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Location: Democratic Peoples Republic of Redneckistan
11,078 posts, read 15,021,497 times
Reputation: 3936
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dracul
I actually like HD's. I like smokin' them each and every opportunity I get! Such fun to spank these pretenders with true performance and grit. I really don't know who I enjoy more: the "look at me yuppies" on their shiny Road King dressers or the leather clad long hairs on their old Pan and Knuckle Heads...both are great fun to B**** Slap on the twisties with my boosted, built and NOS'd VTX!!! With 160 pounds of torque eating a steady diet of HD products is a requirement for good health!
On the flip side, I do like some recent HD styling changes and technological improvements. Your nameplate is not as antiquated as it once was doc. The V-Rods, not really HD but in the peripheral family, so to speak, are really the only Harley product worth throwing a leg over in my view but this is my choice. I seek performance and style...not meerly style and image. HD is mostly just style and image and history. This is not to say some S&S mills cannot perform. The largest S$S motors, not typically used in HD applications, can be obtained in tremendous bikes such as Bourgets, and others. Some can even exceed 200 horse power and that is impressive with pushrods and air cooling! I really like the look of S&S and other clones of this style; beautiful powerplants to be quite sure. Harley stays with the little motors, however, and performance remains pathetic.
Ride whatever you want, doc, your pockets are certainly a lot deeper than those of most of the rest of ours. Hell, buy an OCC original why don't ya and shut us all up!!!!!
I actually like HD's. I like smokin' them each and every opportunity I get! Such fun to spank these pretenders with true performance and grit. I really don't know who I enjoy more: the "look at me yuppies" on their shiny Road King dressers or the leather clad long hairs on their old Pan and Knuckle Heads...both are great fun to B**** Slap on the twisties and straightaways with my boosted, built and NOS'd VTX!!! With a 160 pounds of torque eating a steady diet of HD products is a requirement for good "rice burner" health!
On the flip side, I do like some recent HD styling changes and technological improvements. Your nameplate is not as antiquated as it once was doc. The V-Rods, not really HD but in the peripheral family, so to speak, are really the only Harley product worth throwing a leg over in my view but this is my choice. I seek performance and style...not measly style and image. HD is mostly just style and image and history. This is not to say some S&S mills cannot perform. The largest S$S motors, not typically used in HD applications, can be obtained in tremendous bikes such as Bourgets, and others. Some can even exceed 200 horse power and that is impressive with pushrods and air cooling! I really like the look of S&S and other clones of this style; beautiful power-plants to be quite sure. Harley stays with the little motors, however, and performance remains pathetic.
Ride whatever you want, doc, your pockets are certainly a lot deeper than those of most of the rest of ours. Hell, buy an OCC original why don't ya and shut us all up!!!!!
That's great! And if it makes you happy to smoke me on my Harley, I am happy to get smoked. And other than the stereotypes, your post is a good post, but if your going to assume every Harley you smoke is ridden by a "pretender", you are going to be wrong about some of those guys.
Those OCC bikes sure look great, but man, do they look uncomfortable.
Location: On the "Left Coast", somewhere in "the Land of Fruits & Nuts"
8,865 posts, read 10,405,433 times
Reputation: 6670
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnesthesiaMD
I dont think you are really understanding what I am talking about. You are free to criticize whoever and whatever you like, just I a free criticize your criticism. You cant get much more free than that. Hell, thats what this country was founded on.
I dont really protest too much...or at all, for that matter. You cant really tell in a forum where you see typed words rather than hearing the tone of my voice and seeing the expression on my face, but I am pretty unemotional about the whole thing. It's all pretty academic to me. I'm not protesting so much as pointing out the realities of this particular situation.
I dont really get what you are saying here in this next sentence...
" then why would you care so much (& self-righteously too!) about "digs & jabs" at brands you don't even own (or are you secretly hankering for a Harley)?"
