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Old 04-14-2011, 08:03 PM
 
847 posts, read 1,671,280 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mike0618 View Post
Thats how they keep control. If the people are fighting amoungst themselves they ignore the wrongdoings and stealing of those in charge.
not 'they'........YOU. stop.
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Old 04-14-2011, 08:09 PM
 
847 posts, read 1,671,280 times
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if they took away public assistance and started up 'programs' i feel it would not work. why? because the government is as corrupt as they come. i've heard stories from cps employees where they say the people they see are corrupt and the people working in cps are corrupt. also, who exactly is going to do this? who would they hire? who would set it up? you would need top quality people with years of wisdom and experience. they wouldn't do that. they would hire whomever (friends?) just to get it in place to shut people up. they don't care, the government doesn't care. the government has no clue when it comes to raising or teaching children from good homes. the government does not do good with things of morality or progressive thinking. government funded sterilization already.
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Old 04-14-2011, 09:37 PM
 
Location: Southern Minnesota
5,990 posts, read 11,854,461 times
Reputation: 3264
Quote:
Originally Posted by mike0618 View Post
Thank goodness for the right to bear arms and protect yourself.
This attitude is exactly what leads to gun crime, violence and death in this country. Does Canada have these problems? Europe? Asia? No! Why? They keep tight controls on guns!

Fewer guns = fewer gun deaths. This has been shown time and time again. Don't believe what you hear on Fox News or at Tea Party rallies! And don't mention places like Mexico, because the anti-gun laws there are not enforced.

I am personally opposed to killing anyone for any reason (I'm a pacifist), but even if I wasn't, I still wouldn't own a gun. There are more effective ways to defend yourself than carrying a deadly killing tool around.

The more I read the news and these forums, the less I think about moving back home to Michigan. This state has gotten really scary in the past few years, and it's not just the inner-city criminals that have me worried.
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Old 04-15-2011, 01:28 PM
 
3,081 posts, read 2,905,755 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tjay View Post
not 'they'........YOU. stop.
They means government...
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Old 04-15-2011, 01:31 PM
 
3,081 posts, read 2,905,755 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by northstar22 View Post
This attitude is exactly what leads to gun crime, violence and death in this country. Does Canada have these problems? Europe? Asia? No! Why? They keep tight controls on guns!

Fewer guns = fewer gun deaths. This has been shown time and time again. Don't believe what you hear on Fox News or at Tea Party rallies! And don't mention places like Mexico, because the anti-gun laws there are not enforced.

I am personally opposed to killing anyone for any reason (I'm a pacifist), but even if I wasn't, I still wouldn't own a gun. There are more effective ways to defend yourself than carrying a deadly killing tool around.

The more I read the news and these forums, the less I think about moving back home to Michigan. This state has gotten really scary in the past few years, and it's not just the inner-city criminals that have me worried.
Yes fewer guns means fewer deaths but by restriction to bear arms just makes it harder for the law abiding to protect themselves. The criminal element will find a way to a gun, knife or some sort of weapon. It is the ill prepared will become victoms when they cannot protect themselves.
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Old 04-15-2011, 01:35 PM
 
Location: Loving life in Gaylord!
4,121 posts, read 7,948,839 times
Reputation: 3895
Right now its a free-for-all in Flint. If you wanna kill someone, chances are there is nothing really stopping you.... you dont really care, so what the heck. But...its not all of Flint, just parts. I go to the good parts of Flint all the time, and have no problems at all.
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Old 04-15-2011, 06:00 PM
 
Location: SE Michigan
6,191 posts, read 15,846,584 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by michmoldman View Post
Right now its a free-for-all in Flint. If you wanna kill someone, chances are there is nothing really stopping you.... you dont really care, so what the heck. But...its not all of Flint, just parts. I go to the good parts of Flint all the time, and have no problems at all.
Ditto this...I lived in Flint from 2004-2010 on the east side and had no problems. It's more who you hang out with and the activities you choose that will put you in a vulnerable situation....crime is not usually random, especially for anyone who exercises common sense in their friends and activities.

As for the gun debate I am sure that's been argued on eleventy-hundred threads in other parts of the site and not suitable here. So, northstar, whatevah. You live in a little, almost all-white, low-crime town. Most uber-liberals do. I used to be an uber-liberal as well, until I started actually getting out in the world. It is really easy to be an uber-liberal when you never challenge yourself or your beliefs.

Except for the tragic deaths of a few children and one or two folks who were victims of home invasions, every person killed in Flint over the last year or two had criminal records and were already "running with the big dogs." You run with the big dogs and lose, well....I guess it sucks to be you if you die and I have little sympathy.
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Old 04-15-2011, 07:38 PM
 
12,486 posts, read 7,583,753 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zthatzmanz28 View Post
I know folks who are / were unemployed with low hopes and on the edge--folks who also have access to guns--they didn't go around shootin' others...

I tend to think its STUPIDITY mixed with the other parts that cause random shooting and a complete lack of respect for self and others...

Not that this even justifies or rationalizes the murders...
Yeah......well you did not grow up where some of us grew up either. There is a clear link between socioeconomic conditions and violence in the black community, just like it was in poor white communities during the era of prohibition. There is money to be made by bringing banned products to customers and a lot of poor people see this as their conduit out of poverty or a means of survival. Violence escalates as a means of gaining or protecting ones markets and or settling outstanding debts.

