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Do people deserve to have a pension?
People deserve to receive the benefits that were part of their contractual agreement. Perhaps you took a different Contract Law class than I did, but I don't recall any part of Contract Law stating that a contract could be legally violated because one party later decided that it did not like the terms that they had earlier agreed to.
And you posted this in response to my post because?
But I'll throw out an answer anyway. If there is no more money left it is all a moot point.
My mother-in-law (MIL) is a retired elementary school teacher. She was encouraged to retire seven years ago (she was 53 at the time and could have stayed if she wanted to) and receives a lifetime pension and health insurance.
I have a hard time wrapping my head around jobs that offer lifetime anything. Of course, it would be WONDERFUL if all jobs offered some level of lifetime security, but it just isn't realistic anymore. I am a social worker (have my Master's Degree) and was responsible for the lives of hundreds of older adults (gerontology was my speciality) both in NYC and in NJ. I worked all the time and never could go home until clients were safe and sound. I was also lucky to get 2-3 weeks off a year.
My MIL says that she deserves her pension and health insurance because she had to deal with 30 kids at once everyday and that she worked all the time. Every job has its responsibilties, time requirements, etc.
So, my question is why do some jobs deserve pensions and others don't? As a social worker, I'm not protected and guaranteed health insurance and a pension. The average joe working an average job doesn't get protection either....why do school teachers get such protection?
I want this to be a healthy debate and no trolling or crazy talk. I try to stay away from politics in my personal life so I'm using this forum to debate!
i don't know if that's why she deserves her pension. but i'd say she deserves it because it was part of her compensation, and she earned it. that's all. we live in a different time know where pensions aren't as common, but they still exist.
I don't think anyone that is already retired should have any of their lifetime benefits or pension taken away or reduced.
However, no one deserves lifetime anything on the taxpayer's dime. No one deserves free anything (i.e. health benefits) on the taxpayer's dime. We need reform. Actually, we needed reform a long time ago. Teachers are no longer paid a salary that is far lower than everyone else, justifying the free benefits and benefits for life deal.
And the notion that if teachers were paid per student...if they were paid even just $3 an hour per student, they'd really be making $150,000 a year or something...is the most foolish b.s. I have ever heard. Teachers are managers of sorts. Managers manage groups. That is the job description of a manager. You don't get paid per head. If a teacher should get paid per each of the 30 students in his/her class, then the principal should get paid per each of the 500 students in his/her school? It's a cutesy idea, but let's get real.
The other defense of teacher benefits that makes me roll my eyes is the "Teaching is noble" or the "Teachers are heroes" defense. I don't want to hear a sanctimonious explanation that sounds like a Mariah Carey or Whitney Houston song about heroes having the strength to carry on and teaching the children or our future to lead the way.
Do people deserve to have a pension?
People deserve to receive the benefits that were part of their contractual agreement. Perhaps you took a different Contract Law class than I did, but I don't recall any part of Contract Law stating that a contract could be legally violated because one party later decided that it did not like the terms that they had earlier agreed to.
The question is really the wrong one to begin with.
The question we should ask is not whether the pension beneficiaries are at fault for wanting the state to make good on its promises.
The question we should ask is, should the state make expensive promises without funding them, and for that matter, without being honest to their constituents about how much those promises cost ?
The minimum age for "early retirement" is 55.
Now we have to question the validity of the rest of your post!
Not necessarily. From time to time pension systems have offered retirement incentive packages. Usually you get a month for each year of service up to a certain limit, and you can retire earlier than usual but take a penalty for each year underneath the normal retirement age. Perhaps the MIL was one of those.
It sounds like the OP is either jealous,dislikes teachers or wants to be left out of the will of her MIL. Or she choose the wrong career. Last time I checked a state social worker is also eligible to collect a pension. So I'll flip the post around, why should social workers be eligible to collect a pension and social security? I'm jealous. LMAO
What is this thing called deserve a pension? It is very relative. Of course recipients will say they deserve a pension anymore than a person who say they deserve their bonus or deserve their vacation time.
What do you want her to relinquish her pension? It was part of her contract many years ago and thus she planned her retirement around that pension.
Now I believe that pension are things of the past and no longer sustainable. No wonder states are going broke paying for workers that work and those that no longer work. The government make promises they can't keep and use the pension fund as a piggy bank for their vanity projects.
Private industry was smart. Give workers 401(k) with a matching contribution so they don't have to worry about workers once they retire but yet helped to get their workers to their retirement during their employment.
Well, SHE deserves it because that was the deal she signed up for. When benefits packages are reformed teachers will decide whether or not it's a job worth doing.
In the corporate world, benefits are a bonus. They can promise them when you are hired and take them back at any time unless you have a specific contract, which is usually for the people who are officers of the company. They can change their pension, as many large companies have done in recent years, from a traditional pension to a 401K type. They don't HAVE to give you anything. They can give you health benefits and increase your contribution any time. They can promise you health benefits for your retirement and cancel them or raise your contribution as much as they want. No one is guaranteed anything anymore, and most people find it offensive that they have to pay for cadillac benefits for teachers and they have no pension and high health insurance costs.
I have two friends in NJ, retired school teachers, who paid NOTHING towards their health benefits for themselves or their spouses. They complained when the co-pay went up $5.
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