I dont really care about digs and jabs about brands I dont own. I do own Harley though, and as I said, I dont really care all that much about those jabs either. I just dont get anything out of dissing other people's bikes, thats all. If you do, go for it, but dont get mad when people call you on it.
If my statement about there being nothing you can say that will change my feelings about my bike, makes you feel happy for me that I found the right bike, that would be a the response of a secure person. Hell, even if you feel totally indifferent to it, thats fine, but if it makes you feel a little pissed off, that would be the response of an insecure person.
Hey, apologies for not noticing you own a Harley. I just saw all your experiences with the Vespa, and figured the Harley mention was rhetorical. Also, that you own more than one scoot sounds very cool!
Candidly though, it's difficult to accept that this is really all just "academic" for you, considering that you started this thread to begin with, have written so much about how you feel about it here (and you've even brought in your political ideology)! But that's fine and besides, I think it's a good thing that you opened the door to exploring this kinda stuff, that instead usually just leaks out now and then as "humor".
I know it's not "academic" for me, and as Muleskinner pointed out so well, it's definitely annoying to see something you love and have been involved with for so long, suddenly get "appropriated" by idiots. Just one personal example: I live in a mountainous area that's popular with bikers of all kinds. But every few weeks in the summertime there's yet another news report of some unfortunate biker who overcooked a turn and ran off a cliff. And I'd say that probably 99% of those incidents are always some type of older rider (sometimes with a passenger!) riding some big Harley sled, not such a nimble ride to begin with. Note: these aren't crotch-rockets, or goldwings or beemers, not scooters.... they're Harleys (and with a certain kind of rider)! And naturally these roads suddenly see a big increase in police presence afterwards, to boot.
So yes, that good folks get lumped in by brand association is unfortunate, but if you're buying something (even partly) because of "image", you can't have it both ways, and get to pick just the "good" stereotypes. And as far as Kawi's, Hondas and other brands, none of this applies, because they're not really selling an "image" anyway.
Incidentally, what made you decide on your Harley (performance, price, reliability or.....)?
Incidentally, what made you decide on your Harley (performance, price, reliability or.....)?
That's cool. In reality, my point was just to point out that stereotypes are bad, whether they come from a Harley guy talking about a "rice rocket" rider, or a metric guy talking about a Harley rider.
What made me decide on a Harley? Well, I didn't really decide on the brand so much as the model. I like the retro/vintage look, which is why I bought my first Vespa instead of a more modern looking Japanese scooter. When I upgraded from my first Vespa (a 150cc) to my second scooter, I looked long and hard at the maxi scooters, and while they looked nice, none of them had that same classic look so I ended up giving up power to get another Vespa. Only this time it was a 250cc Vespa.
I will never give up my Vespa as it is just too much fun to ride, but I wanted a variety of rides to choose from, so I decided to add a motorcycle, but I wanted to stay with the vintage look. I liked reading about the history of motorcycles and from a historical standpoint the Harleys, Indians, Triumphs, and BMWs seemed to be the most prominent. BMWs, while nice, were a totally different style than what I was looking for. For a while I was stuck on the Bonneville, but eventually decided I wanted a large displacement bike to contrast the Vespa. Oh, I almost forgot, I loved the look of the Royal Enfields, but again, all small engines. I really like the Indians as well. Especially the Chief vintage, but their prices make Harleys look inexpensive. I didn't want to spend $35k + on my first bike. When I first saw the postwar bobber look of the crossbones, I knew it was the right bike for me. It had the right look, price, and engine size. I still see a Bonneville in my future, as my collection needs a mid-sized bike too.
You may ask, why not just buy a vintage bike? Well, I gave it a lot of consideration and there are a couple of reasons why. First, I dont have the time that a lot of vintage bikes require. Second, and most importantly, I often get called in the middle of the night to come to the hospital for an emergency surgery. I cant risk taking a bike that might break down on me half way there. Someone could end up paying for it with their life, so I figured 'new' is the only way for me to go. Although according to you guys, I may have the same problem with my new bike. LOL.
