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FWIW, he was recording your current housing expense, perfectly sensible, and actually, for your benefit. One of the key items an underwriter reviews is the increase in housing from what is being paid at the time of application and your projected, new payment. So, if the ratio was a tad high, he'd could say, well they have not had any issues paying $XXXX, they can certainly pay $XXXX. We also have plenty of places to add notations. Also, by adding this expense, he's also creating the argument why you are not saving more funds prior to closing. If you were living rent free, your savings pattern should mirror that fact. The devil is always in the details.
It is very clear that not only the communication link is broken, but the trust link has been destroyed, as well. I applaud your continuation down this road at a later date and with someone else. Make sure you find someone that takes the time to explain the various nuances of mortgage lending. There is usually good reason for the method of our madness, but shame on those that put the burden of mind reading on the applicant.
Our hotel stay includes meals 4 days a week, so technically, what we pay includes some food.
It's just that he's asking us to lie and to attest that we aren't lying. Not just on the URLA, but on 2 forms they created themselves where we are to attest we haven't misrepresented anything or omitted anything (he took our vehicles off of our "Assets" and said they don't list any assets anymore that buyers aren't selling to get cash for the downpayment, he inflated my SSDI income too).
I can't sign 4 forms attesting that I understand it's a federal crime to commit mortgage fraud, and I attest I haven't misrepresented myself if he has all these inaccurate things on the form.
I'd hate to have to get a new lender. Maybe we could use someone else at another branch of this bank....thinking out loud.
Is this a mortgage broker or the actual loan officer for a mortgage company? Sounds like a mortgage broker, and if so I suggest you find a mortgage company and work directly with that company's loan officer.
We don't include vehicles as assets and we gross-up (inflate) non taxable income. You're splitting hairs on the meals issue.
Go take a first time homebuyers class. It's becoming quite clear this loan officer is either not explaining things to you, or, you refuse to accept his explanations. For either of you to continue at this point would be a disaster. You should not be learning by spending thousands. You will only lose if you proceed while not fully understanding or distrusting this loan officer. It's not ethical to ask someone that does not feel comfortable with the transaction to proceed.
If you feel this lender is leading you to commit a federal crime, stop right now. I know if one of my applicants felt this way, I would make it very clear in the file of your discomfort and let underwriting handle your concerns in the loan commitment (most likely remedied by requiring homebuyer class).
Is this a mortgage broker or the actual loan officer for a mortgage company? Sounds like a mortgage broker, and if so I suggest you find a mortgage company and work directly with that company's loan officer.
He's a loan officer at a mortgage bank. Not a broker.
We don't include vehicles as assets and we gross-up (inflate) non taxable income. You're splitting hairs on the meals issue.
Go take a first time homebuyers class. It's becoming quite clear this loan officer is either not explaining things to you, or, you refuse to accept his explanations. For either of you to continue at this point would be a disaster. You should not be learning by spending thousands. You will only lose if you proceed while not fully understanding or distrusting this loan officer. It's not ethical to ask someone that does not feel comfortable with the transaction to proceed.
If you feel this lender is leading you to commit a federal crime, stop right now. I know if one of my applicants felt this way, I would make it very clear in the file of your discomfort and let underwriting handle your concerns in the loan commitment (most likely remedied by requiring homebuyer class).
Can you explain why you don't include vehicles as assets? It is requested on the URLA form, so why don't you include them? How can I attest that I have not left anything out, if I have left all my vehicles out?
I know that my non-taxable SSDI will be grossed up, but that should be done by the underwriter, it shouldn't be on the URLA, that is supposed to be the actual amount I get, shouldn't it? The underwriter knows to gross that up, or he/she should know, right? Or am I wrong?
I was being facetious about the meals. Sorry about that.
The industry hasn't recorded vehicles since automated underwriting came into play about two decades ago. The reason we asked about it was not to see what assets a buyer had, but to make sure we had all the car loans. If we saw a vehicle younger than 4 years old and no car loan, we requested a copy of the lien fee title. Credit reporting requirements have tightened up so much, the unreported car loan is rare (and now picked up on the pre-closing credit pull.
