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Old 07-13-2012, 11:54 AM
 
Location: Metairie, La.
1,156 posts, read 1,722,995 times
Reputation: 775

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mouldy Old Schmo View Post
Actually, this conservative lives in a part of Mississippi where most people "aren't exactly like me", if you intend that phrase as code for blacks. BTW, idea that blacks will establish solidarity with gays is bupkes. They tend to oppose SSM more than white folks!
Point taken.

So how's anything being "forced" down anyone's gullet?
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Old 07-13-2012, 12:50 PM
 
Location: PNW, CPSouth, JacksonHole, Southampton
3,539 posts, read 5,122,185 times
Reputation: 13910
Well I think the bigger news was the Alligator stalking that Bobcat (sidebar, beside original article).

Anyway, I think that since the State of Mississippi refuses to allow a commitment ceremony for the two young women, it should also issue them permanent exemptions from State Income Tax. (...taxation...representation...)

The Ag Museum is that taxpayer-funded mess over by Loser Stadium, right? With the gateposts that look like the driveway entrance to some fine brick home built in 1967 by... oh, maybe the School Janitor and the lady with the hair net and the giant, flappin' arm flab over to tha Cafeteria? You know... they'd saved up all their lives for a fine brick 1&1/2 bath with a carport & all... and they had some brick left over an' built 'em some gateposts, out by the highway, an' even put some little bitty lanterns from tha new K-Mart on top, real fancy, like... THAT Ag Museum?

Would you expect anything other than trash to run something like that?

In any event, those girls' parents and grandparents (assuming they're Mississippians, too) were forced to help fund construction of that pile of garbage with their tax Dollars.

And would you expect politicians and career bureaucrats in the state with the lowest average IQ (although California may recently have stolen that honor) to NOT use something like this to demonstrate what big 'Christians' they are, by disallowing something like this? They KNEW they'd be getting flak. They KNEW the TV crews & journalists would be attracted to this like flies to a rotting carcass. Running afoul of the SPLC or the ACLU, in Mississippi, is like money in the bank (or votes in the ballot box). It's sure to make you popular with the IQ below 100 Set. Standin' up fer religion, against the heathen Sodomites (double votes, if you can scrape up some Vampire Lesbians of Sodom to oppose) is a wonderful bipartisan maneuver! Not just WHITE trash, but ALL kinds of trash will remember your name, and that you cleave to churchey values an' all.

The fact that the actual, real Jesus would have had better things to think about than people loving each other in slightly-less-than-orthodox ways, and if pressed, would have said something about throwing first stones, or rendering unto Caesar.... well, that's beside the point. The POINT is that in Mississippi, DIFFERENT IS BAD.

Different is of the Devil.

While true Christianity would lead one to conclude that beauty contests are earthly vanities and thus sinful, Mississippi 'Christians' see nothing wrong with gals putting on swimsuits with high heels, spritzing their tuchis with Spray Fix (to keep the swimsuits from slipping), rubbing Vaseline on their teeth, and parading before men, like kidnapped Ukrainian girls being auctioned-off to the brothel keepers of the 'Holy Land'. That's because the TV says beauty contests are NORMAL (good), and those who oppose them are WEIRD (bad).

Same for sports. Jesus (the real one...you know...our GENTLE Savior...) probably would have regarded sports as being earthly vanities (and violent ones, at that). But the TV says they're NORMAL. And the newspapers and magazines say they're normal. And in Mississippi, NORMAL IS GOOD. So, people in Mississippi pray at games, which some of us regard as being blasphemous and taking The Holy Name in vain.

There is a huge difference in actually believing and just pretending to believe, because it gives you all kinds of dandy excuses. And when you're looking for excuses and justifications (and votes and career advancements), nothing works better than cleaving to "conservative values".

__________________

Anyway, has anybody checked the sites where they post footage of Ghetto Weddings, to see if any of the 'entries' have been at the Ag Museum?

Last edited by GrandviewGloria; 07-13-2012 at 01:01 PM..
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Old 07-13-2012, 05:08 PM
 
833 posts, read 1,640,485 times
Reputation: 772
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mouldy Old Schmo View Post
One reason I like Mississippi is that most of its people don't seem to follow the Whig view of history which is that the future is always better than the present. Here's an example of people trying to force that "progressive" mindset down our gullet:

Lesbian demands commitment ceremony at Mississippi ag museum | The Clarion-Ledger | clarionledger.com

The drama queen will soon be leaving for college in Pensacola Florida.

I imagine she will try to get publicity in Florida also
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Old 07-13-2012, 05:24 PM
 
Location: Hillsboro, OR
2,200 posts, read 4,202,865 times
Reputation: 1379
It doesn't really matter since soon/eventually, same-sex marriage will be legal across all 50 states, and it will be unconstitutional to discriminate against it.

