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I'm thinking seriously about joining the National Guard. I have a college degree, but right now I think I'd rather enlist first. I have friends in the military and they've all said the only officers that they respect are prior enlisted, so I'd rather get my hands dirty first and then put in an officer packet later. Can anyone on this form advise me on this decision?
I have a civilian job (professional career) so I'd have to leave it temporarily for basic/AIT. I'm in good health, 26 years old, female, single, no kids. I can't see anything that could hold them back from taking me. I also meet the height/weight requirements but I am out of shape so I have to work on my running.
I'm thinking I'd like to become either a supply specialist or a combat medic (yeah, I know...completely different from each other, lol).
Should I just go talk to a NG recruiter and take the ASVAB and then go from there?
I have a college degree, but right now I think I'd rather enlist first. I have friends in the military and they've all said the only officers that they respect are prior enlisted, so I'd rather get my hands dirty first and then put in an officer packet later. Can anyone on this form advise me on this decision?
Bull.
You will be respected for how you act. The UCMJ takes care of the rest.
You will be respected for how you act. The UCMJ takes care of the rest.
"they've all said", well, I won't comment.
Go for whatever you can get.
Do you really believe this? I don't know if personally, I'd be comfortable being in charge of soldiers doing a job that I never did from the enlisted side. Being a 1LT with no experience is akin to being a private but at a higher pay grade but then you have privates looking to you as a leader when you have no idea how to lead.
Then there's the fact that in my civilian job I'm an established leader, and it could be nice to have a break from making decisions and just having someone tell me what to do instead. If I get sick of it I can always put in a packet.
If I was going to go active Army I'd absolutely go to OCS and not waste time being enlisted, but for NG when it's part time it's different. If I get deployed as an enlisted then that's just more experience for when/if I decide to do NG OCS.
So, I dunno. I'm still iffy but I really think it might be a good idea to do it this way.
IF that Officer with no enlisted time, comes in and actually listens to his Senior NCO and pays attention to him/her then that Officer has the respect from the enlisted.
IF that Officer comes in with no enlisted time and does NOT listen to his Senior NCO (which happenes A LOT) then that Officer will not gain the respect of his enlisted, UCMJ or not.
IF that Officer has enlisted time, he/she understands what it is like being enlisted and has a better chance of being respected by the enlisted.
UCMJ does not equal respect, UCMJ means you must respect that persons rank, not that person.
I served in the U.S. Army 22 years continuous active duty.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pepper Potts
I don't know if personally, I'd be comfortable being in charge of soldiers doing a job that I never did from the enlisted side. Being a 1LT with no experience is akin to being a private but at a higher pay grade but then you have privates looking to you as a leader when you have no idea how to lead.
What makes you think you would start as a 1LT? The bottom starts at 2LT.
Commissioned officers are leaders, they get assigned leadership positions, they may learn from those enlisted people who are experienced, but they don't really do the same job... Rank is an issue some civilians do not understand. The lowest ranking officer outranks the highest ranking enlisted person. That is a fact. Being enlisted is not really designed to be a stepping stone to being an officer, it happens, but that is not the great plan.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pepper Potts
Then there's the fact that in my civilian job I'm an established leader, and it could be nice to have a break from making decisions and just having someone tell me what to do instead. If I get sick of it I can always put in a packet.
If you don't want to make decisions, perhaps you should re-think the military. Everyone in the militay makes certain decisions. Many of them are life threatening...
Good experience for most. They get out and they have learned leadership the hard way (maybe).
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pepper Potts
If I was going to go active Army I'd absolutely go to OCS and not waste time being enlisted, but for NG when it's part time it's different. If I get deployed as an enlisted then that's just more experience for when/if I decide to do NG OCS.
So now enlisted is a waste of time.
NG part time? We go through this frequently. Will reply later on this.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pepper Potts
So, I dunno. I'm still iffy but I really think it might be a good idea to do it this way.
My advice, apply to be an officer right now, if you make it then go for it, you will most likely not regret it.
Rich
Last edited by Poncho_NM; 11-12-2010 at 07:23 PM..
If you have a college degree apply to be an officer now. IMO , the only reason someone should go enlisted first if their desire is to be an officer is b/c they don't currently meet the requirements and will enlist to get hem. I.e. don't have a college degree nor money to get a degree on your own. Or not competitive for a commission due to your PFT.
I served in the U.S. Army 22 years continuous active duty.
