. I know Milwaukeehas their sausage race and DC has the presidents, so not an orginal idea but a good one to bring it down here.
Quote:
Originally Posted by knowledgeiskey
I think that's the case in most Sunbelt cities.
Not like Miami, Miami has far more international people who never followed professional sports in the US before they recently moved here if they even follow it now.
Quote:
Originally Posted by catt6
whether i know these individuals personally has nothing to do with it - i'm not talking about 'them', i'm talking about a principle - a sports game is not the place for sexual display.
and since you asked, if there must be a pool in a ballpark (makes no sense to me, but ok, maybe it's a unique innovative marketing idea for the new ballpark) - if there's a pool there it should be for people to swim in; not be there for the purpose of being a sexual display area.
and whether the dances are easy or hard is not the point - the ONLY reason they are there is to shake their asses for men to look at -- it's a sexual display - has nothing whatsoever to do with the game, or cheerleading for the teams playing the game.
A. Pools have been used at other baseball stadiums before.
B. Is no one else allowed to use the pool? Are we sure those two women are paid?
C. Who care if they were, this is capitalism. I am sure they do not mind making money doing nothing. What in the world is wrong about people trying to make money?
D. Ever sports game outside of high school is about money.
yep aggrocrag, dancers prancing around in booty shorts is equally as bad.... and yep you're correct about the whole quasi-hooker-bottle service-club scene bullshyte. i don't live right in the middle of that so it's easy enough to distance myself from that world. and my own personal opinion about the clubs here is they're crap anyway; i never go to them unless i am on stage as the entertainment (i'm a musician) - but since these days it's mostly DJ's anyway i'm very rarely in ANY club in Miami.
And it's not that the bikini girls in the pool at the stadium 'specifically' "bother me so much" -- and neither is it that "living in a city where a large part of its tourism industry is based on the objectification of women".... it's that this kind of thing has once again become pervasive across the whole of modern American culture. It's not just THIS city - it's the whole country; as if we've erased the 60's and 70's, and rewound our cultural sensibilities straight back to 1955..... in which an entire new generation of young women are absolutely FINE with being paid to do nothing more than be sexual eyecandy for horny men at events which have NOTHING to do with sex, and en entire new generation of young men who see absolutely nothing at all inappropriate about bringing sexual innuendo, along with objects for their sexy viewing pleasure, into completely NON-sexual activities.
now, i'm not all 'up in arms' about it - i just notice it when i see it. and have no problem ignoring it - but it's still disheartening to notice.
See, I respect that and understand where you're coming from. I have sisters myself and I don't know what I'd do if they got involved in half the stuff I saw go down in Miami. I've known a couple girls that stopped going to college so they could exercise all day and look right so they can bag a rich guy (Yes, they literally told me that). Lol, just shameful behavior. In this instance, though, I just didn't see a big deal with those girls in the pool, I dunno maybe because I'm guy I didn't look at it the same way a woman might. Maybe the girls in the pool and bottle service girls are different ends of the same "sexual objectification" continuum but I thought it was harmless ::shrug::
Quote:
Originally Posted by valicky
Have you tried doing the dances the dancers do? It's not that easy. I think they're athletic. Scimpily clad yes, but they're not just laying around in their skimpy costumes. I was wondering what the Cardinals thought of each Marlin being paraded out by the Carnival girls. They really looked ridiculous. And Ali to throw the first pitch was so sad. Honor him in some other way. Seemed to accentuate how sick he is now instead of honoring him. And the national anthem. Didn't work in the 60's, still doesn't work now. We get it - they're trying to cater to Hispanics to get them to come to games. But come on - it still is America's national pastime. Couldn't they leave one thing American - the national anthem? I like Jose Feliciano, but I think he can only hit a certain range of notes so he "rearranged" the anthem to suit his voice and claimed he put his spin on it. We have Latin performers who can hit the notes of the anthem the way it's supposed to be sung. They should've used one of them. I think the game matched the festivities. About a 2 on a scale of 1 to 10. I do think the stadium is gorgeous!!!
The Ali part was sad and awkward, just not very well thought out at all. It seemed so festive before that - you had all those dancers, the music, jets flying overhead and then they wheel out Ali . You could even tell the fans at the park didn't know what to do, they seemed to cheer for maybe 10 seconds then got quiet.
The park is great, though, I hope to visit it soon
This goes way beyond having a pool inside a stadium... the idea of someone willing to be "pool furniture" and someone willing to pay for that service is a rather uncomfortable thought.
Maybe I'll just have to deal with it and accept reality... but how am I to do that? How do you guys do that? Do you just crave in your mind that there is nothing wrong with it? Well, I just can't... maybe I need your enlightenment to see this issue from a different perspective. Just don't give me faulty reasoning like: "Would you rather see the pool empty?".
I can pretty much ignore it and go on in life like nothing is happening, but pretending something doesn't exist doesn't qualify as "dealing with it". Maybe it's one of those things you rather not deal with and just forget about.
Exactly. New Yorkers still love their mets and yankees, jets fans, Cubs Fans, Red Sox fans etc.. they are all over Miami. Immigrants still love their home countries which they left more but that is the way it is. Besides many of them don't like certain sports, people born in Argentina wont like Baseball or Football much but might like Basketball etc..
I think in about 10-15 more years you will see much stronger fan bases for Miami sports as the people in my age group are getting out of college and grad school etc.. and are still fans of the Miami teams no matter where we are in the country. If you watch Miami teams away games more and more times there are fans of Miami teams in other cities for this reason. 10 years ago you would never find a Marlins fan in DC now you will find them.
