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There is a disproportionate number of low income black families in MN compared to middle and upper middle class black families in MN-that alone explains the discrepancy of the unemployment rate. Add to that the recent influx of Somalian immigrants and the numbers are skewed. I think you will find that in the middle and upper classes of the black population, there is little to no difference in unemployment rate.
Here's something to think about when analyzing the black population in Minnesota. Here are some numbers.
In the 1990 Census, there were 94,944 blacks in Minnesota. In the 2010 Census, there were 274,412 blacks in Minnesota. That is an increase of about 300% in the black population in Minnesota over the last two decades.
That is a very large increase in the black population in Minnesota compared to what it used to be even two decades ago. When you study the data from other states, very few had such a large percentage increase in their black population over the last two decades.
For example, in Illinois, the black population in 1990 was about 1.7 million. In 2010, it was about 1.9 million. In Missouri, the black population in 1990 was 550,000. In 2010, it was about 670,000. In Wisconsin, the black population in 1990 was 240,000. In 2010, it was about 340,000. In Michigan, the black population in 1990 was 1.3 million. In 2010, it was about 1.4 million.
These are all other Midwest states that historically have had a larger black population than Minnesota. But none of these states had an increase in their black population from 1990 to 2010 of even 50%. Minnesota's black population over that same time period increased almost 300%.
So, what this tells me is that the vast majority of the black population in Minnesota has moved to Minnesota only in the last two decades. They probably don't have roots in Minnesota or extended family that have been able to establish businesses or connections over the generations that could help them get a job. I'm not talking about connections with the white community. I'm talking about connections in the black community that could help other black people get jobs. Those connections are stronger in cities like Chicago and even Milwaukee, that have had larger black communities for a longer period of time.
I think also the black migration to Minnesota hasn't been from across the socio-economic spectrum, primarily it consists of the poorest of the poor from Gary and Chicago's south and west sides, and Somali refugees. Minnesota's old black community had (and has) a rooted middle class like in other cities but it has been dwarfed by the influx of poor people.
Hopefully the kids of those who have moved here will be better prepared for life in Minnesota than their parents are. This is how it worked with the Hmong, St Paul used to have the highest Asian unemployment in the country but as the generation that grew up here hit the labor force it went down sharply.
Last edited by Drewcifer; 06-10-2011 at 09:26 PM..
I don't like being a racist, but the facts speak for themselves about racial/cultural differences. Black MALES have a far greater propensity towards violent behavior just about everywhere you go... less so in some smaller southern communities but still just look at the crime rate of any given city on city-data and then look at the population racial breakdown. Case closed.
I don't like being a racist, but the facts speak for themselves about racial/cultural differences. Black MALES have a far greater propensity towards violent behavior just about everywhere you go... less so in some smaller southern communities but still just look at the crime rate of any given city on city-data and then look at the population racial breakdown. Case closed.
You're partially right, circling in the same county as the truth, however you're making a very common logical error, confusing correlation with causation. Are black males poor and unemployed because they are violent and useless, or vice versa? There certainly is a correlation, but what came first?
In medieval England, the murder and theft crime rates were much higher than the most violent of 1990's crack ghettos. There were no blacks within a thousand miles of England, but there was plenty of poverty.
OTOH I lived a few years in Silver Spring, MD, where there is a significant middle class African American population, and the crime rate there was typical for suburban communities nationwide - ie much lower than the adjacent city.
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The town I live in has no crime.
That's for Brookings SD? No crime -if you're white, that is. If you're Lakota, you may have a different perspective on the situation.
Location: Cleveland bound with MPLS in the rear-view
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^Good perspective, thanks! I usually equate crime with poverty, income POTENTIAL, and education. IOW, if somebody is poor, lives in a city with TONS of money, and has little/no education in a city where many people are highly educated -- resentment and opportunity breed crime.
Wow, I'm surprised that no one has touched on the refugee/immigrant aspect of this. Think about the Black population in the Twin Cities and even in other cities in the state. A relatively large portion of the Black community is made up of African refugees. So, the aspect of assimilation, coming to a country not because of choice and language barriers also come into play when looking at this issue. Even Asian refugees(that tend to largely come from SE Asian), have a hard time in regard to these aspects and SE Asians tend to be very poor economically and even have to deal with some of the social ills that many urban Black communities have to deal with. So, we can't forget about the makeup of the Black community in the state and how it is more complex than just the usual issues that African American specific communities have had to deal, which is also occurring in the Twin Cities.
I also think the gap has more to do with how educated the white population is there. Meaning, if you compare the education levels of Whites among the states, Minnesota will be way up there, if not at the top of the list. So, in essence, you are comparing very different experiences and circumstances.
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Originally Posted by Drewcifer
I think also the black migration to Minnesota hasn't been from across the socio-economic spectrum, primarily it consists of the poorest of the poor from Gary and Chicago's south and west sides, and Somali refugees. Minnesota's old black community had (and has) a rooted middle class like in other cities but it has been dwarfed by the influx of poor people.