Keep fighting it though, it will only make you look more ridiculous in history classes in 50 years.
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Old 07-13-2012, 05:50 PM
 
833 posts, read 1,640,485 times
Reputation: 772
Quote:
Originally Posted by psulions2007 View Post
It doesn't really matter since soon/eventually, same-sex marriage will be legal across all 50 states, and it will be unconstitutional to discriminate against it.

Keep fighting it though, it will only make you look more ridiculous in history classes in 50 years.
perversion is perversion !

you can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear.
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Old 07-14-2012, 08:18 AM
 
Location: Chattanooga, TN
2,968 posts, read 4,745,920 times
Reputation: 4839
Quote:
Originally Posted by redwolf fan View Post
perversion is perversion !

you can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear.
Actually, yes you can.

But away from chemistry/alchemy and back on topic.

I'm a Christian, and my religion teaches that homosexuality is a sin. People like MOS and the managers of the Museum are (apparently) also Christian, as are the majority of the people of the state. They see it as a deviant act that shouldn't be allowed anywhere in the state, much less on hallowed conservative State land such as the Ag Museum. Saying that they shouldn't care about this is akin to saying that it's OK if 14-year old kids gather down a back road to drink beer, smoke pot, and shoot up. The latter act isn't legally allowed, and the cops occasionally bust up such underage parties. The conservative managers of the Ag museum want to bust up the commitment ceremony, and they see the fact that outside interests are trying to force them to allow something they don't approve of on "their" land as akin to having something shoved down their gullet. This is their (apparent) perspective, and is how MOS can feel justified in the OP.

But they're wrong. The land/building is question does not belong to the managers, it belongs to the people of the State. And this includes the people who want to hold a commitment ceremony.

Unfortunately, the second paragraph in my first post was apparently a little too subtle. Although I'm a Christian, I also hold firm to the belief that the separation of church and state is a GOOD and NECESSARY thing. Why? For one, it is illegal (punishable by law!) for 90% of the world's Christians to celebrate the most sacred rite of our faith in my home county in Mississippi. The other 10% use grape juice, which the 90% see as a perversion of the rite. The State has restricted my religion, which is a bad thing. As for this specific topic (homosexual unions), the only legitimate arguments I've ever heard against homosexuals are based on religion. Homosexuality is bad because the Bible/Quran/Torah/ tells me so. Ok, great. But if you outlaw homosexuality based on religion, what about the other religious laws? What's next, are you going to outlaw tattoos, eating shellfish, working on the Sabbath, or getting a divorce other than for adultery?

This country was founded by a group of mostly agnostics who insisted on a country free from religious persecution. This means the government cannot impose a "state religion" on anyone. This means that as long as you are on private land and don't violate any basic human or animal rights you can preach or practice whatever you want in your church/mosque/synagog/temple. You can even take to the streets, knock on doors, and try to convert the ignorant masses to your belief. The government cannot prevent you from doing this, and the government cannot force a private church to allow ceremonies that go against their beliefs. But once you get on public land, you have to follow public rules. This means that, yes, assuming the land is set up to hand such an event, a church group should be able to use public land (i.e., a State Park, a school building, the Ag Museum, etc.) to hold a marriage ceremony, or a revival, or Bible study, or just to gather and chat with fellow Christian friends. And, yes, a separate group should be able to use the Ag museum for a legal commitment ceremony.

Maybe the couple in question follows a religion that specifically allows homosexuality, or maybe they are complete Atheists, or maybe something else. I neither know nor care. Not allowing a legal ceremony on public land for religious reasons is the equivalent of imposing your religion on the couple in question. Because this is State land, this is the equivalent of imposing a State Religion, which is explicitly prohibited by Federal Law. In other words, you are trying to shove your religion down their gullet.

Last edited by An Einnseanair; 07-14-2012 at 08:34 AM..
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Old 07-14-2012, 08:36 AM
 
Location: Somewhere flat in Mississippi
10,062 posts, read 11,652,277 times
Reputation: 7168
Quote:
Originally Posted by jwkilgore View Post
it is illegal (punishable by law!) for 90% of the world's Christians to celebrate the most sacred rite of our faith in my home county in Mississippi.
Are you referring to using wine during Communion? I thought "dry" counties would exempt the use of alchohol for religious ceremonies.

I guess it's good that I live in a "wet" county. The blacks and Italians wouldn't stand for "dryness"!
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Old 07-14-2012, 09:59 AM
 
833 posts, read 1,640,485 times
Reputation: 772
Quote:
Originally Posted by jwkilgore View Post
Actually, yes you can.

But away from chemistry/alchemy and back on topic.

I'm a Christian, and my religion teaches that homosexuality is a sin. People like MOS and the managers of the Museum are (apparently) also Christian, as are the majority of the people of the state. They see it as a deviant act that shouldn't be allowed anywhere in the state, much less on hallowed conservative State land such as the Ag Museum. Saying that they shouldn't care about this is akin to saying that it's OK if 14-year old kids gather down a back road to drink beer, smoke pot, and shoot up. The latter act isn't legally allowed, and the cops occasionally bust up such underage parties. The conservative managers of the Ag museum want to bust up the commitment ceremony, and they see the fact that outside interests are trying to force them to allow something they don't approve of on "their" land as akin to having something shoved down their gullet. This is their (apparent) perspective, and is how MOS can feel justified in the OP.

