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Old 02-20-2011, 07:53 AM
 
1,931 posts, read 3,415,904 times
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Originally Posted by Ann77 View Post
Is this what Democrats do now, call people FAT when they don't like what they have to say? LOL

Tick for tack. If the suit fits or not just wear it. LOL
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Old 02-20-2011, 07:55 AM
 
1,527 posts, read 4,065,979 times
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I think it's easy for both sides to blame each other.

The teachers' union blames the private sector and wants to tax them more and more and more. This makes sense, as it's in their best financial interest.

On the other side, taxpayers can't pay anymore and it's not a politically viable solution to just raise taxes to levels high enough to meet these unfunded liabilities.

What happens remains to be seen I guess.
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Old 02-20-2011, 07:57 AM
 
1,931 posts, read 3,415,904 times
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Originally Posted by CaptainNJ View Post
this is what the private sector has to do in order to survive. we have to make cuts and we have to be efficient. but the public sector just takes and takes from the working americans and they couldnt care less about how everyone else suffers to support this privileged class.

Really really? You make no sense at all. Your premise is we can find teachers to teach for less. Yet that doesnt apply to the rest of the world? Surely a bank manager makes around 100k, are you telling me we cant find someone to do it for less in these times? That would help bring down my bank fees and be a big savings for all of us. I guess that doesnt help your argument so I guess in your world the only jobs that people will do for less money are cops,firefighters and teachers. Good one genius.
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Old 02-20-2011, 07:58 AM
 
1,527 posts, read 4,065,979 times
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Originally Posted by bababua View Post
Tick for tack. If the suit fits or not just wear it. LOL
"Chris Christie is a bully and he's FAT!"

I'm actually quite tiny, I just have a big mouth.
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Old 02-20-2011, 08:01 AM
 
1,527 posts, read 4,065,979 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bababua View Post
Really really? You make no sense at all. Your premise is we can find teachers to teach for less. Yet that doesnt apply to the rest of the world? Surely a bank manager makes around 100k, are you telling me we cant find someone to do it for less in these times? That would help bring down my bank fees and be a big savings for all of us. I guess that doesnt help your argument so I guess in your world the only jobs that people will do for less money are cops,firefighters and teachers. Good one genius.
Even if the gov't took away the collective bargaining power, we may very well find that teachers are being paid the right amount, or perhaps they would even make more if the jobs went out to the free market. Or less. Who knows.

Certainly, teachers would make different amounts depending on their ability, specialty, demand for their skills, etc.

For example, I never understood how an AP science teacher should make the same as a Kindergarten teacher. From a market perspective, there are a lot more people willing to be K teachers than AP science teachers. And AP science teachers could go and be scientists in the private sector while a person trained to be a K teacher is pretty much only trained to be that.
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Old 02-20-2011, 08:01 AM
 
1,931 posts, read 3,415,904 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ann77 View Post
I think it's easy for both sides to blame each other.

The teachers' union blames the private sector and wants to tax them more and more and more. This makes sense, as it's in their best financial interest.

On the other side, taxpayers can't pay anymore and it's not a politically viable solution to just raise taxes to levels high enough to meet these unfunded liabilities.

What happens remains to be seen I guess.

Again you are painting me with a very very broad brush. I was for the first cuts in education and municipal funding. What I am against are lies and half truths that are being pushed around. Ever wonder what Trenton has done with all the money it takes in? Ever wonder why politicians are most guilty of double dipping yet a teacher or cop who is busting their hump is being villainized? I do, sorry I cant be on one side. I wonder how can a state like Wisconsin have such low property taxes yet pay teacher a much better salary relative to that of NJ teachers. Again one can wonder and thats what this is all about. The system in NJ is set up to pit "taxpayers" vs public workers. What Trenton does with all the money no one will ever ever know.
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Old 02-20-2011, 08:03 AM
 
1,931 posts, read 3,415,904 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ann77 View Post
Even if the gov't took away the collective bargaining power, we may very well find that teachers are being paid the right amount, or perhaps they would even make more if the jobs went out to the free market. Or less. Who knows.

Certainly, teachers would make different amounts depending on their ability, specialty, demand for their skills, etc.

For example, I never understood how an AP science teacher should make the same as a Kindergarten teacher. From a market perspective, there are a lot more people willing to be K teachers than AP science teachers. And AP science teachers could go and be scientists in the private sector while a person trained to be a K teacher is pretty much only trained to be that.

You are right they should pay kindergarten teachers 1 million dollars. I am pulling my hair out chasing my two kids and trying to teach them anything on the weekends. The fact they do that with 20 to 30 kids is honestly a miracle.
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Old 02-20-2011, 08:03 AM
 
1,527 posts, read 4,065,979 times
Reputation: 444
Quote:
Originally Posted by bababua View Post
Again you are painting me with a very very broad brush. I was for the first cuts in education and municipal funding. What I am against are lies and half truths that are being pushed around. Ever wonder what Trenton has done with all the money it takes in? Ever wonder why politicians are most guilty of double dipping yet a teacher or cop who is busting their hump is being villainized? I do, sorry I cant be on one side. I wonder how can a state like Wisconsin have such low property taxes yet pay teacher a much better salary relative to that of NJ teachers. Again one can wonder and thats what this is all about. The system in NJ is set up to pit "taxpayers" vs public workers. What Trenton does with all the money no one will ever ever know.
I thought that poster from Wisconsin came on here and disagreed that the taxes were lower than NJ? I wasn't sure we ever figured out that was true, that the tax burden is lower than NJ.
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Old 02-20-2011, 08:07 AM
 
1,527 posts, read 4,065,979 times
Reputation: 444
Quote:
Originally Posted by bababua View Post
You are right they should pay kindergarten teachers 1 million dollars. I am pulling my hair out chasing my two kids and trying to teach them anything on the weekends. The fact they do that with 20 to 30 kids is honestly a miracle.
I don't think the job is that hard. But it has its own skill set.

The point is, the market would certainly dictate different rates for different fields based on supply and demand.
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Old 02-20-2011, 08:27 AM
 
Location: West Orange, NJ
12,546 posts, read 21,416,941 times
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Originally Posted by Ann77 View Post
Eh. I guess you have to like working with kids, but to be honest, I haven't met many in the field that really like kids all that much.
most teachers i know love the kids but hate the parents of the kids. haha. as for teacher pay myth, what exactly is a comparable private sector employee?
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