In what ways is Southern Missouri southern, and in what ways is it not? (St. Louis: authority, bars)

[onegoalstl]

Originally Posted by GraniteStater

With regard to the subregions, only the eastern parts of KS, NE, SD, ND (East River) are at the western periphery of the Midwest. The western parts of those states mostly allign with the West. Also, the lower Midwest and upland South transition zone is very marginal due to cultural differences that are quite significant.

True. Here is a good map of the upland south that shows what parts of IL, IN are part of it. However I wouldn't consider the Ozarks just north of highway 60 and below to be upland south to the extend southern IL, IN is as that area of Missouri is dixie. West Plains, Thayer, Poplar Bluff certainly is more southern than southern IL, IN lol.

[GraniteStater]

Originally Posted by onegoalstl

True. Here is a good map of the upland south that shows what parts of IL, IN are part of it. However I wouldn't consider the Ozarks just north of highway 60 and below to be upland south to the extend southern IL, IN is as that area of Missouri is dixie. West Plains, Thayer, Poplar Bluff certainly is more southern than southern IL, IN lol.

Southern IN is becoming more southern over time as the rural areas feel like they are >75% like Kentucky. Look at the educational attainment stats for southern Indiana. They sure aren't very good at all. Systemic issues with job loses, poverty, and drug use are becoming all too common in the region as well.

[kshe95girl]

Originally Posted by onegoalstl

True. Here is a good map of the upland south that shows what parts of IL, IN are part of it. However I wouldn't consider the Ozarks just north of highway 60 and below to be upland south to the extend southern IL, IN is as that area of Missouri is dixie. West Plains, Thayer, Poplar Bluff certainly is more southern than southern IL, IN lol.

Your map is incorrect.
The upland south does not include StL and the Mississippi Hills region.
Why do you persist in posting misinformation such as this?
Its getting rather tiresome.

[GunnerTHB]

That map is WAY too generous with the northern boundary. Pennsylvania? Sorry that map isn't considered to be any sort of a correct or serious analysis to me. That light green shouldn't go any farther north than Cape County. Also the map includes Western TN in the upland south? Sorry but it's tied to the Delta too much to be upland. I was in western KY and Western TN this weekend and the two are quite different.

[onegoalstl]

Originally Posted by GraniteStater

Southern IN is becoming more southern over time as the rural areas feel like they are >75% like Kentucky. Look at the educational attainment stats for southern Indiana. They sure aren't very good at all. Systemic issues with job loses, poverty, and drug use are becoming all too common in the region as well.

Indiana does have a bit of southern element to it. They had some southern Democrat politicans during the civil war. Certainly not to the extent of MO though.

Another thing to note I notice is that people on the left coast or east coast they tend to make Missouri out to be a Redneck, bible thumper state. You don't notice that with other states like IA, Nebraska, KS, IL, IN so I mean people do know Missouri has some southern components to it. I guess due to the civil war and MO compromise.

What is funny is when I lived in FL most people didn't know jack about FL being in the Confederacy. Even most of the people up here know MO was a split state that was both Union and Confederate claimed.

KSHE why is it the state of Florida doesn't do much to honor it's Confederate heritage? I mean I know Florida only had a few civil war battles unlike MO but it was still a Confederate state. Even in the schools down there they never taught us much about it at all.

WHy does the state seem to avoid the issue? Mississippi, Alabama, South Carolina seem to be more in your face about it, and not ashamed to be proud of it.

Well take that back SC removed the battle flag from the dome at the capital around the same time Bob Holden took our flags down. I wish Jay Nixon would put up the Missouri Battle flag aka the Roman Cross flag up, or at least the Missouri State Guard flag being its been 150 year aniversary.

It's odd the battle flag flew in Missouri for over 100 years until Holden had them take down. Can you imagine Warren Hearnes doing something like that? Even the egg head Mel Carnahan wasn't that stupid. Afterall Mel was a southern, and Baptist from southern MO.

[onegoalstl]

Originally Posted by kshe95girl

Your map is incorrect.
The upland south does not include StL and the Mississippi Hills region.
Why do you persist in posting misinformation such as this?
Its getting rather tiresome.

I didn't make the map, its from wiki.

I doubt someone is going to go into fine detail and cookie cut each little region like Ste Gen, Hermann out. You could take hours to do a fine detailed map. Just a basic broadbrush map.

[onegoalstl]

Originally Posted by GunnerTHB

That map is WAY too generous with the northern boundary. Pennsylvania? Sorry that map isn't considered to be any sort of a correct or serious analysis to me. That light green shouldn't go any farther north than Cape County. Also the map includes Western TN in the upland south? Sorry but it's tied to the Delta too much to be upland. I was in western KY and Western TN this weekend and the two are quite different.

Yes KY is quite different than the bootheel or TN. the southern bootheel counties are more southish than anywhere in KY.

Strange how KY is same lattitude as most of MO, and the bootheel being more south than anywhere in KY, but KY is called a southern state and MO not.

[GunnerTHB]

Originally Posted by onegoalstl

Strange how KY is same lattitude as most of MO, and the bootheel being more south than anywhere in KY, but KY is called a southern state and MO not.

No it's not. Most of Missouri lies north of Western KY. I haven't been too far east of the lake in KY so I can't speak for the rest of the state but I've heard it said that Western KY has always been the most southern part of Kentucky culturally. Every state has an outlier (or two or even more), that doesn't make the whole state one thing or another. The general consensus for Missouri is Midwestern, and Kentucky is Southern, and from my experiences those statements are correct. All of Missouri isn't like the bootheel, just like how all of Kentucky isn't like the Purchase.

[GraniteStater]

Originally Posted by onegoalstl

Yes KY is quite different than the bootheel or TN. the southern bootheel counties are more southish than anywhere in KY.

Strange how KY is same lattitude as most of MO, and the bootheel being more south than anywhere in KY, but KY is called a southern state and MO not.

Also, KY has more of an industrial northern feel in terms of architecture, job types, and the built environment in some parts of Louisville as well as Lexington. Manufacturing decline and the Rustbelt extend to the Ohio Valley.

[kshe95girl]

Originally Posted by onegoalstl

What is funny is when I lived in FL most people didn't know jack about FL being in the Confederacy.

Thats BS, I have been living in FL longer than you have been out of your mamas womb, and even the most idiot, backwards Forest person knows the history of Florida, including the Civil War ere.
As far as your perceived notion of FL not honoring their Confederate history, hmmmmmm.
The Daughters of the Confederacy are alive and well here, there are many battle re-enactments, Johnny Reb statues abound here.
The arrival of the sesquicentennial anniversary of the Civil War on Tuesday has sparked an examination of the conflict's origins in communities across the country. | Ocala.com
This is the town that I live in^