Union County-based AA family looking for a way out of NJ entirely (Westfield: homes, live in)

[Shoshanarose]

Originally Posted by rekaten

Ahh, I see! My family is the opposite - we prefer Westfield's beauty (and school district) to Harrison's gritty look.

.

Both of our towns were pretty, the second/snobbier one perhaps more so objectively.
The school system was better in the second town (much).

But that's it.
My sister and I much prefer everything else in the first town (people, feeling of community, layout/much more community-oriented even in how the town was laid out, lack of snobbiness, multigenerational families who lived there and stayed there,people looked out for each other and other people's kids, social atmosphere, etc.)

My parents also had many many more friends in the first town (likely because they are not stuck-up snobs like most people in the second town), but they have deluded themselves into being happy living in the second town (haha), and plan to stay.

They pooh-pooh our complaints about how snobby and elitist everyone is in the second town and protest, "What are you talking about? It's a great town!" (SMH/)

[rekaten]

Originally Posted by Shoshanarose

Both of our towns were pretty, the second/snobbier one perhaps more so objectively.
The school system was better in the second town (much).

But that's it.
My sister and I much prefer everything else in the first town (people, feeling of community, layout/much more community-oriented even in how the town was laid out, lack of snobbiness, multigenerational families who lived there and stayed there,people looked out for each other and other people's kids, social atmosphere, etc.)

My parents also had many many more friends in the first town (likely because they are not stuck-up snobs like most people in the second town), but they have deluded themselves into being happy living in the second town (haha), and plan to stay.

They pooh-pooh our complaints about how snobby and elitist everyone is in the second town and protest, "What are you talking about? It's a great town!" (SMH/)

I don't remember very much about Harrison to be honest. It was SO long ago. But it certainly is far more diverse than where we are now - just found out that the town of Westfield is actually 88% white. Which explains the jarring lack of diversity in WHS.

About the bolded part: I kinda think the same of my dad's loyalty to NJ, and to Westfield in particular. Though we've already been here a damn long time, I could certainly understand if the decision made was to stick around until 2018, even 2020. But I would really question the Westfield/NJ loyalty if they decide to stay until, for example, 2025. Which is an eternity from now. Overall, I am very surprised that he isn't the one seeking newer, greener (on a personal level for his own sake) pastures by now. I would be bewildered if he wanted to die here. And I'm still not sure if the quality of the public schools, on their own merit, are worth the possibility of my family continuing to go through hell for four more years.

We just need to have a family discussion at some point in the not-too-distant future. Everyone airing out their concerns in a calm, respectful/respectable manner.

[theS5]

Originally Posted by southbound_295

ROFLMAO! You're worried about keeping up with the Joneses? It's alive & well in real life NC. Most of the jobs are in or near the 3 biggest metros which are crawling with refugees from North Jersey, NYC, & Long Island.

The UNC system is large & all schools are not created equal. UNC Chapel Hill is to the UNC system as Rutgers New Brunswick is in NJ.

Except people actually want to attend UNC-CH.

[rekaten]

Originally Posted by theS5

Except people actually want to attend UNC-CH.

Yup. In-staters AND out-of-staters. Same goes for my own school, which is at least equal to Rutgers.

[Docendo discimus]

You have a really skewed perspective, which is completely understandable, as well as to be expected, seeing as how you are someone who has only just completed his freshman year in college (so...somewhere's about 19 years-old?).

You need a reality check in several different places.

Originally Posted by rekaten

NC girls, from my experience, are sweeter, classier, and even a slight bit better-looking.

Originally Posted by rekaten

But downtown gets very boring once you hit sophomore high school - all the annoying and dumb middle schoolers take over

Originally Posted by rekaten

Especially, meet the HS-age kids - they REALLY embody the typical (note that I didn't say stereotypical) Westfielder attitude.

Originally Posted by rekaten

I wasn't very athletic.

...I was given a lot of heat for being an individual and not being afraid to speak my mind. A LOT of heat.

Originally Posted by rekaten

I got along with many people. But even then, some of those with whom I got along were still fairly snobby. Why the hell would I be jealous of people I hated since middle school when they started treating me awfully?

Originally Posted by rekaten

The people that gave me a hard time never made fun of my family's financial situation, as I wasn't even allowed to speak about it at the time. People made fun of me for stupid stuff I said when I was 13 or 14 or 15 or even 16 years old and a lot of people had preconceived notions about and biases against me based on scuttlebutt that people would love to pass around.

Originally Posted by rekaten

Having had lots of feuds throughout middle and high school for going against the grain (really, my skin color already made it easy to do so), I began struggling with social anxiety. I never really fit in here at all.

Originally Posted by rekaten

I was bullied, spat on (figuratively) and disrespected. Then was crapped on even further for venting my frustrations about how I was disrespected.

All of the above speak to your lack of maturity and experience (again, completely understandable and to be expected, considering your age).