Hopefully the kids of those who have moved here will be better prepared for life in Minnesota than their parents are. This is how it worked with the Hmong, St Paul used to have the highest Asian unemployment in the country but as the generation that grew up here hit the labor force it went down sharply.
Really speaks to the general idea of "need more info", and here is probably one point: A large Somali refugee community likely has a large impact on the particular numbers. Minnesota is clearly known, among other things, for having the largest Somali community in the country. In fact, though no longer easily seen on their website, the African Development Center of MN (Stats about all US cities - real estate, relocation info, house prices, home value estimator, recent sales, cost of living, crime, race, income, photos, education, maps, weather, houses, schools, neighborhoods, and more) a while back had visitors from Sweden to study the Somali community here (specifically, why Somalis in MN are opening and operating businesses relatively well and why they are not in Sweden. I believe the answer came down, basically, that in Sweden they try strongly to limit "McDonald's jobs" - the exact entry level jobs many poor Somalis in Sweden could use...). In other words, it's more complicated then the on-the-face-of-it look that Minnesotans are secretly black-haters.
I will say, while I can believe racism does exist here, if one is going to insinuate or blatantly pull the race card, please be ready to back it up with hard, specific facts - not just because one didn't get their way or had to work hard. I quickly lose patience when I'm called a racist because I disagreed with you or told you that you were wrong, based upon your actions or content of your character (yes, words chosen intentionally From Reverend King)
I will say, there may be a great many who were disenfranchised in the youth or neighborhood culture. However, at some point that has to stop being an excuse. As objectionable as blatant racism is, it is an equally insidious form of racism to say "black people are simply not smart enough or capable of rising above their circumstances; only the great white hope can save them." To that end, I will put on my libertarian hat and say if we got government out of the handout game, necessity would become the mother of invention (and, incidentally a limited, small tax government would allow more private contributions to private charity to help those who truly fell on hard times through no fault of their own.) Indeed, it could be argued that the awful compassion of government programs has created simply a different form of plantation...
Really speaks to the general idea of "need more info", and here is probably one point: A large Somali refugee community likely has a large impact on the particular numbers. Minnesota is clearly known, among other things, for having the largest Somali community in the country. In fact, though no longer easily seen on their website, the African Development Center of MN (Stats about all US cities - real estate, relocation info, house prices, home value estimator, recent sales, cost of living, crime, race, income, photos, education, maps, weather, houses, schools, neighborhoods, and more) a while back had visitors from Sweden to study the Somali community here (specifically, why Somalis in MN are opening and operating businesses relatively well and why they are not in Sweden. I believe the answer came down, basically, that in Sweden they try strongly to limit "McDonald's jobs" - the exact entry level jobs many poor Somalis in Sweden could use...). In other words, it's more complicated then the on-the-face-of-it look that Minnesotans are secretly black-haters.
I will say, while I can believe racism does exist here, if one is going to insinuate or blatantly pull the race card, please be ready to back it up with hard, specific facts - not just because one didn't get their way or had to work hard. I quickly lose patience when I'm called a racist because I disagreed with you or told you that you were wrong, based upon your actions or content of your character (yes, words chosen intentionally From Reverend King)
I will say, there may be a great many who were disenfranchised in the youth or neighborhood culture. However, at some point that has to stop being an excuse. As objectionable as blatant racism is, it is an equally insidious form of racism to say "black people are simply not smart enough or capable of rising above their circumstances; only the great white hope can save them." To that end, I will put on my libertarian hat and say if we got government out of the handout game, necessity would become the mother of invention (and, incidentally a limited, small tax government would allow more private contributions to private charity to help those who truly fell on hard times through no fault of their own.) Indeed, it could be argued that the awful compassion of government programs has created simply a different form of plantation...
Yes and no, but I see your point. Are people really that generous to make up the loss of government funding through private charity? Businesses are don't care about the American worker, as many jobs are leaving the country altogether. So, will they really care in terms of charity on a private level?
Then, you are getting into a slippery slope, as this getting government completely out of the way thing can get into student loans, Medicaid, Medicare, Social Security and other governmental involved forms of "entitlements".
I'm all for personal responsibility, but even the most responsible fall on hard times, as this recession has shown. So, we can't have our cake and eat it too in terms of government involvement.
BTW-"Race" cards wouldn't need to be pulled if "Racist" cards weren't being played at times. Just saying..........
No white flight? How do you explain Homewood neighborhood? It was a gated, all white community in N Mpls - until the residents all picked up and moved en masse to St. Louis Park in the 50's and 60's. Now, the children of those emigrants are beginning to move back into Homewood.
I was speaking of the city as a whole, and even more specifically, of its school district. MPS has never lost its white middle class residents. That's very different from many other cities this size. Some specific schools or neighborhoods (and yes, parts of North Minneapolis) have changed and did experience white flight, but the school district as a whole has always had a significant core of white middle class families -- something that is, I think, fairly unusual for cities of its size.
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