What makes you think you would start as a 1LT? The bottom starts at 2LT.
Commissioned officers are leaders, they get assigned leadership positions, they may learn from those enlisted people who are experienced, but they don't really do the same job... Rank is an issue some civilians do not understand. The lowest ranking officer outranks the highest ranking enlisted person. That is a fact. Being enlisted is not really designed to be a stepping stone to being an officer, it happens, but that is not the great plan.
If you don't want to make decisions, perhaps you should re-think the military. Everyone in the militay makes certain decisions. Many of them are life threatening...
Good experience for most. They get out and they have learned leadership the hard way (maybe).
So now enlisted is a waste of time.
NG part time? We go through this frequently. Will reply later on this.
My advice, apply to be an officer right now, if you make it then go for it, you will most likely not regret it.
Rich
This. How you are as a person and a soldier first and as an officer will determine the level respect you get, not so much prior enlisted time. Not saying you should not stay enlisted for a few years first, but I would not worry too much on what your friends say.
That being said know what you are getting into. You may deploy at some point to a war zone. And when you are stateside, hopefully your civilian job can accomodate without drama the time off you need for the Guard, especially for drills that start on Fridays, annual training, military schools and occasional temporary duty training your unit may send you to. And of course be ready to mobilize at a moment's notice for riots, wildfires, floods and other civil emergencies. If you become a leader especially at the platoon or company level and above, you will probably find yourself juggling your work and daily life while planning/coordinating for the next drill, reading numerous emails, signing memos, attending conference calls and the like during your personal time.
But it can help you develop as a person and help build character. It will be for you what you make of it. Talking to a NG recruiter is fine and you can also try taking a practice ASVAB first.
I was a Mustang (that's what such officers are called) and I can't speak to whether or not my men respected me. You'd have to ask them.
What I CAN speak to, though, is me and I'm positively sure it made me a better officer in so far as fulfilling my two basic jobs: Perform the mission and take care of the troops. Having held every rank between E-1 and E-7 before obtaining a commission, I knew more about what was going on down at the squad and platoon levels than any "pure" officer I knew. They issued orders and expected them to be carried out whether they were logical or not simply because they didn't know any better. I issued orders with an understanding of how those orders would be carried and what tools they'd need which made life easier for my troops and resulted in, I think, better results.
What it did NOT do, though, was make me better at kissing azz at Battalion HQ or higher. Having been on the receiving end of officers who put their careers above all else and who allowed their troops to be jerked around by idiotic staff officers because they didn't want to "rock the boat," made me something of an unwanted presence among my fellow officers. I had a reputation for getting things done and sort of "specialized" in taking over troubled units and making them better, but I was not well loved because I didn't tolerate fools well. And, believe me, there are a LOT of fools in the officer corps.
The downside is that someone I'd pizzed off (I still don't know who) and who was adept at "the game" shafted me and ended my career after 15 years. It's a long story which I won't go into, but that's how it ended up. I wasn't discharged or brought up on charges or anything like, just moved out of the way.
That's a risk you too might take, so consider it as a possibility before choosing.
So you've got yourself absolutely convinced that you need to be enlisted before being commissioned. Contrary to what you may think, we've had quite a few highly-respected and revered officers that have led others into what became victorious battles over the course of history and many of them had no enlisted experience You also think that being enlisted you'll get to "take a break from making decisions". Alrighty then. Just don't tell that to Sergeant Giunta who just got awarded the Medal of Honor recently (yes I know he's AD and not Guard), or the countless other enlisted people of past and present who took a break from making decisions so they could lead, take care of others and use their training and expertise to play their vital roles in defending the nation.
It sounds like you've already made your decision, albeit one not supported by sound logic but hey, you might just like the Guard anyway so why bother posing questions here first? Go ahead and enlist, nothing wrong with that (just lose the crappy reasoning for doing so). Besides, the fewer people who apply to become officers, the easier that makes things for the rest of the applicants.
you might just like the Guard anyway so why bother posing questions here first?
Because the original poster asked for help, some advice and some opinions. The individual is considering becoming a member of the military. That is what this forum is about.
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You also think that being enlisted you'll get to "take a break from making decisions". Alrighty then. Just don't tell that to Sergeant Giunta who just got awarded the Medal of Honor recently (yes I know he's AD and not Guard), or the countless other enlisted people of past and present who took a break from making decisions so they could lead, take care of others and use their training and expertise to play their vital roles in defending the nation. 