P.S. I think some people somehow got the impression that I am old. I'm in my 30's.
Hey doc, if you are concerned about motorcycle reliability you almost certainly chose the wrong sled for the job. If there was ever a poster child for motoring unreliability it's certainly Harley Davidson!!! As the old saw goes: 94% of all Harley's are still on the road, the remaining 6% made it to their destinations. If you like "wrenching" by the side of the road in the middle of the night because your sdfhfgdftdjuhtrhrsdhtjkrytrjr Super Dyno Widget Softail Road King, blah, blah, blah, got a bug stuck in an engine fin then HD is your kinda bike, bro. As I've stated, HD is beginning to receive the message: make bikes more powerful and reliable and efficient. Newer models are certainly better than the trash HD has thrown into the marketplace previously. However, they have A LONG WAY TO GO before they equal the technology and dependability of Italian and Japanese metrics.
Not all HD riders are slobs and snobs either, just most of them! I actually learned to ride on a Sportster and a Buell. I've ridden many HD's over my lifetime and my cousin is a Hell's Angel...you must know HD is THEIR breed of choice!!!! I've been around these tired old nags all my adult life doc. Usually so damn loud and audacious but slow to go. Too many lardbutts and pretenders hiding behind the nameplate dude. There are, of course, exceptions to this general trend...and I do fancy pretty little fems putting along on their Softails
Ride what you want pal, I like a bike with more heart and stones than anything HD produces. Period. HD is currently correcting its engineering course trajectory and that's a good thing. The V-Rod line is fairly exciting and Buell has moved away from the useless 1200 and into 4 bangers; outstanding! There is hope among all those dinosaurs I suppose.
You ought to check out Bourget Motorcycles...at least over the web. These bikes a guy like you with a fat wallet can easily afford and they offer considerable bang for the S&S inclined rider! My friend has a Fat Daddy Bourget with dual Nitrous and a huge rear end. Endless triple chrome. The finish is flawless and the design simply flows. Outrageous airbrushing! Moving art. 50 grand will set yer butt onto one of these nags and you'll forget you ever heard of Harley Davidson! You probably have more than that in your pocket change purse, buddy. There are many other customs and semi customs out there and some are even half way reliable! Just like Hardly Dangerous...I mean Harley Davidson
Last edited by dracul; 01-31-2009 at 04:44 PM..
Reason: tryin' not to dis the man's ride tooooo much:)
Location: On the "Left Coast", somewhere in "the Land of Fruits & Nuts"
8,865 posts, read 10,405,433 times
Reputation: 6670
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnesthesiaMD
That's cool. In reality, my point was just to point out that stereotypes are bad, whether they come from a Harley guy talking about a "rice rocket" rider, or a metric guy talking about a Harley rider.
What made me decide on a Harley? Well, I didn't really decide on the brand so much as the model. I like the retro/vintage look, which is why I bought my first Vespa instead of a more modern looking Japanese scooter. When I upgraded from my first Vespa (a 150cc) to my second scooter, I looked long and hard at the maxi scooters, and while they looked nice, none of them had that same classic look so I ended up giving up power to get another Vespa. Only this time it was a 250cc Vespa.
I will never give up my Vespa as it is just too much fun to ride, but I wanted a variety of rides to choose from, so I decided to add a motorcycle, but I wanted to stay with the vintage look. I liked reading about the history of motorcycles and from a historical standpoint the Harleys, Indians, Triumphs, and BMWs seemed to be the most prominent. BMWs, while nice, were a totally different style than what I was looking for. For a while I was stuck on the Bonneville, but eventually decided I wanted a large displacement bike to contrast the Vespa. Oh, I almost forgot, I loved the look of the Royal Enfields, but again, all small engines. I really like the Indians as well. Especially the Chief vintage, but their prices make Harleys look inexpensive. I didn't want to spend $35k + on my first bike. When I first saw the postwar bobber look of the crossbones, I knew it was the right bike for me. It had the right look, price, and engine size. I still see a Bonneville in my future, as my collection needs a mid-sized bike too.