Loan officers run the automated approval (called DU for desktop underwriter or LP to loan prospector). DU reads what the loan officer inputs into the 1003 (loan application) prior to turning in the loan to processing. Sometimes we run it before a property is identified, and sometimes, it's an " are you kidding me-there's no way this will be declined." If the income is wrong, the loan officer will get a "refer" meaning he/she should not proceed without an underwriter's review. Loan officers are trained to interpret tax returns to determine what income to put on the application, just as we are trained in what circumstances and by how much to gross up income. Underwriters always have the authority to adjust incomes as they see fit.
Those federal warnings are not about calculations that can be interpreted different ways. It's not about forgetting about a debt not listed. The certifications are about deliberate deception, saying you will live there when you do not plan to move in, saying the funds are a gift, but going instead to a finance company for a signature loan, saying the attached tax returns are accurate when they are not and so on.
This process is so much more involved than dotting the i's and crossing the it's. Further in the process you will see such detail, but it will be the documentation you turn in will be under the microscope. Just remember, the bank is required by law to document every dime for the transaction was obtained legally and within guidelines (that's usually the cause of most stress, followed only by tax returns and other income documentation).
The industry hasn't recorded vehicles since automated underwriting came into play about two decades ago. The reason we asked about it was not to see what assets a buyer had, but to make sure we had all the car loans. If we saw a vehicle younger than 4 years old and no car loan, we requested a copy of the lien fee title. Credit reporting requirements have tightened up so much, the unreported car loan is rare (and now picked up on the pre-closing credit pull.
Loan officers run the automated approval (called DU for desktop underwriter or LP to loan prospector). DU reads what the loan officer inputs into the 1003 (loan application) prior to turning in the loan to processing. Sometimes we run it before a property is identified, and sometimes, it's an " are you kidding me-there's no way this will be declined." If the income is wrong, the loan officer will get a "refer" meaning he/she should not proceed without an underwriter's review. Loan officers are trained to interpret tax returns to determine what income to put on the application, just as we are trained in what circumstances and by how much to gross up income. Underwriters always have the authority to adjust incomes as they see fit.
Those federal warnings are not about calculations that can be interpreted different ways. It's not about forgetting about a debt not listed. The certifications are about deliberate deception, saying you will live there when you do not plan to move in, saying the funds are a gift, but going instead to a finance company for a signature loan, saying the attached tax returns are accurate when they are not and so on.
This process is so much more involved than dotting the i's and crossing the it's. Further in the process you will see such detail, but it will be the documentation you turn in will be under the microscope. Just remember, the bank is required by law to document every dime for the transaction was obtained legally and within guidelines (that's usually the cause of most stress, followed only by tax returns and other income documentation).
I got online about 3PM EST, came straight here, and read this, then had my husband read it.
Do you have any idea how you, single-handedly, by writing the above comment, have made us feel completely comfortable about our lender?! You explained everything clearly, concisely, which our lender didn't.
Now everything our lender has said, written, or put down on forms makes sense! Thank you so very much SmartMoney.
You covered all our concerns, and squashed them. I don't think you realize how you've helped us. Our lender doesn't like to talk on the phone, and doesn't like to write much in emails, so we've been starved for explanations. Thank you for giving them to us.
(As an aside: Then we went straight to my email after reading what you wrote, to see if our lender gave us the boot.
Not only did our lender not give us the boot, he reiterated we are both qualified to get a mortgage for the house (using the DU) & if we choose to go elsewhere, we won't have any problems qualifying because we have outstanding credit and our debt-to-income ratios are solid. He said the mortgage application has many areas he doesn't agree with, FWIW. He wrote intelligently (he always does, he just doesn't explain much), and was polite, and still wants our business.)
So YOU deserve to have an awesome rest of the day today because you helped someone who was really confused and feeling awful.
We know we probably will hit some bumps up ahead of us with this purchase, but those bumps we've hit before with prior purchases. All of this new paperwork is what threw us off.
Have a great Sunday And of course I'll be repping you as soon as this system allows me to.
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