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Old 03-31-2011, 05:14 AM
 
1,527 posts, read 4,064,037 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anna_mom View Post
I can't imagine how high it will go without him....
Remember too, Christie doesn't have the Legislature, like Scott Walker did in Wisconsin. If he did, I bet things would be changing really fast.
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Old 03-31-2011, 05:17 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NJ07035 View Post
Putting aside that Mrs. Christie does NOT get "publicly funded money" - I look forward to you playing with the semantics - why don't we insult EVERYONE who outearns even one teacher?
That's really the question.

Is anyone allowed to make more than a Kindergarten teacher?
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Old 03-31-2011, 05:56 AM
 
Location: On the Rails in Northern NJ
12,380 posts, read 26,853,319 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jknic View Post
I disagree with you on the long vs short term thing. Most of the problem extends from the black hole that the teachers union it is, and because they refuse to compromise, we're pretty much stuck between a rock and a hard place. He's trying to get us to consolidate are have less redundancies, but our VERY strong sense of home/self rule (going back to the Dutch and even the Lenapi) is going to to put up a VERY large resistance to such measures. I'm okay with the private companies that he's given cash to, because they are being forced to give part of their income back to the state. Plus, it's helping to spur jobs. Honestly, if there's anything we should be pouring money into, it's getting industry back into NJ. If we can get back our industrial backbone (while trying to develop smartly, returning to the cities and focusing on denser housing and VERY walkable communities), we'll have the strongest economy in the state.
Sigh i wish we could be like New England in the Merged towns dept..... But his Downfall is dumping hundreds of millions into The Casinos and Meadowlands.... Govt should stay out of private business , everytime Govt gets evolved it hurts the Tax payers one way or the other... No jobs will come out of it.....just greed and corruption.... Fixing up the cities with create jobs and look at Newark alot of investment is pouring in.....now if Christie can only do this for Camden , Paterson , & Elizabeth. I do like his attacks on the Unions , but he has to come up with long term solutions....hes coming up with Short term solutions that will only last 2-3 years...
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Old 03-31-2011, 07:09 AM
 
71 posts, read 227,090 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eleanora1 View Post
I'm insulting her profession.

Why is okay to insult teachers but not okay to insult someone who probably earns at least five times what they do? Christie has steadfastly defending the upper income earners while attacking ordinary working class people. His own wife is banker. Her income deserves to be on the table if we're going to discuss people who get publically funded money.

Why is one okay and not the other?
from what I know, investor bankers work for 80-90hrs/wk, got their positions competing against huge pool of applicanst, went to some great universities (and again, competed against huge pool of high schoolers to be accepted), worked hard through school given the academic level and motivation of their peers), sacrified everything for work in the first 3-5 years in the position, you practically live in your office and the learning curve is extremely steep and self-performed... so in brief, I see what what put in to get their level of compensation...

let's take a teacher... no competition even close by to those in banks, you just need to get certain amount of hours and courses at nobody cares which college... as a result of such hard work, teachers get two months summer vacation every year, work until 3/4PM every day, no overtime, and get the compensation package exceed those that the professionals get through THE COMPETITION in private sector positions with 40-60hrs/wk put in... and then teachers require constant salary raise in no-inflation environment... and finally, we as parents find that most teacher are not even capable to differentiate kids in the regular classroom... they require additional fundings all the time to go and get somebody to teach them and give them additional training during their paid hours, self-learning is not an option, that's too difficult... compensation is based on the hrs of the training and yrs spent on the job, not on the performance!!!

get yourself some tuitoring part-time job after 4PM and you'll get your additional income... and please stop compare yourself to those put in much-much-much more to get where they are... disgusting!!! (((
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Old 03-31-2011, 07:55 AM
 
1,527 posts, read 4,064,037 times
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Another thing that the teachers union seems to conveniently leave out of the discussion is the value of tenure. I mean, the financial value, as well as the emotional value.

As anyone in the private sector knows, you can walk in any day and be let go just like that, for no reason, no matter how much or how little money you made the year before.
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Old 04-01-2011, 07:44 AM
 
122 posts, read 377,551 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ann77 View Post
Another thing that the teachers union seems to conveniently leave out of the discussion is the value of tenure. I mean, the financial value, as well as the emotional value.

As anyone in the private sector knows, you can walk in any day and be let go just like that, for no reason, no matter how much or how little money you made the year before.
As any teacher knows, if you give a student a bad grade and that student's parent is on the school board or in government, without tenure they could easily be canned just for doing their job.

Or if they teach evolution and a school board/government individual takes umbrage at such a thing, tenure allows a teacher to at least teach the curriculum that the state requires in the right manner.

Heaven forbid that a teacher have the ability to do their job without retribution for doing so.
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Old 04-01-2011, 08:16 AM
 
1,527 posts, read 4,064,037 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MJPByron View Post
As any teacher knows, if you give a student a bad grade and that student's parent is on the school board or in government, without tenure they could easily be canned just for doing their job.

Or if they teach evolution and a school board/government individual takes umbrage at such a thing, tenure allows a teacher to at least teach the curriculum that the state requires in the right manner.

Heaven forbid that a teacher have the ability to do their job without retribution for doing so.
Of course. We can debate the value of tenure, pros and cons.

Nevertheless, there is value in having a job where you can't get fired barring doing something really really bad, and involving a process for the school district that costs hundreds of thousands of dollars. Private sector workers can get fired at any time for no reason.

Teachers don't appreciate the value of the tenure, and it's usually left out of the discussion.
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Old 04-01-2011, 08:56 AM
 
Location: NJ
17,573 posts, read 46,144,871 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MJPByron View Post
As any teacher knows, if you give a student a bad grade and that student's parent is on the school board or in government, without tenure they could easily be canned just for doing their job.

Or if they teach evolution and a school board/government individual takes umbrage at such a thing, tenure allows a teacher to at least teach the curriculum that the state requires in the right manner.

Heaven forbid that a teacher have the ability to do their job without retribution for doing so.
Welcome to the real world where you can be fired for no reason at all.
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Old 04-01-2011, 09:25 AM
 
11,337 posts, read 11,041,348 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MJPByron View Post
As any teacher knows, if you give a student a bad grade and that student's parent is on the school board or in government, without tenure they could easily be canned just for doing their job.

Or if they teach evolution and a school board/government individual takes umbrage at such a thing, tenure allows a teacher to at least teach the curriculum that the state requires in the right manner.

Heaven forbid that a teacher have the ability to do their job without retribution for doing so.
This is all nonsense. Tenure needs to be dumped. As long as teachers teach the material approved by those in charge of making those decisions, they will never be fired for "doing their job". Tenure is like seniority - a collectivist concept designed to protect and enshrine mediocrity. Which it does magnificently.
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