You are still stuck on things that happened even in MIDDLE SCHOOL. Middle school and high school kids can be jerkholes? TALE AS OLD AS TIME. Guess what? Middle school kids are jerks all day, errryday, all across the nation and the entire planet Earth. Westfield, Fairfield, Short Hills, Cherry Hill, Irvington, Livingston, Maplewood, Wildwood, River Edge, Toms River, NJ, NY, NC, VA, CA, TX, KS, Canada, China, Egypt, Russia. I'm willing to bet that Jesus H. Christ hisself was an insufferable brat during the middle school years, I don't care what the Bible says.

The recurring them in your posts is the supposed "snobbery" and "elitism" of your peers, yet in your own words, no one ever gave you a hard time over your family's financial situation. They were giving you a hard time because, what it boils down to, is that you simply were not popular. That's not a shot against you...it is just a reality that high school is a snake pit, in any town, in any state, in any era of history. Even Laura Ingalls had to deal with that shady b_tch Nelly Olsen way back on the prairie.

You were not very athletic, you "went against the grain", you were "outspoken", you said "stupid stuff" (your words) when you were 13, 14, 15, and 16 years-old, you didn't fit in, you began struggling with social anxiety. WELCOME TO THE HIGH SCHOOL EXPERIENCE FOR THE MAJORITY OF PEOPLE. Congratulations! You sound like the hero in a John Hughes flick. The growing pains will make you that much more interesting (once you're past the insufferable, navel-gazing college years). Whether Westfield, or any other town in NJ, or any town in NoVA, MD, or NC, your coming-of-age story would have been the same. Outspoken, "against-the-grain" rebels everywhere had the same high school experience. To make blanket statements about the alleged "elitism" and "snobbery" of Westfield AND NJ, based on your limited and narrow experience, is LOL-able, but again, to be expected, given your age.

Take it from me...someone who was LITERALLY (not just figuratively) spat on in high school. You think teenage boys are bad, LOL.

Originally Posted by rekaten

But the comments about segregation, not fitting in, and the stuck-up atmosphere created by many of the residents? 100% factual.

Not quite. That's your OPINION and personal perspective, to date, formed through the skewed prism of your ADOLESCENT experience. No one's opinion, by definition, is factual, and it certainly is not 100% factual.

Every high school senior can't wait to leave town, and drive off into the sunset, to better pastures, to more sophisticated cities, to bigger towns, or to smaller quaint towns...pastoral paradises where they can follow their academic pursuits in scenic ivory towers. For as much as you are gushing about NC, I guarantee there are kids in NC with their own laundry list of grievances, who can't wait to leave for Boston or Los Angeles. And there are kids in NYC who can't wait to go to Seattle or to Louisiana. And kids in San Francisco who can't wait to go to Vermont.

As far as your allegations about the racism and the segregation? According to you, your father doesn't have a problem with the town, or the state, your brother is one of the popular kids in class, and your sister is on an Ivy League track to medical school. If you, personally, had a hard time at Westfield High, it sounds like it had little to do race or SE standing.

Originally Posted by rekaten

What the hell would staying in Westfield for another FOUR years do for us? Can you name ONE potential benefit of that plan besides my siblings graduating high school?

The rest of your siblings' future high school experience is actually a pretty HUGE deal, and a pretty huge reason for staying in Westfield. NOT because NC schools are bad, but because these are crucial, formative, and stressful years for your siblings, as it is. You brother is just heading into freshman year. Your sister is right smack dab in the middle of her high school years. To pull them out now, and stick them in a completely new environment would be pretty awful. No kid wants to start over in a new school, particularly not going into freshman year, and not when they are closing in on the end of their high school careers.

You said yourself that your parents both "fought tooth & nail" to keep you all in the Westfield school system. Doesn't seem to make much sense to me to pull them out now, or a year from now.

But this is really all a moot point, because the decision is going to be made by your parents, and we can't take as fact your 2nd hand accounts of their financial situation, or their emotions about the situation.

Kids never have 100% of the situation, as far as their parents' affairs are concerned.

Originally Posted by rekaten

Like you, a lot of my own happiness depends on the atmosphere of the town and the mannerisms of those who reside in it. So though I also had a good amount of friends in HS, it doesn't compare to my genuine happiness in college. I would not go back to my HS days if you asked me to.

EVERY college kid says that. It's not unique to you, or to Westfield, or to NJ.

Originally Posted by rekaten

I would also not live in Westfield ever again if you quadrupled my salary, gave my family a free house, and gave me a million dollar relocation bonus. I mean that.

Am I grateful for the excellent education I received during my time here? Of course. Do I love and cherish the friends I did make while here? Absolutely. Would I return to raise my own children? Not in a million years.

Uh huh. Lots of college kids say the same thing about their high schools and home towns. I said the same. Now I'm back in the vicinity. A whole bunch of my friends said the same. A couple of them are overgrown hipsters raising their kids in Brooklyn, a couple are living exotic expat lives outside the country. But a lot of them, after popping out 2.3 kids each, are now back in the same damn town, making #soblessed posts on Facebook about how they are back in the halls of our old schools, now with their own kids.

Report back in 10-15 years when you and your trophy wife are shopping around for the perfect town (with great schools and charming downtown). Even if you don't move back to NJ, I am guessing that you will be looking for a similar affluent town in NC or any number of places down South, which have all the same Keeping Up with the Jones's aspects.

