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Old 04-14-2017, 09:33 AM
 
Location: Sector 001
7,465 posts, read 6,908,230 times
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I find this topic fascinating... but would we really want to revive a species like the passenger pigeon? I look at how obnoxious species like Grackles are and I ask myself would I want a bird species that would dwarf the Grackle many times over in sheer numbers to be flying around pooping everywhere and making noise? Given the choice I'd take the Black Birds out of the gene pool as well given how they'll take over areas of trees and drive other songbirds out.

Seems like it's a matter of time before it happens though and by 2050 it's very possible there could be flocks of hundreds of millions of passenger pigeons that dwarf anything the black bird might do flying around the forests as certain groups seem hell bent on reintroducing them into the wild, for various reasons. . Good idea or bad? Should we be messing with the ecosystem and reviving what could be pest species?
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Old 04-18-2017, 09:01 AM
 
Location: Type 0.7 Kardashev
10,576 posts, read 7,639,867 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stockwiz View Post
I find this topic fascinating... but would we really want to revive a species like the passenger pigeon? I look at how obnoxious species like Grackles are and I ask myself would I want a bird species that would dwarf the Grackle many times over in sheer numbers to be flying around pooping everywhere and making noise? Given the choice I'd take the Black Birds out of the gene pool as well given how they'll take over areas of trees and drive other songbirds out.

Seems like it's a matter of time before it happens though and by 2050 it's very possible there could be flocks of hundreds of millions of passenger pigeons that dwarf anything the black bird might do flying around the forests as certain groups seem hell bent on reintroducing them into the wild, for various reasons. . Good idea or bad? Should we be messing with the ecosystem and reviving what could be pest species?
I take no position on whether or not the passenger pigeon species should exist once again, but the idea that if it comes come to exist it will necessarily do so in numbers that mirror the past is wrong. I suppose it may... but plenty of species exist under very circumstances now.

For example, there used to be bison ranging from northern California to southern New York and down to northern Florida and west to northern Mexico. But no one thinks that keeping Bison bison from going extinct means that, for example, Illinois is eventually going to be overrun by them. The same is true of many species. Indeed, one of the causes of the extinction of the passenger pigeon - in addition to widescale spaughter - was the loss of habitat, mainly eastern deciduous forests. And no ones going to be evacuating cities and abandoning farmland so that the forests will be coming back.

PS - Do you not see the irony in your 'messing with the ecosystem' comment?

PPS - What does humanity do that isn't, in some way, 'messing with the ecosystem'?

PPPS - What's a 'pest species'? One that annoys you? Should we let the wolf go extinct? It causes some people problems. How about deer? Should we lift protections on them so that they go extinct, for they extract an exponentially larger toll (billions in annual damage to vehicles with a few dozen people killed, untold amount of crop losses due to foraging, etc.)? You might be hard-pressed to find a species that isn't a 'pest' to someone or other.
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Old 04-18-2017, 09:03 AM
 
Location: North Beach, MD on the Chesapeake
34,881 posts, read 44,433,245 times
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In some cases there were reasons, mostly environmental, species went extinct. Sabre tooth cats and direwolves come to mind. Can you imagine them being reanimated and reintroduced with the outcry about wolves, coyotes and mountain lions expanding their ranges?
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Old 04-18-2017, 01:35 PM
bg7
 
7,697 posts, read 8,607,413 times
Reputation: 15152
Quote:
Originally Posted by stockwiz View Post
I find this topic fascinating... but would we really want to revive a species like the passenger pigeon? I look at how obnoxious species like Grackles are and I ask myself would I want a bird species that would dwarf the Grackle many times over in sheer numbers to be flying around pooping everywhere and making noise? Given the choice I'd take the Black Birds out of the gene pool as well given how they'll take over areas of trees and drive other songbirds out.

Seems like it's a matter of time before it happens though and by 2050 it's very possible there could be flocks of hundreds of millions of passenger pigeons that dwarf anything the black bird might do flying around the forests as certain groups seem hell bent on reintroducing them into the wild, for various reasons. . Good idea or bad? Should we be messing with the ecosystem and reviving what could be pest species?


That's what we did when shot two billion of them. As for the pest species, that's really homo sapiens. So perhaps we could try to reverse a bit of the monumental eff-up we caused.
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Old 04-20-2017, 03:19 PM
 
Location: Omaha, Nebraska
8,407 posts, read 4,827,438 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by North Beach Person View Post
In some cases there were reasons, mostly environmental, species went extinct.
And those are the species I can't see trying to revive, since there's no ecological space they'd fit into any more. On the other hand, species that were wiped out fairly recently, and largely due to either overhunting or deliberate targeted extermination (such as the passenger Pigeon, the Carolina Parakeet, the Tasmanian Tiger, etc.) I can see bringing back, even if just in limited numbers.
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Old 04-20-2017, 03:25 PM
 
Location: Omaha, Nebraska
8,407 posts, read 4,827,438 times
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Slightly off-topic, but some of you might find this way of reviving (or rather, memorializing) lost species in the places where they once thrived of interest: About The Lost Bird Project
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Old 04-20-2017, 03:30 PM
 
Location: North Beach, MD on the Chesapeake
34,881 posts, read 44,433,245 times
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Originally Posted by Aredhel View Post
And those are the species I can't see trying to revive, since there's no ecological space they'd fit into any more. On the other hand, species that were wiped out fairly recently, and largely due to either overhunting or deliberate targeted extermination (such as the passenger Pigeon, the Carolina Parakeet, the Tasmanian Tiger, etc.) I can see bringing back, even if just in limited numbers.
Yeah, but the megafauna I mentioned are sexy and what they talk about bringing back along with Mastodons/Wooly Mammoths.
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Old 04-20-2017, 05:30 PM
 
6,127 posts, read 2,780,968 times
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I think they should be revived if humanity played a leading role in their extinction, and if there's a realistic opportunity that they can thrive once again the wild.
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Old 04-20-2017, 05:43 PM
 
Location: Omaha, Nebraska
8,407 posts, read 4,827,438 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Razza94 View Post
I think they should be revived if humanity played a leading role in their extinction, and if there's a realistic opportunity that they can thrive once again the wild.
I think that's a good set of criteria to use in deciding which species to try to revive, should it ever become possible to do so.
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