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The responsibility for the waitlist issue has to go right to the highest level.
If you are in charge of 100 entities, whether they are organizations or individuals, and you have goals set for all of them to meet, you might have 10 that fail, 80 that are average, and 10 that excel. You cannot just look at what the 10 that fail are doing wrong, you also need to look at the 10 that excel, to find out what the other 90 should be doing. At that point you should be able to figure out if the 10, that are doing it well, are really doing it right or are merely gaming the system.
Those in charge at the VA failed to do that. They should be let go.
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[color=black][font=Verdana]The fourth problem is we need to educate veterans that just because the system is available and free (for the most part) to them, it doesn’t mean they have to use it. Why travel 60 miles to use the VA system when you have private insurance that covers you right at your local health care system, faster and without delays? I hate saying this but this entitlement mentality is getting out of hand regarding veterans and the military.
This is preposterous.
If there is a greater reason to feel entitled, madam, I haven't found it yet.
I think the VA is really to big and it is overtaxed by many looking for free health care when nothing was service related and pushing those with service related medical issue aside. I know several guys that use the VA and their issues had nothing to do with being in the military.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rabrrita
The fourth problem is we need to educate veterans that just because the system is available and free (for the most part) to them, it doesn’t mean they have to use it. Why travel 60 miles to use the VA system when you have private insurance that covers you right at your local health care system, faster and without delays? I hate saying this but this entitlement mentality is getting out of hand regarding veterans and the military.
I feel comments like this actually do more harm than good. No offense.
"The myths won’t die unless they are addressed publicly and clearly, so we present you with the most common we hear, and the straightforward answers they need.
Myth Number One
I wasn’t injured in the service, so I’m not eligible for VA health care.
Status: False
Myth Number Two
I can only receive care for service connected injuries.
Status: False
"We strongly encourage Veterans to receive all your health care through VA. However, if you choose to receive treatment from private doctors, VA will work with them to meet your health care needs and coordinate effective treatment".
If VA strongly encourage veterans to receive ALL health care through VA, then why does one have to accuse them of having sense of entitlement issues?
The VA’s own investigation is ongoing and will continue to attract attention as more revelations, like the claims about the Albuquerque VA, keep coming out.
I agree with your entire post. I'm not a VA patient, but worked as a nurse in training in the San Antonio VA Hospital and saw state of the art care (I was there 2001-2003) - cardiology service.
I'm skeptical about our country's ability to fulfill its commitment to provide VA care. The current crop of young military members will be accessing care in the VA hospitals for the next 75+ yrs. You know that the two wars in Afghanistan and Iraq will produce millions of patients with chronic mental and physical ailments.
I really don't have any answers for the problem other than to somehow outsource the care to civilian, non-VA providers.
Nobody in this entire scandal has criticized the quality of care they received, once they received it. I've known about this for months now and have even spoken to my Senators to speak with the Senators from AZ to see what the heck is going on.
Base on my knowledge, there is blame to go around to everyone.
First, the VA Healthcare system in AZ is, was, has been and will probably always be broken. It is way too small for the population resulting in problem after problems and solutions to fix those problems that aggravate problems elsewhere. Until the system itself is fixed, it’s just Band-Aids over wounds.
The second and most disgusting problem is that Congress has failed over and over to overhaul the VA Healthcare system while adding unfunded mandates. It’s easy for Congress to say the VA needs to do this and that but if you don’t fund it, problems are going to happen.
The third is AZ like some other areas, is inundated with visiting veterans with entitlement mentality. Come to AZ for the winter and use the Phoenix VA Hospital for all your needs and don’t use your own VA system where you come from for the rest of the year. I'm going to say what I think many in snowbird areas want to say. Prioritize care to residents over snowbirds, especially those who just walk in and start demanding services.
The fourth problem is we need to educate veterans that just because the system is available and free (for the most part) to them, it doesn’t mean they have to use it. Why travel 60 miles to use the VA system when you have private insurance that covers you right at your local health care system, faster and without delays? I hate saying this but this entitlement mentality is getting out of hand regarding veterans and the military.
The fifth and one everyone knew would cause problems is having a system in place with negative consequences for failing to meet targets, but not adjusting the targets based on demand. If the system can only see 500 scheduled people a day at the hospital and CBOC's, why are you making it a negative when they have a demand for 1,000 appointments a day? The VA wants these appointment set within X days of calling but the demand before the deception had already pushed it 6 times away from the target. If the VA knew AZ was flirting already with a full year delay and they see 30,000 new veterans enrolled in the year, how in hells name can they even think a 120 day target can be met? Why did the VA hold AZ VA to targets that have negative consequences if they fail to meet it if they know the numbers have already exceeded the entire yearly capacity? They were basically telling AZVA that we would rather you fake the numbers than be on record as not meeting the numbers.
The last item is the AZ VA found an easy solution; a veteran calls for an appointment, take the information, put them on a wait list, when the appointment open up within the target timeframe, contact the vet and set them up. If it takes 300 days for the appointment to open within the 120 period to meet target, you set the appointment and it looks like that person only waited 120 days instead of 420 days. If they die before the appointment, just erase their name and that’s it. To add insult to injury, that list isn’t official, it’s kept secret and unless you’re in the know, you never knew such a list existed. They were doing this and nobody anywhere except for veterans caught on. And when someone asked the VA what the heck? they just said they fixed the problem. Everyone who had any ability to end the scandal failed in their duty from the appointment setters all the way up to the Congress men who knew and did nothing.
Today the VA celebrated a ribbon cutting on a new CBOC in AZ, but there are no available appointments at that CBOC for 1 year, booked solid! I really don’t know what the solution is since it has gotten so far out of control there may be nothing to do but wait and die.
