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That's one of the problems with the US.. We are sooo far behind all other civilized countries on lots of things and then we wonder why our kids grow up not having a clue or get into trouble...
We will let our kids see people getting shot, blown up, gutted, tortured, etc.. BUT Hell be bent if they see a flash on skin, or hear a cuss word, or see an autopsy of an animal, or anything like that...
Let's not let the kids see anyone taking a bath, going to the bathroom, getting out of bed naked after being asleep, etc...
I see nothing wrong with kids seeing an autopsy of an animal especially if they and their parents knew beforehand....
We need to teach our children about things in this world and not all of them seem to be pleasant or in the US's case un prudish.... Kids will learn stuff one way or another and if you try to shield them from something they will try that much harder to figure it out.... Such is the case of sex ed in the US and all the pregnancies...
That's one of the problems with the US.. We are sooo far behind all other civilized countries on lots of things and then we wonder why our kids grow up not having a clue or get into trouble...
We will let our kids see people getting shot, blown up, gutted, tortured, etc.. BUT Hell be bent if they see a flash on skin, or hear a cuss word, or see an autopsy of an animal, or anything like that...
Let's not let the kids see anyone taking a bath, going to the bathroom, getting out of bed naked after being asleep, etc...
I see nothing wrong with kids seeing an autopsy of an animal especially if they and their parents knew beforehand....
We need to teach our children about things in this world and not all of them seem to be pleasant or in the US's case un prudish.... Kids will learn stuff one way or another and if you try to shield them from something they will try that much harder to figure it out.... Such is the case of sex ed in the US and all the pregnancies...
Absolutely.
Just look at that ( 18 + of course,) America is so far behind.
And so are the Russians, who are pointing at all that, saying that the West (Europe in this case) is regressing, and they want none of this "progressiveness" - neither of "sexual liberation with parent # 1 and parent # 2,") nor the killing/dissecting of animals in front of their children in the Zoo or in the classrooms.
I LOVED butchering days at the farm when I was a kid. That was when I learned about the internal organs, how they worked, how they were all connected, where they were, etc. I found it fascinating. It spurred my interest in the sciences, and in fact, I ended up studying the sciences in college. Ive always been interested in biology, anatomy, etc. Dissecting animals was amazing and I learned so much about anatomy from doing that.
My oldest is the same way. He loved the dissecting part of high school science. When he went fishing as a kid, he loved to clean the fish and then further explore the innards and see how it was all put together. When he went hunting as a kid, he found the butchering part very interesting so he could study the internal anatomy.
It is good for kids to know where meat comes from, where leather comes from, etc.
Dissecting a dead porcupine and having compassion for animals are unrelated. The porcupine was already dead. It's not like the girl wanted to finish it off so she could cut it open. It was already dead.
I've lived in Europe, and I believe I understand the mentality of the Copenhagen Zoo very well. That doesn't mean that I agree with it. To the Zoo managers the Zoo (one of the oldest in Europe) is like a genetic Noah's Ark. They think of themselves as preserving species for the future, not for the sake of the individual animals, but for the species itself, as well as for humans of the future. That was, I believe, the reason why they stopped naming their animals--they were to be regarded as anonymous bricks in a grand preservation/research project. Hence the killing of the healthy giraffe a few years ago. And it is that educational/research aspect that makes them make dissections of animals open to the public.
This is where I see a problem, which I think is in their attitude rather than in our different sensibilities. They have deliberately distanced themselves from the Zoo being a form of entertainment, or extension of a Kindergarten world of exotic pets, so they have gone completely clinical about individual animal lives, as well as about individual children's reactions. They have forgotten that many kids love those animals as individuals, and have probably seen them often during previous visits. Yes, it was a publicly announced event, and nobody was forced to watch. And many kids probably got valuable insight into biological details. But some sensitive kids may have received a nightmare for life. Even if some might say we're sentimentalizing Zoo animals, I think that as long as we still want Zoos, we need to respect that in addition to being research facilities they are also emotional outlets for kids (young and old) who love the natural world and its individual inhabitants. Those animals are ambassadors for their relatives in the wild, and you don't treat ambassadors like so much meat ready to be carved up...
Guess you have never been in a high school biology class, or a university one.
Why oh why do we want to keep reality from children?
Let me tell you another real story. As I said, we lived in an urban area where my kids grew up. I had a cabin out in the woods, and one day, my daughter asked if the neighbors daughter could come along. I was a bit concerned again, because we did rural stuff, like going fishing and shooting guns. I told her I would talk to her friends dad, as I wanted to tell him what the situation was, and if he was OK if his daughter could also shoot the .22 at targets, just like my kids. I didn't want the little girl to feel like an outsider, but I also wanted her parents to know what might occur out there.
He and his wife were OK with it, as they knew me.
We went fishing, and my rule with my kids was, you catch it, you clean it. The little girl was told the same thing, but I told her I would show her how.
Well we got a number of pike, with her catching two. A very excited 9 year old. I showed her with the first one, and when I sliced open the belly, I noticed the stomach was extended.
I told her, and my kids, that this was unusual, and I would open it up. Inside was a fair sized perch, but what was even more unusual, the perch and a minnow in ITS mouth. All the kids got to see the entire food chain there, which was fascinating too them.
As we drove home, a road kill porcupine laid on the side of the road. My 7 year old son wanted me to stopped, as he wanted to get some quills for show and tell. We did, and the little neighbor girl wanted to go see it also. I again was concerned about traumatizing her, as who knew what condition the road kill was in? I told her it might not be pretty, an to come back if she was grossed out. Well, she barely got to the road kill, and came running back. Again, I was concerned.
She came up to my window and said.... "Mr. XYZ, can I borrow your knife?"
"Why?", I asked, relieved that she was OK.
"I want to cut the porcupine open and see its stomach and see what it ate.", was her reply!!!!
I just about choked laughing, and had to explain to her, that perhaps that was not the best idea.
So, kids do not get traumatized as much as you think, and their natural curiosity can become wonderful educational moments.
Don't pre-judge.
What an awesome story. Thank you for sharing!
It is a shame that their is so much regulatory stuff in the way of salvaging roadkill(esp. birds) for various purposes. I've seen a few animals that would make great practice for taxidermy.
It is a much more realistic and inquiring look at the world.
As much of a biologist as I may be-I have yet to dissect any of my own animals that have passed on(except in the case of an autopsy to confirm a hunch). The sentimental value can still kick in in these cases. I admit it is irrational.
Reading the headline I thought it was good idea. They should definitely practice dissection on the lion before they move on to the children.
Ok, it wasn't just me then. I read the title and thought, "Zoos are dissecting children? Zoo Keeper: 'You see what we're doing to this lion, kid? You're next!'"
As for the topic itself...I guess if the parents are okay with it, then there's nothing to say about it.
Ok, it wasn't just me then. I read the title and thought, "Zoos are dissecting children? Zoo Keeper: 'You see what we're doing to this lion, kid? You're next!'"
As for the topic itself...I guess if the parents are okay with it, then there's nothing to say about it.
Nobody mentioned the "tuffs of fur." English as a second language or no one proofreading?
I don't have a problem with them dissecting the animal in front of the children - I think that's a wonderful educational activity. I just find the euthanizing of healthy excess zoo animals to be distasteful. The European argument is that contraceptives would affect the natural behaviors of the animals, but um, they're zoo animals. Their natural behaviors WILL be altered just by that fact. The idea that putting them in a severely restricted and fake environment is fine but contraceptives are a bridge too far seems highly illogical to me.
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