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Old 06-16-2020, 04:02 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hemlock140 View Post
This is impossible to prove, since plants cannot communicate.

As I recall from that PBS special there had to be some type of low level communication at least with some plants. It may have just been something emitted from one plant that triggered the other plant but nonetheless "danger" was communicated to other plants.


Quote:
Stinging Nettle
I grew up near river, those were my childhood nemesis. That is one of the most annoying feelings in the world and it's usually a large patch of skin that gets it.
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Old 06-20-2020, 10:51 AM
 
Location: Seattle
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Your average fly probably has more mental computing power than any tree. At best, there's probably some type of chemical signalling system at work within the plant.
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Old 06-20-2020, 11:08 AM
 
Location: San Antonio/Houston/Tricity
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So, what's next... A Humane Agriculture Movement?
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Old 06-20-2020, 02:42 PM
 
Location: on the wind
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Therblig View Post
It's a really, really old idea, predating the groovy 1970s. Roald Dahl wrote a fairly chilling horror story about it in 1949.
Have you read any stories by Ursula K. Le Guin? Several involve plant consciousness/sentience. Especially Vaster Than Empires and More Slow. That'll make you shiver!
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Old 06-20-2020, 05:15 PM
 
Location: The Driftless Area, WI
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Like that Supreme Court judge's definition of obscenity: "I can't define it, but I know it when I see it."--


"Consciousness" has to be operationally defined (ie- an ad hoc definition) for the specific discussion or experiment.


The classic reflex arc: a stretch receptor in the patellar tendon is stimulated with a test hammer and it relays an electric change in the cell membrane to an afferent nerve which synapses with an efferent nerve in the spinal chord, which in turn relays the membrane potential change to the quads muscle which causes the leg to kick up.....The message is simultaneously relayed up to the brain and our "consciousness" becomes aware of what's going on, but can't do anything about it in time to prevent the quads from starting to kick.....Einstein coming up with the General Theory of Relativity is really the same thing, but with more connections in the cerebral cortex.


Compare that to the chemical receptor/chemical response of plants. An analogous situation.


The only real difference is that Einstein knew that he knew, and then remembered it so he could know it again.


PS-- there's a difference between pain and suffering: pain is a reflex arc that requires no consciousness. Suffering is the conscious aftermath of pain.


Conclusion: No, plants only exhibit stimulus-->response reflexes. They don't know that they know. No consciousness involved, unless you have an agenda to be served.
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Old 06-24-2020, 09:33 AM
 
Location: Southern MN
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I'm not given to a lot of scientific thinking but I have curiosity about these things.

This summer I read that some insects know which plant leaves to dine upon by the vibrations they give off. I thought that was interesting.

In my yard I'm always mystified and amused by my volunteer morning glories. How do they "know" where there is something nearby that they can cling to and vine? They seem to as they will reach out and grow in the direction of a pole. As an experiment I've redirected the growth to see what happens and in a couple of weeks it usually will have reversed direction again trying to reach a climbing source.

There's probably a simple stimulus/response explanation for this but to right-brained me it interprets as though the vine knows where it needs to go.

By coincidence just last night I ran into this article from "The Guardian." Shades of the Sixties! Have a chuckle:

https://www.coasttocoastam.com/artic...potted-plants/
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Old 06-24-2020, 02:58 PM
 
Location: on the wind
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lodestar View Post

In my yard I'm always mystified and amused by my volunteer morning glories. How do they "know" where there is something nearby that they can cling to and vine? They seem to as they will reach out and grow in the direction of a pole. As an experiment I've redirected the growth to see what happens and in a couple of weeks it usually will have reversed direction again trying to reach a climbing source.

There's probably a simple stimulus/response explanation for this but to right-brained me it interprets as though the vine knows where it needs to go.
I wish the one exotic vining potted plant I have had this "talent". It puts up its tendril like clockwork every spring but never seems to discover the support frame I carefully place for it. The tendril flounders around in every direction and refuses to wrap around the support until I zip tie it there!
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Old 06-24-2020, 09:03 PM
 
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Yes there is a consensus, no they are not conscious.
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Old 06-25-2020, 12:33 AM
 
Location: British Columbia ~🌄 ☀️ ♥ 🍁 ♥ ☀️🌄~
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Default Is there a scientific consensus on whether or not plants are conscious?

I think the general consensus is that humans don't know the answer yet, whether they're scientists or not.

I think there should be a poll for this question. Do you believe plants possess consciousness?

(I'd vote yes. )
.
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Old 06-25-2020, 04:56 AM
 
Location: Swiftwater, PA
16,405 posts, read 13,175,034 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zoisite View Post
I think the general consensus is that humans don't know the answer yet, whether they're scientists or not.

I think there should be a poll for this question. Do you believe plants possess consciousness?

(I'd vote yes. )
.
Should we euthanize that salad before the vegan consumes it? Do plants prefer to be eaten alive or dead? Perhaps frozen would be the most humane since the cold could stop or numb the pain receptors? But should that be flash frozen to reduce the amount of 'suffering'? So many questions!
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