Somalis (St. Paul: 2013, crime, houses)

[Beenhere4ever]

I'm curious whether there are factors in our Somali community that separate them from the general population. Are they an inward looking group? Do the elders warn against our culture that they consider dangerous? I've never made small talk with any Somali working in a retail business. They certainly don't engage in chitchat like other minorities. Could be shyness. Certainly isn't language difficulties. I don't take offense when anyone I don't know treats me distantly, but there is a pattern there t hat I notice and wonder about. The young Somalis are seldom alone, and they interact exclusively with their own. The Hispanics aren't like that at all. Native born blacks are kinda the total opposite of Somalis. And Asians seem pretty comfortable with people they don't know.

[Glenfield]

Originally Posted by jeffredo

It does seem rather odd (coming from a hot, dry country on the Horn of Africa). We're so used to immigrants in California we just expect them to come there first. I remember the first time I went to the Twin Cities back in the late 1980s. I was shocked by how overwhelmingly white they were. Even the central core of Minneapolis. Nothing like the Bay Area. Not to sound insulting, but I've read that once they arrive the generous social services keeps them there (when many other states are cutting that budget).

The Hmong once settled heavily in Fresno and Merced. Once California changed the welfare laws to a maximum of four years tens of thousands left the San Joaquin Valley - many for Minnesota and Wisconsin where I believe the laws were still generous (and there was already a community). Probably the same thing would happen should those laws every change in MN.

You simply could not be more wrong. In the first place, the Hmong in Minnesota did not come here from California, but came here directly from Southeast Asia. Like the Somalis who followed them, and many immigrants who preceded them, they came to Minnesota because of an open and welcoming atmosphere. This attitude was shown in concrete terms through the private social services, notably Lutheran Social Services, who found sponsors for the people coming here. One of my good friends came here from Vietnam. He and his brother were sponsored by a gentleman who not only let them live in his house for several years while they got on their feet, but also put both of them through college at the U. I later became acquainted with this gentleman and found that this story was not unique, but was something that was done over and over by many individuals.

I'm familiar with the Twin Cities and the Bay Area, and they have many similarities, but there is one area in which they are vastly different. The people of Minnesota are vastly more compassionate that those in the Bay Area, so it is not surprising to me to see people from around the world drawn to that compassion.

[Angorlee]

Also liberal Minnesota has had a guilt complex for a long time over being too white.

[Mason3000]

Originally Posted by Angorlee

Also liberal Minnesota has had a guilt complex for a long time over being too white.

lalife rips into whites presumably in retaliation for perceived slights to Somalis (??), but why does lalife assume the OP was white in the first place? Why so sure it wasn't an African American, Native American, Asian American or Latino who posted? What type of knee-jerk, racist, stereotyping/profiling is behind that line of thinking?

[rtloucks]

I would like to chime in because of my many experiences....

Im a white american male. grew up in Rochester MN and worked a lot in the twin cities until I as 27 and let in 2006. The Somalis started to migrate into my town when I was in high school 1993 and after. I actually came out of high school with a pretty good Somali friend. we didnt hang out at eachothers homes or pretend to understand eachothers culture but we were always very friendly to eachother and still are to this day. Since high school I had worked in a field that allowed me to interact and do business with them on a daily basis. They like to barain everything and sometimes got frusterating but once you conduct business or even a personalexchange with them they are very loyal and will bring everyone they know to you as well. They come in groups and stick with their own,.

I dont think there should be any judgment made that women dont work. My grandparents are very ill and require 24 hour in home care and they actually employ 4 somali women adn they are teh most beautiful, well mannered, classiest, friendliest, helpful and caring women I ahev ever met next to my own wife, mother and sister. I remember times when my sons would go over to visit and the one who worked there would walk them down to the gas station that was somali owned and sold ethnic foods as well, and buy them treats. My sons really like her. There are also plenty of Somali women that I see working, yes its mostly at Wal marts, Target, Fast food joints etc...but at least they are working and not sitting home pretending that they are too good to work at Sams Club....like some poeple

My opinion on the men is simple. I believe that they are generally good people too. A little more reserved and they usually a little more combative probably because of the nature they were raised in. But if you are friendly to them they are usually friendly back. And yes most are taxi drivers, manufacturing or work in fields that are simple and under the rader type jobs. But there are plenty of educated somalis as well working in hospitals and IBM etc.