The Dolphins recently have had their problems due to a terrible product and front office. Before their recent struggles they have never had an attendance problem and they were the exception to Miami sports being a historical franchise with long history in the area. Florida is a football state, with a long history of Football etc.. That is why they have always been the "Gold" standard not only in Miami but one of the better franchises in the NFL until the 2000s came around. Its been downhill ever since and its a shame. At least we now have the Heat which have really shown us in Miami what a well run organization can be like, at least recently.
The Heat are becoming the Dolphins now IMO. That is a good thing. They are establishing their history well and being around over 20 years now they have established a good fan base. They IMO are easily one of the top 5 ran sports franchises in this country on all aspects one could look at a team.
Anyway I was at the game last night. The Stadium is fantastic. One of the best I been too. It is great to have a real baseball stadium. Parking was fine until it was time to leave the garage, I think with time it will get better. As for what the stadium can do to the neighborhood I think some improvement can be expected. A lot? No, but I expect some.
As for last night, I expected more about the Marlins and their short yet fairly impressive history but I did not see that. I get what they are trying to do though. They are trying to get people to come to games and make it more of an event than about baseball and honestly in the transplant market we have here that might be a decent try. Even when the Miami Heat have had bad to mediocre seasons their attendence has never been horrible, because going to a heat game is more than just basketball it is a place to see people, its an "event" and I think the Marlins are trying to make it somewhat like that. I was not a big fan of the pregame things they did, I wanted more Baseball. But its one time, who cares, I am happy about a great ballpark and excited to go back. I will say the Energy Team needs to go! First they suck, second that does not belong in baseball. I am a fan of the sea creature thing race though. Thought it was funny. I know Milwaukeehas their sausage race and DC has the presidents, so not an orginal idea but a good one to bring it down here.
All good points. I've gone to a handful of Heat games in Atlanta and Heat fans are LOUD and overpower Hawks fans. Why? Because those fans are Miamians who grew up in Miami rooting for the Heat. They care about the teams and even though they moved away still have pride in the city. There are many passionate Miami sports fans scattered all over the country, it's just that in Miami they're outnumbered. Also, other than the Dolphins the Heat, Marlins & Panthers are fairly new, they don't have the history other teams like the Celtics or Cardinals have. The young Heat fans growing up with this team right now will be fans for life (hopefully!) and their support will be passed on to the next generation. That is how you get 30-year season ticket waiting lists for the Green Bay Packers, fandom like that is multi-generational. Miami is a young sports city with unique demographics but it'll get better.
The racing sea creatures is funny, if not original. Though, they should've gone with food items - A Cuban Sandwich, a Conch Fritter, and maybe a Pastelito
I hope it looks beautiful-it's cost the taxpayers almost $500 million so far.
For the foreseeable future not one Miami-Dade tax payer will pay a penny to this stadium. It is planned to be financed by tourist tax dollars. How that will work out in 20-30 years I am not sure.
Was it a great deal? No
But is it as bad as everyone is making it out to be, I do not think so. I am in the middle on what this deal did/meant etc.. But hey, the actual amount of money that it might effect me its pretty small and I am happy to have a great ball park near by.
Quote:
Originally Posted by aggrocrag
All good points. I've gone to a handful of Heat games in Atlanta and Heat fans are LOUD and overpower Hawks fans. Why? Because those fans are Miamians who grew up in Miami rooting for the Heat. They care about the teams and even though they moved away still have pride in the city. There are many passionate Miami sports fans scattered all over the country, it's just that in Miami they're outnumbered. Also, other than the Dolphins the Heat, Marlins & Panthers are fairly new, they don't have the history other teams like the Celtics or Cardinals have. The young Heat fans growing up with this team right now will be fans for life (hopefully!) and their support will be passed on to the next generation. That is how you get 30-year season ticket waiting lists for the Green Bay Packers, fandom like that is multi-generational. Miami is a young sports city with unique demographics but it'll get better.
The racing sea creatures is funny, if not original. Though, they should've gone with food items - A Cuban Sandwich, a Conch Fritter, and maybe a Pastelito
Great post, and yes your right! I like the food idea a lot
The park is fantastic. I love that it's a neighborhood ballpark. Better than a downtown park imo. Monday and Wednesday I arrived about 45 minutes early and there very little traffic and lots of parking options.
The problem with the tax dollars being used (tourist tax - but still tax dollars being used) was that the organization lied and certain politicians turned a blind eye towards the lies. I read in the paper at least two years before the ballpark was approved how the Marlins organization was in the top in profits. They spend the least and make the most. They should not have gotten tax help in any shape or form. The Yankees on the other hand spend the most and run in the red. That organization loves its baseball. Not Loria and Samson. They could care less about baseball - it's all about the $$$$. Yes, they are a business and should be profitable, but not they way they go about it. Didn't I read something about Loria being the cause for ruining baseball and the Expos in Montreal?
Anyone else miss our announcers on TV last night? I was really hoping that they could've been the ones to handle opening night. It's not the same when ESPN does it. I think our announcers, both in English and Spanish are some of the best in baseball.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Honor him in some other way. Seemed to accentuate how sick he is now instead of honoring him. And the national anthem. Didn't work in the 60's, still doesn't work now. We get it - they're trying to cater to Hispanics to get them to come to games. But come on - it still is America's national pastime. Couldn't they leave one thing American - the national anthem? I like Jose Feliciano, but I think he can only hit a certain range of notes so he "rearranged" the anthem to suit his voice and claimed he put his spin on it. We have Latin performers who can hit the notes of the anthem the way it's supposed to be sung. They should've used one of them. I think the game matched the festivities. About a 2 on a scale of 1 to 10. 
I do think the stadium is gorgeous!!! 
but that is the way it is. Besides many of them don't like certain sports, people born in Argentina wont like Baseball or Football much but might like Basketball etc.. 
. You could even tell the fans at the park didn't know what to do, they seemed to cheer for maybe 10 seconds then got quiet.
