Mpls Southwest #1 High School....Again (Minneapolis, St. Paul: credit, top schools, incomes)

[uptown_urbanist]

Originally Posted by Camden Northsider

Correction to your statement and the follow-up commentary to it- the article's focus was on the "New North" HS and how students that live in Its geographic enrollment area are largely selecting Mpls- Henry, charter schools, suburban and/or other Mpls schools like SW. Nowhere is there an implication that Henry's feeder area is choosing SW or that Henry is having any difficulties with enrollment- in fact the opposite is true.

Thanks for the correction. I admit I was using terminology too casually (i.e. meant only the kids in the North High School area) and not giving Henry the attention it deserves -- as far as I know (as an outsider, as we don't live on that half of the city) Henry has enjoyed a strong reputation for some years now, and certainly I would not expect many students living in Henry's enrollment zone choosing to opt out. There's no need -- they already have a great option right near home!

[Min-Chi-Cbus]

Originally Posted by Ben Around

If this was true, St Paul Central wouldn't be on this list.

Are you telling me that households that are in poverty have similar or better chances of high education? Because everything I've heard is quite the opposite. If St. Paul Central has a high % of students in poverty then CLEARLY something great is working here and that dynamic is shifting! I'd be all for that!!

P.S. my family at one point was considered in poverty, so I am not trying to create a bias for/against impoverished students....just curious to see what's worked or hasn't worked, and why.

[Min-Chi-Cbus]

Originally Posted by Camden Northsider

Correction to your statement and the follow-up commentary to it- the article's focus was on the "New North" HS and how students that live in Its geographic enrollment area are largely selecting Mpls- Henry, charter schools, suburban and/or other Mpls schools like SW. Nowhere is there an implication that Henry's feeder area is choosing SW or that Henry is having any difficulties with enrollment- in fact the opposite is true.

I didn't say anything about Henry losing students, I was only (trying to) referring to those "New North" students and that geographic enrollment area. In other words, students who once would have gone to North High and can now have the option to re-enroll in the "New North High" have been also given the option to go to Henry and/or SW, and many have chosen those schools over going to "New North". Is that clearer?

If it came off as otherwise I apologize for the miscommunication (but not the message).

[Globe199]

Various threads keep rehashing the same tired arguments on this board. Here are the "facts" as established on city-data.com:

- Minneapolis and St Paul public schools suck, notwithstanding any data to the contrary
- Suburban schools districts are superior in every way, particularly those in the SE and SW areas
- School district alone is a far greater predictor of success in life, and in general well-being of the world and human existence in general, than parental support and involvement, which presumably ranks dead-last

Now that we accept these constructs as laws of the universe, can we move on?

[Min-Chi-Cbus]

Originally Posted by Globe199

Various threads keep rehashing the same tired arguments on this board. Here are the "facts" as established on city-data.com:

- Minneapolis and St Paul public schools suck, notwithstanding any data to the contrary
- Suburban schools districts are superior in every way, particularly those in the SE and SW areas
- School district alone is a far greater predictor of success in life, and in general well-being of the world and human existence in general, than parental support and involvement, which presumably ranks dead-last

Now that we accept these constructs as laws of the universe, can we move on?

I hope this is sarcasm, because the POINT of this thread was to show that city schools DON'T "suck" and have beaten their suburban counterparts in a recent poll. And don't get me started on the parents thing (again, if you're serious and not being sarcastic)!

[Mason3000]

Originally Posted by ferr0052

what areas in Minneapolis does southwest serve?

50th France/Edina border, Lake Harriet, Lake Calhoun, Uptown, Lake of the Isles, Kenwood. That's part of what I think some suburbanites don't get. Mpls SW is full of RICH KIDS. It's got all the kids from the Lake Harriet & Kenwood areas which are far wealthier and "upper class" than most suburbs. Much more on par with Edina/Minnetonka/Wayzata than with "inner city" schools. The poorer areas of Mpls SW district are still very upscale such as Uptown & the far SW neighborhoods like Fulton, Armatage & Kenny.

[pete6032]

The ranking methodology seems more comprehensive than just measuring AP or IB test scores. I don't know why some are claiming that that is all its based on.

Best High Schools Methodology - US News and World Report

National rankings
A three-step process determined the Best High Schools. The first two steps ensured that the schools serve all of their students well, using performance on state proficiency tests as the benchmarks. For those schools that made it past the first two steps, a third step assessed the degree to which schools prepare students for college-level work.