Whats amazing to me is that people have less problems with wars, collateral damage and the like than they do with street crimes. I mean, how can a nation on one hand teach and preach that violence is wrong, when it drops 500 lb bombs in nations killing innocent men women and children, as well as the target it aims at?

I don't condone violence but having grew up in the inner-city around killers.......I understand it a lot better than those on the outside looking in. I almost became a killer when I was 17......because I feared for my life. I knew that the police would not and could not protect me....and I would rather be in jail than dead. A dude was mad that his girl dumped him and was dating me and he had already done time for non-fatally shooting someone but was young enough to have gotten out when he turned 18. The most fortunate thing in my life was that there was a raid on a drug house and this dude was caught up and got sent to prison. I had access to guns from one of my brothers.


The thing about it is that unless you have walked in the shoes of others......you don't know what you do if you were in their situation.
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Old 04-15-2011, 07:50 PM
 
Location: On the brink of WWIII
21,093 posts, read 24,761,383 times
Reputation: 7812
Quote:
Originally Posted by Indentured Servant View Post
Yeah......well you did not grow up where some of us grew up either. There is a clear link between socioeconomic conditions and violence in the black community, just like it was in poor white communities during the era of prohibition. There is money to be made by bringing banned products to customers and a lot of poor people see this as their conduit out of poverty or a means of survival. Violence escalates as a means of gaining or protecting ones markets and or settling outstanding debts.

Whats amazing to me is that people have less problems with wars, collateral damage and the like than they do with street crimes. I mean, how can a nation on one hand teach and preach that violence is wrong, when it drops 500 lb bombs in nations killing innocent men women and children, as well as the target it aims at?

I don't condone violence but having grew up in the inner-city around killers.......I understand it a lot better than those on the outside looking in. I almost became a killer when I was 17......because I feared for my life. I knew that the police would not and could not protect me....and I would rather be in jail than dead. A dude was mad that his girl dumped him and was dating me and he had already done time for non-fatally shooting someone but was young enough to have gotten out when he turned 18. The most fortunate thing in my life was that there was a raid on a drug house and this dude was caught up and got sent to prison. I had access to guns from one of my brothers.


The thing about it is that unless you have walked in the shoes of others......you don't know what you do if you were in their situation.

How are my shoes fitting? A wee bit tight?

Playing the socio-economic race card does not JUSTIFY murder...thou shall not kill--except when you are depressed, unemployed, and on the edge..and black???

I do know that cappin' someone for a pair of Air Jordans is wrong...and He is wrong for promoting cheap shoes made with child labor for less than $1.00 and selling for more than $100....

I am pretty sure when I lost EVERYTHING I didn't go out shooting my neighbors or their dogs....

I have (if it be known) walked in many shoes--so before I am judged-maybe we can look at the real issue-

MURDER can never be JUSTIFIED by playin any card

And any one who thinks killin people ain"t STUPID??
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Old 04-15-2011, 07:59 PM
 
12,486 posts, read 7,583,753 times
Reputation: 4755
Quote:
Originally Posted by chiroptera View Post
Unfortunately there's plenty of baby gangbangers coming of age...remember the 14-year-old who shot and killed the elderly woman in a home invasion last year, or the 18-year-old recently in the news with several murders under his belt...it's a really sad thing. Granted the vast majority of murder victims in Flint were no angels and were involved in gangs and drugs and crime.

I don't spook easily, someone in the photography section of C-D started a "hood photos" thread. A few years ago I would have been way up for that, would have grabbed my camera and gone driving around taking photos....but nowadays I am more cautious. I have a neighbor who listens to the scanner a lot, and he tells me of so much stuff that never makes the news...no way am I going to be driving around the north or parts of the east side taking photos. Although I think it would be really a fun thing to do.

I predict there is going to be a continued uptick in citizens arming themselves and getting CCW permits, and I am one of them. In the last month two people shot would-be criminals in Flint, one killed when he tried to rob a small store, another man shot by a woman when he broke into her home at night. We're going to see more stories like this in the coming year.
This is the contradiction I see. What are you going to do with those guns if you are confronted.....and how does that make you different from those you consider thugs?

You see, very few people consider that people in the inner-city are carrying guns for protection......and often use them out of fear for their own lives.....just like you buy guns and will use them to protect your lives. A lot more murders are self defense than you think. The fact that someone may have a criminal record, involved in a shooting, does not mean that the person was not acting in self defence. A person could be making a drug buy and the supposed seller pulls out a gun and the buyer, in fear for his life, pulls out his gun and is able to shoot the guy first. The fact that they were engaged in illegal activity will almost certainly rule out any chances that the murder will be seen as self defense, especially if the guns are illegal. If you have certain types of felonies you can't legally own a gun....but that does not mean that you don't want to feel protected......just like all the people who arm themselves out the fear of crime they hear on the news. Well.....when you are on the front lines.....would you not think that people in the inner-city need more protection than you...and that they are more likely to shot and kill someone because of the environment they are in? I mean, if they fear of hearing about crime on the news inspires more people to carry guns who don't really live in high crime areas, then does it not make sense that more people in the inner-city are arming themselves and using them......just people who hear about in the suburbs would do?

Last edited by Indentured Servant; 04-15-2011 at 08:12 PM..
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