Like any culture, they will usually move to the same areas as other somlais for one simple reason....so they can interact with others easily. Think about it, if ther are all in teh same area, they can all go to the same places to eet other somalis, they can go to the same worships, have local groceries that cater to them etc. No different than CHinatowns, or little Koereas, etc.

Not saying this is the only reason because there are plenty of others but.....My understanding is that one big reasons the somalis would come to MN because of the wellfare and healtcare options along with the tax assistance. Im not saying they are all on welfare, But back then and up until I left (Not sure how it is now so dont jump all over me for this statement) but MN offered 7 years tax free living basically, along with healthcare assistance, and wellfare/Foodstamps etc to immagrants that were new to MN. I know this becasue I made good friends with the Bosnian groups when they moved to MN and they udedd to tell me all about it. But again...great people and most are hard working. But somalis should not be treated any differently than Chinese, korean, Vietnamese, bosnian, germans, brits, or anyone else who is not origianlly from america.

WE ALL WERE NEW TO THE STATES AT ONE POINT OR ANOTHER!

Of course there are always going to be a few bad apples. And not all fo them are legal. but dont pass judgement on everyone.

Think about this....

You wake up everyday adn go to your normal routine. that is probabaly when you encounter a Somlai. They are probably driving you to work in your cab, or checking your luggage at the airport, or serving you your food at McDonalds, or checking you out at Target...Anyway, you seem them because they are not affraid to get out and join our work force and make somethign of themselves. Now why would you pass a bad judgmnt about them....

There are going to be criminals in all cultures....even white people...
There are going to be lazy unemployed people sitting around their homes in all cultures.....even americans....

[Ghengis]

this inscription is on something back east that at one time meant something to those in need and to a nation that stood for something that seems to be lacking these days...

Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses, yearning to breath free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore,
Send these, the homeless, tempest tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door.

Emma Lazarus

[jeffredo]

Originally Posted by Glenfield

You simply could not be more wrong. In the first place, the Hmong in Minnesota did not come here from California, but came here directly from Southeast Asia.

Not really. There are many Hmong in MN and WI that moved there from Merced and Fresno in search of better opportunities (from whatever avenue) and the majority went to those states after the 1996 change in California's welfare laws because there were already familial communities established in those states. Merced (population 75K) at one time had the greatest percentage of Hmong of any US city. Almost half have left since 1996. I lived in Fresno for two years - Minnesota license plates are not uncommon and its almost always Asian folks driving them. Migration among the Hmong community between those two regions has been going on since they first arrived in the early 1980s.

Merced, California - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[ManBearPig1]

Originally Posted by Ghengis

this inscription is on something back east that at one time meant something to those in need and to a nation that stood for something that seems to be lacking these days...

Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses, yearning to breath free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore,
Send these, the homeless, tempest tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door.

Emma Lazarus

too lacking these days

[Glenfield]

Originally Posted by jeffredo

Not really. There are many Hmong in MN and WI that moved there from Merced and Fresno in search of better opportunities (from whatever avenue) and the majority went to those states after the 1996 change in California's welfare laws because there were already familial communities established in those states. Merced (population 75K) at one time had the greatest percentage of Hmong of any US city. Almost half have left since 1996. I lived in Fresno for two years - Minnesota license plates are not uncommon and its almost always Asian folks driving them. Migration among the Hmong community between those two regions has been going on since they first arrived in the early 1980s.

Merced, California - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Which is completely a different version of the first story you posted, but whatever.

[Min-Chi-Cbus]

Originally Posted by Mason3000

This is very close to grounds for banning imo. Overt racism has no business on this forum, regardless of who the hatred is directed towards. Your disgusting, small minded accusations are no better than a Klan member or anti-Semite. Your racist generalizations are in fact the same. The OP made some innocent societal observations/questions & instead of helping the OP understand, your response is to attack white students for having "poor attitudes", being "lazy" "sloppy" & "lacking work ethic"? Take a look in the mirror, racial bigotry is racial bigotry is racial bigotry.

Knock it off! That was WEAK and you know it!! The whole thread is racially-charged and you're going to let THAT bother you? Either take down the thread (because frankly, it's too inflammatory) or deal with the discomfort peoples!