• Step 1: The first step determined whether each school's students were performing better than statistically expected for the average student in the state. We started by looking at reading and math results for all students on each state's high school proficiency tests. We then factored in the percentage of economically disadvantaged students (who tend to score lower) enrolled at the school to identify the schools that were performing better than statistical expectations.

• Step 2: For those schools that made it past this first step, the second step determined whether the school's least-advantaged students (black, Hispanic, and low-income) were performing better than average for similar students in the state. We compared each school's math and reading proficiency rates for disadvantaged students with the statewide results for these student groups and then selected schools that were performing better than this state average.

• Step 3: Schools that made it through the first two steps became eligible to be judged nationally on the final step—college-readiness performance—using Advanced Placement or International Baccalaureate test data as the benchmarks for success, depending on which program was largest at the school. AP is a College Board program that offers college-level courses at high schools across the country. The International Baccalaureate program also offers a college-level curriculum.

This third step measured which schools produced the best college-level achievement for the highest percentages of their students. This was done by computing a "college readiness index" based on the school's AP or IB participation rate (the number of 12th-grade students in the 2009-2010 academic year who took at least one AP or IB test before or during their senior year, divided by the number of 12th graders) and how well the students did on those tests.

The latter part, called quality-adjusted AP or IB participation rate, is the number of 12th-grade students in the 2009-2010 academic year who took and passed (received an AP score of 3 or higher or an IB score of 4 or higher) at least one of the tests before or during their senior year, divided by the number of 12th graders at that school. Any individual AP or IB subject test was considered when determining if a student took or passed at least one test.

For the college readiness index, the quality-adjusted participation rate was weighted 75 percent in the calculation, and the simple AP or IB participation rate was weighted 25 percent. The test that was taken by the most students at a particular school—either AP or IB—was used to calculate that school's college readiness index.

[Mason3000]

Originally Posted by pete6032

The ranking methodology seems more comprehensive than just measuring AP or IB test scores. I don't know why some are claiming that that is all its based on.

Best High Schools Methodology - US News and World Report

It's hard to understand how Mpls SW slipped through all those steps & data crunching to be erroneously named #1....again.

[northsub]

Originally Posted by pete6032

The ranking methodology seems more comprehensive than just measuring AP or IB test scores. I don't know why some are claiming that that is all its based on.

Best High Schools Methodology - US News and World Report

I'd suggest reading the methodology again.

The first 2 steps are just a baseline to be considered for the third. The rankings are only amongst all of the schools that clear the hurdles of the first 2.

Once you get the schools that clear the first 2 steps, then the ranking is completely based on AP and IB tests. The ranking is done by taking 1/4 of the percentage of seniors that have taken AP or IB tests and 3/4 of the seniors that have passed at least one AP or IB test (but only considering the most prevalent test at a given school).

When U.S. News says that school A is better than school B what they mean is that (1) both schools cleared the first 2 steps and (2) school A had more kids taking/passing AP and IB exams than school B.

The holes in this methodology seem pretty glaring. The student who does PSEO and gets a bunch of college credit is apparently not "college ready" if they didn't also get credit through AP or IB exams. There is no attempt to determine which AP or IB exams are taken/passed (note that many of the exams receive no college credit at many institutions). There is no weighting of how many exams students take/pass or pass rates on the exams. There is no attempt to balance AP vs. IB exams. There's an attempt to differentiate "disadvantaged" students in the first 2 steps, but that disappears on the third step.

[Glenfield]

Originally Posted by Mason3000

50th France/Edina border, Lake Harriet, Lake Calhoun, Uptown, Lake of the Isles, Kenwood. That's part of what I think some suburbanites don't get. Mpls SW is full of RICH KIDS. It's got all the kids from the Lake Harriet & Kenwood areas which are far wealthier and "upper class" than most suburbs. Much more on par with Edina/Minnetonka/Wayzata than with "inner city" schools. The poorer areas of Mpls SW district are still very upscale such as Uptown & the far SW neighborhoods like Fulton, Armatage & Kenny.

To expand on your point, while attendance at any MPS is not limited to a geographic area, free transportation is only available from certain areas. I would agree that most of the students are from Southwest Minneapolis, and that's not an under privileged area by any means.

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