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Old 02-22-2014, 09:46 AM
 
4,725 posts, read 4,619,317 times
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I get that an animal would not know if it was for food or entertainment. That is why people are the caretakers of animals, and since tickets and grants fund zoos I would refuse to patronize the Copenhagen Zoo in the future. There had to be a way to either send the giraffe somewhere else or keep him alive. If there was no way, the rules need to change. Euthanasia is meant to alleviate suffering; this giraffe was not suffering, and his death was senseless.
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Old 02-22-2014, 11:20 AM
 
724 posts, read 724,615 times
Reputation: 1719
once again just highlights how selective we are with the animals we care about. If you're small and ugly, then **** you, we're squashing you. If you're common and tasty, then **** you, we're eating you. If you're cute, exotic or rare then you're valued. Ultimately none of it matters because when you get right down to it, the distinction between alive and dead doesn't really exist, it's all just collections of inanimate matter at the end of the day. And that goes for people too, the only reason we have to pretend a human is somehow more valuable than a bacterium is that society collapses if we don't. The line you draw at what is the simplest living organism and what is just a complicated bit of chemistry is completely arbitrary.

Last edited by el_marto; 02-22-2014 at 11:28 AM..
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Old 02-22-2014, 12:17 PM
 
Location: Chicago area
15,325 posts, read 8,486,761 times
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The article never addressed the fact that an older animal from the same gene pool wasn't chosen for lion fodder because????? I'm sure a suitable or even better place could have been chosen to send Marius. Why does the zoo feel that they are the best and no other facility would be as successful in caring for their doomed from the start baby giraffe? If the zoo lets their animals breed indiscriminately doesn't it make it just as bad as the irresponsible pet owner allowing their pets to breed and over populate? Am I the only one that see's zoos as sad places manufactured for the amusement of man kind. If zoos were truly interested in conservation and the emotional welfare of their animals they would leave them in their natural habitat and develop a natural zoo around the animals. The killing of Marius was just another example of man's arrogance and our disrespect for a life on the planet that we are all supposed to share together in harmony.
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Old 02-22-2014, 05:20 PM
 
Location: The New England part of Ohio
19,521 posts, read 24,463,997 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tantamount View Post
This is so very sad. I also object to the "Marius Was Necropsied In Front Of Guests" decision. The public demonstration of it was just downright cruel and wrong.

I don't care if they felt they killed him in a humane fashion; there seemed to be no good reason for his death other than overcrowding.

Also: "Marius’ genetics are such that he could not contribute productively to that program, and his offspring would be detrimental to the overall population. "
I guess he also wasn't perfect enough for breeding either.


I think it's disgraceful. I take issues with most zoos in general. This is a zoo at it's worst.

I have no issue with the humane euthanization of a sick animal. But the animal deserves some dignity.

He was tricked with a slice of rye bread, his favorite treat, and then shot in the head and humiliated in death.

Is THIS what we want to treat our young? That when we are smarter and have more power than another species, that we should trick them, and kill them?

It reminds me of public executions.

Things like this bring out the worst in people.
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Old 02-22-2014, 06:29 PM
 
4,725 posts, read 4,619,317 times
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Originally Posted by sheena12 View Post
I think it's disgraceful. I take issues with most zoos in general. This is a zoo at it's worst.

I have no issue with the humane euthanization of a sick animal. But the animal deserves some dignity.

He was tricked with a slice of rye bread, his favorite treat, and then shot in the head and humiliated in death.

Is THIS what we want to treat our young? That when we are smarter and have more power than another species, that we should trick them, and kill them?

It reminds me of public executions.

Things like this bring out the worst in people.
Agree completely.
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Old 02-22-2014, 06:41 PM
 
541 posts, read 743,443 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by harry chickpea View Post
Tantamount, the article covers the necropsy very clearly. It was ONLY those who actively wanted to be present that were allowed to watch.
But why would anyone want to watch this? I can only surmise it would be purposeful to perhaps a Biology major or Veterinary School Student learning about the makeup of the animal. Still seems gruesome!

Quote:
I found the article elegant in that it put various aspects in perspective while still having respect. I have hammered on the point before, but kids who have either grown up on a farm or seen the full cycle of life are much better able to handle the realities of nature than those who grew up on only on Disney's version of anthropomorphic animals in a cartoon setting.
I didn't grow up on a farm but my Great Grandma did and yes, I was told they didn't name their animals for a reason. Living in an age of PETA and awareness of Vegans, I find it so hard to just accept a taking of an animal's life when they are young and healthy. I know the article tried to gently and pragmatically explain the reasoning behind the killing, but it still upsets me.
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Old 02-22-2014, 07:38 PM
 
Location: The New England part of Ohio
19,521 posts, read 24,463,997 times
Reputation: 51715
I agree. Why would anyone want to watch THAT? It isn't educational and it is hardly representative of the circle of life.

What WILD animals do to one another is natural to WILD animals. In a wild setting.

When we bate bears, "fight" bulls, set up dog fighting establishments ala Micheal Vick, we create an unnatural and inherently cruel situation.

Personally, I do not enjoy watching a tiger chasing as elk. Or what ever.

But then, I'm not an animal. I answer to a higher power.
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Old 02-22-2014, 08:27 PM
Status: "chickpea soup" (set 25 days ago)
 
18,762 posts, read 56,493,459 times
Reputation: 33163
Tantamount, I understand a planned death like this can be upsetting even though the article did try to guide readers on the whys and hows.

Animalcrazy, "The article never addressed the fact that an older animal from the same gene pool wasn't chosen for lion fodder because?" That is a very good question, well worth asking. I have no idea, but would be interested in the answer to that. I hope you pursue it.

el_marto, I agree with the idea that all carnal life ends up inanimate, and that the distinctions we make are arbitrary or even hard wired into our thinking. Baby seals with giant eyes are particularly appealing to many, as that trait is hardwired to protect our own offspring. Killer whales find those same cute pups appealing as well, like potato chips. Roaches and Norway rats get seen by humans as competitors to be crushed. Lord help humanity if rats develop big doey eyes and nicer fur.

The ethical questions raised by the event are thought provoking, especially for those who have only been guided by emotion and peer approval in their own relationship with animals. Each person has to find his or her own individual path, while recognizing that all life dies, often painfully or brutally.

I put forth the link to the article in hopes of measured and respectful discussion without folks becoming so lost in feelings that their points might become lost or discarded. Everyone has more than met that expectation, and the exposing of possible alternatives shows how groups can come up with good solid ideas, which may then form the basis for change.

I hope the thread remains on this level and doesn't get tossed into the basket of "other controversies" because it truly does belong here.
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Old 02-23-2014, 01:43 AM
 
Location: Missouri
592 posts, read 689,031 times
Reputation: 549
It's sad that they sacrificed this young animal like that. But, I don't understand why people are so worked up about it.
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