Originally Posted by rekaten

P.S. to all reading this thread...one (NOT the only) of the main reasons I am pushing for an NC move to happen within the next year is so I can get in-state tuition next year. We had to take out quite a decent amount of loans my first year, and it looks like more of the same for this coming year. My parents saved a college fund for me when my dad was doing well in his career, but it apparently isn't as large as I initially believed. At least once a day, I worry about how my parents are gonna pay for my college tuition given the (financial state) we are currently in.

As spoiled and as entitled as my brother and I grew up in a town with an even bigger reputation for being spoiled and entitled than Westfield, neither my mother nor my father paid one dime towards our college tuitions. We certainly didn't get handed a college fund at high school graduation.

Now who's got a silver spoon in their entitled mouth?

What we couldn't get in grants and scholarships, we each had to take out in loans to cover. My brother was considering enlisting at some point.

Your parents are not obligated to cover any of your college costs. Frankly, your UNC tuition shouldn't factor into their decision at all. If they do factor it into their decision, god bless them, and you should be grateful for your own life of entitlement. So I don't see where you get off, talking trash about your fellow entitled Westfield peers.

Originally Posted by rekaten

Oh, and fun fact: the person I detested the most was actually a fellow AA boy whose family could never hope to equal mine in terms of financial status but still walked around as if he were the king of the world.

The bolded part is quite ironic, considering all your complaining about snobbery and elitism. Part of the reason you're looking down your nose at this kid is because his family could never hope to equal your family in terms of financial status. I have no doubt this kid was a jerk. Isn't that reason enough to detest someone? Yet you are comparing your families' financial statuses. Interesting.

Originally Posted by rekaten

And the fact that they take which sports team you support way too damn seriously (I get CONSTANT grief for switching NFL teams when the new team was the one that actually got me into football).

You know in the South, football is religion, right? You think sports nuts take football seriously up here? I'm pretty sure they'd laugh at you about that down South.

Originally Posted by rekaten

Go on NJ.com and read comment sections. People leave for the same reasons I did - people are harsh here. Jersey has this "in your face" style, this "I got mine and eff you" anger that is so unreasonably brash and disgustingly insufferable. Less people would mind living here if people, as a COLLECTIVE WHOLE, were actually friendly and kind to strangers in the street. But no, not Jersey.

Word of advice: Do yourself a favor and don't use the NJ.com comments section (or the comments section of any other local news site that uses Advance Publishing as their digital platform) as evidence of anything. You are only undermining your own argument.





Lastly, it is summer. You are a young man. Get off the internet. Go out and enjoy life.

[rekaten]

@Docendo: not gonna reply to everything because there's no point. But I will say that I know people who moved out-of-state, even out-of-COUNTRY, in the middle of high school. They all adjusted fine. People get over it. My siblings would have to live with it, and I think they'd manage fine. They're resilient kids.

No one ever gave me a hard time over my family's financial situation. No one even knew anything was happening.

You clearly have a difficult time reading. I'm not stuck on things that happened in middle school, I couldn't care less quite frankly. It's others who always reminded me of those awful times.

Actually choose to support both football teams (though I prefer one over the other) but I'm still considered "wrong" for it. Those in NC, on the other hand, totally welcome me being a fan of two teams.

Funny how you so cleverly nitpick and choose what to bold and twist my words so you can try to make me sound like a jackass. Smh.

[rekaten]

Okay, a counter-argument to consider. Many of you say that it would make more sense to wait for both my siblings to finish high school. However, don't you think it would be strange from their perspective to come back "home" to an unfamiliar area where they have no friends? In that case, it would be better to move them both during high school so they could at least get to know some people in the new area.

[Gerania]

Originally Posted by rekaten

Okay, a counter-argument to consider. Many of you say that it would make more sense to wait for both my siblings to finish high school. However, don't you think it would be strange from their perspective to come back "home" to an unfamiliar area where they have no friends? In that case, it would be better to move them both during high school so they could at least get to know some people in the new area.

No, not in high school. It's the worst possible time to be forced to move.

[SageCats]

I think it's a good idea. Tell your dad about the benefits of retirement and paying less in taxes. Find a job where you want to live after college, do well for yourself, and that might convince him.
Good luck with your future endeavors. You sound like a smart person!

[rekaten]

@Gerania: well, I know people who moved in the middle of high school. Some even moved to a different country. They all got through it pretty well and actually ended up enjoying their new surroundings. I realize that it's a difficult time to move, but waiting until 2020 means that my sister and brother would be heading into their junior and freshman years of college, respectively. I don't see a great benefit to the prospect of them returning home for winter break to find an unfamiliar place where they know not a single soul. In this case, it's better for them to get experience with living in a new city or state where they would be making connections. Besides, moving in 2017 would mean that my sister would only spend a year in the new school, which really wouldn't impact her very much, if at all. It's not as horrible as you all make it sound lol.

@SageCats: Thanks, that's one of the few compliments I've managed to receive throughout the duration of this thread. I appreciate it!

Summer class ends next week. I think it might be best to hold off any talks until then, really.