Condo Collapse and insurance

[MadManofBethesda]

Originally Posted by logybogy

Sadly, the condo association was under insured. There is only $48 Million in total insurance on losses exceeding $100 Million in market value. The land is going to have to be sold to a developer to make this deficit up and the fight will be monstrous between survivors wanting compensation for their property loss and families of the deceased filing suit.

You don't insure a property for market value, you insure it for the cost to rebuild it. If you have a house that would cost $250k to rebuild, but in this crazy market is worth $750k, you wouldn't insure it for $750k. And you definitely wouldn't include the value of the land in the amount you'd insure. Now I have no idea what it would cost to rebuild Champlain Towers South, not that they're going to, but that would be the appropriate amount of property loss insurance they should have. As for their liability coverage ($18M according to the article), I have no idea what the proper amount, or even what a reasonable amount of liability coverage would be. I've carried a $1,000,000 umbrella policy for decades, and that's just me, so I would think a condominium association would or should have carried more than $18M, but again, I have no idea what's normally done.

And speaking of the land, I would think most of the value of those condominium units are in the land itself. A small sliver of land next to the Deauville Resort at 67th & Collins sold for $40 million a couple of years ago, and that parcel is much, much smaller than what the Champlain Towers South Association owns. IIRC, the land sold for about $1,000 per square foot. So when the land ultimately is sold to a developer, that's easily going to more than double the amount of money available to compensate people and families. Not that any amount is going to be enough.














https://www.miamiherald.com/news/loc...252497003.html[/quote]

[middle-aged mom]

According to this the association maintained $48 million in insurance; $30 million in property and $18 million in general liability.

https://www.miamiherald.com/news/loc...252497003.html

All things considered, it appears seriously underinsured. Obviously no one anticipated the collapse and subsequent demolition of the rest of the structure.

It’s my understanding the association only recently had enough owner votes to secure a $15 million loan for restoration. Owners were assessed an average of $120,000 ( ranges $ 80,000-336,000) and had until 7/1 to either pay in full or enter into a 15 year repayment plan. With interest, this would have added an incremental $500-2000 month to the assessment.

Not all of the $15 million was earmarked for structural challenges. Some was allocated to lobby and hallway updating. Not likely the loan was fully funded prior to the 7/1 deadline.

Generally speaking, most associations require a 2/3 vote in favor of a special assessment. Achieving that sort of buy- in takes time, serious time to achieve and no question some owners probably thought it frivolous or that the board was lining their own pockets with kickbacks.

It’s likely at least one board member is among the missing and all have lost their units, like every other owner.

[City Guy997S]

From the article posted above:

“There’s going to be a very serious allocation issue between those people who tragically lost loved ones and those who were lucky enough to only lose property,” Miami-Dade Circuit Judge Michael Hanzman said during the Zoom hearing.

48mm- 30mm for property, 18 in liability.

So 30mm/the number of owners. 18mm/the number of deaths.

30mm/300 units would be 100K each. 18mm/150 deaths = 120K each.

That is rough math, obviously zero for lawyers compensation and zero for injured people but clearly shows there won't be enough proceeds for everyone.

[WRM20]

Originally Posted by ChicagoMeO

if they didn't get flood insurance, and if flooding was the cause, they are out of luck. it may take a long time to determine.

Flooding has a specific definition that does not apply in this situation.

[Charlie&Rose]

I imanage there will be mega GoFund Me collections for families. Maybe even celebs will come out to raise money for these people, that lost everything....at least they have their lives.

[staystill]

Originally Posted by madmanofbethesda

you don't insure a property for market value, you insure it for the cost to rebuild it. If you have a house that would cost $250k to rebuild, but in this crazy market is worth $750k, you wouldn't insure it for $750k. And you definitely wouldn't include the value of the land in the amount you'd insure. Now i have no idea what it would cost to rebuild champlain towers south, not that they're going to, but that would be the appropriate amount of property loss insurance they should have. As for their liability coverage ($18m according to the article), i have no idea what the proper amount, or even what a reasonable amount of liability coverage would be. I've carried a $1,000,000 umbrella policy for decades, and that's just me, so i would think a condominium association would or should have carried more than $18m, but again, i have no idea what's normally done.

And speaking of the land, i would think most of the value of those condominium units are in the land itself. A small sliver of land next to the deauville resort at 67th & collins sold for $40 million a couple of years ago, and that parcel is much, much smaller than what the champlain towers south association owns. Iirc, the land sold for about $1,000 per square foot. So when the land ultimately is sold to a developer, that's easily going to more than double the amount of money available to compensate people and families. Not that any amount is going to be enough.



They could all be broke for a few years before a developer has the money to rebuild on the land. To many homeowners to pay. I must ask you is your umbrella insurance tied in with your auto insurance? Mine is that is to say my umbrella insurance is on the same policy my auto insurance bill is on. So it looks to me like it's attached to auto accident not home hazard. Is yours the same? Are all umbrella policies the same?










https://www.miamiherald.com/news/loc...252497003.html

[/quote]

[staystill]

Originally Posted by kidyankee764

I was wondering the same, but highly doubt a flood is the cause.

A slow leak maybe that left a constant puddle maybe. This happened in Hackensack NJ many years ago.
part of the building collapsed due to a slow leak that was never fixed. Constant water flow into a puddle. It wore down the concrete in the parking garage then one day it just collapsed. If I remember correctly it was a little after 2001. People were freaking out when the were told no you can't get your pet or clothes to stay in a hotel. I know I would go in anyway to get my pet or they would have to sedate me to stop me.

[ChicagoMeO]

Do you all remember the cars still parked over to the left of your tv screen, right next to the part of the building that still was standing till they demolished it the other day. Could any of those cars have been able to be moved before the building came down on them? or did they get buried in rubble too?