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Most of southern/central NH is fairly accessible to Boston (45-90 min drive, or less during non-commuting hours, depending on where you're coming from). Considering that your whole argument for why NJ is special is that it has "access" to a major city, that seems a poor comparison to make. NH also has several nice small/medium-sized cities like Manchester and Portsmouth, all of which draw day-trippers from throughout the region. And it has some of the most beautiful natural areas in the country, not to mention the best ski areas in the northeast, so there is definitely plenty to do there....
Vermont doesn't have any real viable cities outside of Burlington, though it has plenty of quaint downtowns and great scenery. A lot of the state is within relatively easy driving distance of Montreal (and even Boston or NYC), so again I question your argument there.
Yes but NJ is within easy day trip driving distance of both NYC and Philly so if you're going to rationalize other states that lack major cities, why not apply the same to NJ/why bring up NJ's lack in the first place? NH has skiing, NJ has beaches (I know NH does too but its coastline is tiny, while NJ also has mountains and skiing but not like NH). VT has quaint downtowns, so does NJ. I think VT as a whole is prettier than NJ but NJ does not lack in pretty/scenic areas. NJ really isn't much different than other places; what it lacks it makes up for in other things that other states lack or aren't that known for.
Yes but NJ is within easy day trip driving distance of both NYC and Philly so if you're going to rationalize other states that lack major cities, why not apply the same to NJ/why bring up NJ's lack in the first place? NH has skiing, NJ has beaches (I know NH does too but its coastline is tiny, while NJ also has mountains and skiing but not like NH). VT has quaint downtowns, so does NJ. I think VT as a whole is prettier than NJ but NJ does not lack in pretty/scenic areas. NJ really isn't much different than other places; what it lacks it makes up for in other things that other states lack or aren't that known for.
Seems to just be an irrational NJ hater. Saying even the most southern part of Vermont is not too bad a drive away from NYC and not giving credit to NJ for the same thing is completely laughable. The most southern part of NJ, Cape May, is still 50 minutes closer to NYC. The furthest drive in NJ is considerably shorter than the shortest drive in VT. Hell, BALTIMORE to NYC, three states away, is closer than the closest drive from VT. This logic goeagles77 is using us completely ludicrous.
Yes but NJ is within easy day trip driving distance of both NYC and Philly so if you're going to rationalize other states that lack major cities, why not apply the same to NJ/why bring up NJ's lack in the first place? NH has skiing, NJ has beaches (I know NH does too but its coastline is tiny, while NJ also has mountains and skiing but not like NH). VT has quaint downtowns, so does NJ. I think VT as a whole is prettier than NJ but NJ does not lack in pretty/scenic areas. NJ really isn't much different than other places; what it lacks it makes up for in other things that other states lack or aren't that known for.
This is true. People complain about traffic but fact remains a good portion of NJ's population is within an hour drive of NYC. I live in a borough of NYC and it takes me almost an hour to get to the city, so really what is the difference culturally? Nothing.
Yes but NJ is within easy day trip driving distance of both NYC and Philly so if you're going to rationalize other states that lack major cities, why not apply the same to NJ/why bring up NJ's lack in the first place? NH has skiing, NJ has beaches (I know NH does too but its coastline is tiny, while NJ also has mountains and skiing but not like NH). VT has quaint downtowns, so does NJ. I think VT as a whole is prettier than NJ but NJ does not lack in pretty/scenic areas. NJ really isn't much different than other places; what it lacks it makes up for in other things that other states lack or aren't that known for.
For what it's worth I was specifically replying to this irrational post in my above comments. The guy referenced NH and VT as two states that don't have viable cities (which is patently false, at least for NH) and I was making the point that his same logic about NJ being within driving distance can apply to each. Southern NH is much closer to Boston than most of South Jersey is to Philly (or NYC).
Originally Posted by Leps12 View Post
It seems silly to complain about NJ having a lack of major cities when we have two across the river from us and a dozen or so small to medium sized ones within our borders, some of which are obviously on the upswing. To those who complain, just think about it...you could live in Kansas, Nebraska, the Dakotas, Montana, Idaho, Wyoming, etc. Then you might have a right to complain about a lack of viable cities. Hell, try most of the Deep South, West Virginia, New Hampshire, or Vermont as well.
Seems to just be an irrational NJ hater. Saying even the most southern part of Vermont is not too bad a drive away from NYC and not giving credit to NJ for the same thing is completely laughable. The most southern part of NJ, Cape May, is still 50 minutes closer to NYC. The furthest drive in NJ is considerably shorter than the shortest drive in VT. Hell, BALTIMORE to NYC, three states away, is closer than the closest drive from VT. This logic goeagles77 is using us completely ludicrous.
Did you even read my post? I said a good chunk of VT was within easy driving distance to Montreal, which is a world-class city. Obviously referring to the northwest part of the state, near Burlington. VT is also accessible to Boston and NYC (obviously further afield), just as NJ is to Baltimore, Boston, and Washington.