My solution as far as Arizona goes is like this. Another VA Medical Center must be built in Metro Phoenix. Having had just the one as the retiree population increased just does not do it. Veterans that are residents of Arizona should get preference for Appointments. This snow bird business is out of hand and is putting such a tremendous burden on Phoenix, they have faltered to say the least. It would be another matter if there were enough facilities and employees to handle all these snow bird Appointments.
There is no excuse to build a new clinic that opens just as this scandal is breaking, and then there are no appointments for 1 year. The NW Clinic in Surprise wouldn't give me an appointment period, the Phx VA hospital gave me an appt almost a year away. The song and dance I got from the Surprise clinic in my book was a disgrace. Several doctors had quit, so there isn't the manpower to handle the patients. So tell the Vet that were sorry but we can't offer you an appointment here. . Then hire more Doctors or close the damn clinic until it is operational. Selecting who goes and who doesn't is frightening in itself. I was a resident of Arizona at the time and not a snowbird.
The VA needs to hire more people as this is an agency, that let a number of people go thru Early retirements in the late 90's. I am one of them. The payroll had to be cut at that time, and this agency didn't waste anytime in retiring many of us at young ages. At least those of us that were able to go at the time, and had secured other employment. Now when they need employees to handle the large amount of Vets in these current times, they don't have them. So put the funding into hiring more workers, and enough facilities to handle all these vets. Or close the VA's period and have Veterans receive care on the outside at Gov't expense. It is one or the other. I don't see any other choices. Definitely a serious makeover is well over due on these issues.
Personally I think with a Veteran population the size of what Arizona has, especially Metro Phoenix. I think it is complete ignorance or arrogance, not to have dealth with this earlier. A serious lack of VA healthcare facilities and workers, in that Metro to handle so many people. It was a disaster just waiting to happen.
they opened satellite clinics in San Antonio. Much more convenient than having to travel to the Medical Center area and fight the traffic and then try to find a parking spot.
I agree with your entire post. I'm not a VA patient, but worked as a nurse in training in the San Antonio VA Hospital and saw state of the art care (I was there 2001-2003) - cardiology service.
I'm skeptical about our country's ability to fulfill its commitment to provide VA care. The current crop of young military members will be accessing care in the VA hospitals for the next 75+ yrs. You know that the two wars in Afghanistan and Iraq will produce millions of patients with chronic mental and physical ailments.
I really don't have any answers for the problem other than to somehow outsource the care to civilian, non-VA providers.
VA problems are certainly not new. All the men in my family have been eligible for VA medical for as long as there has been a VA (all the men in my family have been military since the Spanish-American War). There have always been problems with the VA. "Problems with VA" is like "Texas is hot in August."
This is nothing new, and I suspect you're right that it's just going to have to be outsourced. I don't know why that hasn't happened already.
Which leads me to believe that this is more of a management issue in Phoenix - and possibly a federal funding issue.
Senator John McCain - a disabled veteran himself - should have been ahead of this curve - and not behind it. Shame on him for not knowing all. Or knowing all and not doing anything about it.
Same holds true for Senator Jeff Flake. Shame on him for not knowing.
I've wondered about that. When anyone has problems with a government agency who do they call? Their rep in the Senate or Congress. If a vet has problems and gets no answers from the VA, that vet's (or a family member's) next call is probably to his elected rep. There's usually a staff member who handles veteran's affairs. (I know because I've dealt with them.)
Where have they been? Not just McCain and Flake but the Congressional reps. I'd find it hard to believe they weren't getting calls on this.
Last edited by DewDropInn; 05-21-2014 at 11:57 AM..
I've wondered about that. When anyone has problems with a government agency who do they call? Their rep in the Senate or Congress. If a vet has problems and gets no answers from the VA, that vet's (or a family member's) next call is probably to his elected rep. There's usually a staff member who handles veteran's affairs. (I know because I've dealt with them.)
Where have they been? Not just McCain and Flake but the Congressional reps. I'd find it hard to believe they weren't getting calls on this.
They were getting calls, and letters and people walking into their office. They knew for some time that the problem existed and they had talks with the VA, and they held meetings, and they had a hearing, and they appointed a panel to look at it, and they met again and again. Nothing was done.
The problem is not complex and the solution isn't complex, it only requires that Congress pass a VA budget sufficient to build and operate the amount of centers needed to meet the need. Phoenix needs at least 4 more CBOC's on top of the ones they already have. They have pleaded with Congress for the money and all they got was money to build one (1) new CBOC that is only replacing an existing one that will close.
If the region has a max capacity of only 680,000 appointments per year and the current population and appointment request extends to over 1,200,000, isn't it reasonable to assume that the region just can not accomodate the need? You have two options, reduce demand (which Congress refuses to consider) or increase handling capacity (which Congress refuses to do).
This is why Congress is not so willing to jump on the blame game because they know sooner or later the buck stops with them, so they go through the motions of hearings, investigations, head shaking and finger wagging but still have not told any veteran what to do.
Even the recent American Legion call for outers was not that well received by many veterans because they could care less who takes the fall, they want solutions. So you oust the VA head, what the heck does that do to solve a systemic problem? A new VA head will still be faced with a high demand for budget limited services. I recently heard a DAV Post Commander explain why tthey refuse to join other calling for heads to roll, he said something along the lines that Politicians and civilians look for blame, we are veterans and we look for solutions!
I've wondered about that. When anyone has problems with a government agency who do they call? Their rep in the Senate or Congress. If a vet has problems and gets no answers from the VA, that vet's (or a family member's) next call is probably to his elected rep. There's usually a staff member who handles veteran's affairs. (I know because I've dealt with them.)
Where have they been? Not just McCain and Flake but the Congressional reps. I'd find it hard to believe they weren't getting calls on this.
I found it hard to believe also that people were not calling their reps about this.
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