But they're wrong. The land/building is question does not belong to the managers, it belongs to the people of the State. And this includes the people who want to hold a commitment ceremony.

Unfortunately, the second paragraph in my first post was apparently a little too subtle. Although I'm a Christian, I also hold firm to the belief that the separation of church and state is a GOOD and NECESSARY thing. Why? For one, it is illegal (punishable by law!) for 90% of the world's Christians to celebrate the most sacred rite of our faith in my home county in Mississippi. The other 10% use grape juice, which the 90% see as a perversion of the rite. The State has restricted my religion, which is a bad thing. As for this specific topic (homosexual unions), the only legitimate arguments I've ever heard against homosexuals are based on religion. Homosexuality is bad because the Bible/Quran/Torah/ tells me so. Ok, great. But if you outlaw homosexuality based on religion, what about the other religious laws? What's next, are you going to outlaw tattoos, eating shellfish, working on the Sabbath, or getting a divorce other than for adultery?

This country was founded by a group of mostly agnostics who insisted on a country free from religious persecution. This means the government cannot impose a "state religion" on anyone. This means that as long as you are on private land and don't violate any basic human or animal rights you can preach or practice whatever you want in your church/mosque/synagog/temple. You can even take to the streets, knock on doors, and try to convert the ignorant masses to your belief. The government cannot prevent you from doing this, and the government cannot force a private church to allow ceremonies that go against their beliefs. But once you get on public land, you have to follow public rules. This means that, yes, assuming the land is set up to hand such an event, a church group should be able to use public land (i.e., a State Park, a school building, the Ag Museum, etc.) to hold a marriage ceremony, or a revival, or Bible study, or just to gather and chat with fellow Christian friends. And, yes, a separate group should be able to use the Ag museum for a legal commitment ceremony.

Maybe the couple in question follows a religion that specifically allows homosexuality, or maybe they are complete Atheists, or maybe something else. I neither know nor care. Not allowing a legal ceremony on public land for religious reasons is the equivalent of imposing your religion on the couple in question. Because this is State land, this is the equivalent of imposing a State Religion, which is explicitly prohibited by Federal Law. In other words, you are trying to shove your religion down their gullet.

Did you even bother reading the link ?

It states the Mississippi Atty General stated the Ag Museum officials ---do--have a legal right to restrict the use of the facilities.
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Old 07-14-2012, 12:53 PM
 
8,284 posts, read 12,990,056 times
Reputation: 5011
Quote:
Originally Posted by redwolf fan View Post
The drama queen will soon be leaving for college in Pensacola Florida.

I imagine she will try to get publicity in Florida also
Perhaps the best thing she can do is leave the Conservative Neanderthal state of Mississippi. I mean didn't she get how backward of state she lives in when she couldn't wear a Tux in her yearbook? Now her state is also down to one Abortion clinic thereby trying to outlaw Roe V Wade and restrict Women's rights even further. The state should consider renaming itself "Mississippistan"!
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Old 07-14-2012, 01:21 PM
 
Location: Chattanooga, TN
2,968 posts, read 4,745,920 times
Reputation: 4839
Quote:
Originally Posted by redwolf fan View Post
Did you even bother reading the link ?
It states the Mississippi Atty General stated the Ag Museum officials ---do--have a legal right to restrict the use of the facilities.
Yes, I did read it, and I believe this is the paragraph you are referring to:
Quote:
"We are of the opinion that the Department (of Agriculture and Commerce) is certainly authorized to restrict the use of museum property for events and functions that are legal under state law," Hood wrote. "Therefore, (the department) is authorized to prohibit same gender marriages on museum property."
This passage says that the AG authorized the prohibition of things that are not legal. For example, they are allowed to refuse to rent the facility to a group who plans to do something illegal, such as allow under age drinking, or gambling, or dog fights. I agree that this is a wise use of State authority. It is specifically referring to a case from 2009 where a couple tried to reserve the Ag museum for a same-gender marriage ceremony. If same-gender marriage ceremonies are illegal (I personally don't know, but it is implied in the quote), then the museum has the right to not allow them.

However, the article as a whole is talking about a completely separate thing - a commitment ceremony. The couple isn't trying to get any tax breaks, get on each others health plans, be automatically awarded the others estate or Social Security benefits in the event of a death, or be allowed visitation rights in the case of emergency hospitalization (legal results of marriage). The mother is quoted as using the words "wedding" and "married", but everyone else involved insists they just want to stand up in front of a group of friends and pledge to love each other. In spite of my personal views on homosexuality, there's nothing legally wrong with that.

Last edited by An Einnseanair; 07-14-2012 at 01:31 PM..
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