OK, I'll bite. I moved to the Research Triangle area of North Carolina last year after spending my entire life in New Jersey. I'm not going to say the entire state is better than New Jersey; the legislature is full of wingnut yahoos (HB2, anyone?) and there's the Triangle, Asheville, and Out Where They Marry Their Sisters. That said, I do have to say that at least for me, NC has been a much better place to live so far. Yes, housing is somewhat cheaper. You can get a NICE rental apartment for $1000/month or a decent 1500 square foot house in a good neighborhood for the low to mid $200Ks. My property taxes on a 1900 square foot house are under $3500, and my area is high for where I am. There are parts of the area where they would be less than $2000/year. On the other hand, we have a 2% sales tax on groceries in addition to a 7.5% sales tax on everything else, and an annual property tax on cars, which for my 2015 econobox is about $180. Car insurance is a bit less expensive (about $300/year less), my utilities are MUCH less (though Duke Energy is a pretty lousy enviornmental citizen). Groceries, especially produce, are more expensive here. Restaurant prices are, aside from the BBQ joints, pretty comparable to their NJ counterparts.
Yes, the bagels are Brueggers and pizza is questionable, and there is no such thing as "New York style deli" here (not that there are so many in NJ either) but other than that, there is every kind of food you can imagine here.
I found living in NJ that NYC sucked up much of the cultural life of the area. Yes, there are concerts and museums and such in NJ but the major museums and shows are in the city. Here, I can drive with no traffic to Raleigh to see Patton Oswalt, or in September to see Green Day. I can do a concert and dinner for well less than $100. There is tons of free live music everywhere (everything from Afropop to bluegrass to blues to folk to bar bands), lectures, art exhibits, drum circles -- anything you might want to do.
The biggest difference is with the people. Now I am a bleeding heart liberal, and this is like Old Hippie Heaven. But more than that, people here are highly educated (as befits an area with two major universities) and they just seem HAPPIER here. I think that the slower pace, somewhat less congestion, and less focus on appearances and prestige compared to Bergen County where I used to live, agrees with people. Here I don't have to spend thousands of dollars on turning my yard into a perfect green carpet. I go to stores and businesses and people smile and say hello. These little kindnesses may be superficial, but they do make for better quality of life.
I lived in northern NJ for 57 years. But the increasingly relentless atmosphere of anger became toxic.
That's exactly right. Isn't it nice to be able to see a show, have dinner, go see live music, or go to a museum without paying $15 to cross a bridge, $10 in tolls, and $65 to park a car? When you don't have to cross rivers on rusted out bridges from 1920? It must also be nice also to pass viable businesses, well-kept homes and manicured roadways on the way to an event. And I guess its nice to not be surrounded by toxic, mean-spirited people. But hey, at least we have our cities here in NJ, which some seem to be raving about.
That's exactly right. Isn't it nice to be able to see a show, have dinner, go see live music, or go to a museum without paying $15 to cross a bridge, $10 in tolls, and $65 to park a car? When you don't have to cross rivers on rusted out bridges from 1920? It must also be nice also to pass viable businesses, well-kept homes and manicured roadways on the way to an event. And I guess its nice to not be surrounded by toxic, mean-spirited people. But hey, at least we have our cities here in NJ, which some seem to be raving about.
lol Who actually drives into the city for those things? Amateur. Nothing else you say is relevant if you don't even know how to work the train systems here and in the city, smh. And you say WE know little about NJ. Laughable.
I can get into the city by train for $10 using NJT and PATH which can take me to the WTC area or anywhere on the line from Christopher Street to 33rd then swipe a metro card once to get me literally anywhere else.
What I can do in NYC is guaranteed leagues better than what one can do in some subpar city in NC.
Last edited by JerseyGirl415; 01-18-2017 at 09:51 PM..
This is just my opinion, but NYC for the win. Boston is not NYC. Montreal is not NYC. No other American city is NYC, though I wouldn't mind living in Los Angeles either. I would compare London or Paris to NYC, but not Philadelphia or any of those other cities. I don't feel a need to have a great city in NJ with NYC just a half hour away.
Plus, we have the beaches as well as skiing in VT just a short 3.5 hour drive away. Though I do like skiing in Northern VT better because it has bigger mountains, but even those are just a 5 or 6 hour drive.
This is just my opinion, but NYC for the win. Boston is not NYC. Montreal is not NYC. No other American city is NYC, though I wouldn't mind living in Los Angeles either. I would compare London or Paris to NYC, but not Philadelphia or any of those other cities. I don't feel a need to have a great city in NJ with NYC just a half hour away.
Plus, we have the beaches as well as skiing in VT just a short 3.5 hour drive away. Though I do like skiing in Northern VT better because it has bigger mountains, but even those are just a 5 or 6 hour drive.
You must be a real estate agent or know nothing about NJ. Stop talking plz.
It's a damn shame what has become of our state's cities, especially considering how many of them have prime locations. Camden is a riverfront city across from Philadelphia, Newark is a port city with easy access to our nation's largest metropolis and Atlantic City has a beach for crying out loud.
I acknowledge Newark has been making strides but it still far from a safe or prosperous city. Sure, Jersey City waterfront or Hoboken are nice if you are in the minority who can afford that.
NJ has a lot of positive attributes (generally solid public schools, cultural diversity, beautiful beaches etc.) but if we are being honest with ourselves are cities for the most part are dumps.
Insightful post, most if not all states have public schools that are solid, depending on the area. NJ also has 31 failing "Abbott" school districts that 60% of our taxes go to pay for.
JC waterfront is fine but go a mile inland.
Its surprising to me as well how bad our cities are, based on their location. Atlantic City could have competed with Las Vegas, which is a city in the literal middle of a desert. AC has an ocean. Its mind boggling. From the gas tax, to the $300 million renovation, to $12,000/yr taxes, to the disaster that is Atlantic City, corruption is rampant in this state.
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