You may ask, why not just buy a vintage bike? Well, I gave it a lot of consideration and there are a couple of reasons why. First, I dont have the time that a lot of vintage bikes require. Second, and most importantly, I often get called in the middle of the night to come to the hospital for an emergency surgery. I cant risk taking a bike that might break down on me half way there. Someone could end up paying for it with their life, so I figured 'new' is the only way for me to go. Although according to you guys, I may have the same problem with my new bike. LOL.
P.S. I think some people somehow got the impression that I am old. I'm in my 30's.
Understood. I also have a soft spot for vintage iron, and like you, don't feel like doing lotsa wrenching & maintenance. But despite Harley's rep re: reliability, these days if you bought it new, should be just fine if no major problems have turned up by the time it's broke-in. Now the most common complaints seem to be about finding competent maintenance.
For example, a friend has a 2007 HD FX, and when he took it to the local dealer for new tires, they put the rear axle on backwards (not an easy thing to do)!
Since you were considering Indians, dunno if you ever considered any of the "retro" metrics out there, like the Kawasaki Drifter:
Thats a Kaw? That does look like an Indian.
I'm looking for a good mechanic now. I'm having some mods one at the dealer right now, but I dont plan on using them once I find a good indy.
Hey doc, if you are concerned about motorcycle reliability you almost certainly chose the wrong sled for the job. If there was ever a poster child for motoring unreliability it's certainly Harley Davidson!!! As the old saw goes: 94% of all Harley's are still on the road, the remaining 6% made it to their destinations. If you like "wrenching" by the side of the road in the middle of the night because your sdfhfgdftdjuhtrhrsdhtjkrytrjr Super Dyno Widget Softail Road King, blah, blah, blah, got a bug stuck in an engine fin then HD is your kinda bike, bro. As I've stated, HD is beginning to receive the message: make bikes more powerful and reliable and efficient. Newer models are certainly better than the trash HD has thrown into the marketplace previously. However, they have A LONG WAY TO GO before they equal the technology and dependability of Italian and Japanese metrics.
Not all HD riders are slobs and snobs either, just most of them! I actually learned to ride on a Sportster and a Buell. I've ridden many HD's over my lifetime and my cousin is a Hell's Angel...you must know HD is THEIR breed of choice!!!! I've been around these tired old nags all my adult life doc. Usually so damn loud and audacious but slow to go. Too many lardbutts and pretenders hiding behind the nameplate dude. There are, of course, exceptions to this general trend...and I do fancy pretty little fems putting along on their Softails
Ride what you want pal, I like a bike with more heart and stones than anything HD produces. Period. HD is currently correcting its engineering course trajectory and that's a good thing. The V-Rod line is fairly exciting and Buell has moved away from the useless 1200 and into 4 bangers; outstanding! There is hope among all those dinosaurs I suppose.
You ought to check out Bourget Motorcycles...at least over the web. These bikes a guy like you with a fat wallet can easily afford and they offer considerable bang for the S&S inclined rider! My friend has a Fat Daddy Bourget with dual Nitrous and a huge rear end. Endless triple chrome. The finish is flawless and the design simply flows. Outrageous airbrushing! Moving art. 50 grand will set yer butt onto one of these nags and you'll forget you ever heard of Harley Davidson! You probably have more than that in your pocket change purse, buddy. There are many other customs and semi customs out there and some are even half way reliable! Just like Hardly Dangerous...I mean Harley Davidson
I will probably go the custom route eventually. One step at a time. Besides, my wallet isn't so fat anymore after my wife, 2 kids, 2 mortgages, and 2 car payments get to it. LOL.
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LOL.
