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Old 09-09-2010, 07:19 AM
 
572 posts, read 2,022,278 times
Reputation: 341

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Wurlivox - I completely understand that teachers might feel misled about the beeftis that they had been receiving.

That being said, there is no other occupation in the world where everything is included at no cost to the employee. Forgive me for saying this but I have been in the corporate world since I was 21 years old, and every week have been paying into my helath insurance, vision insurance, dental as well as contributing 10% into a 401K for my future, all while teachers were being given these things.

The trainees at my company (a fortune 500 company) receive an annual salary of $48,000 for 12 months of work while most entry level teahcers are receiving at or near that salary for 9 months of work. Yes you have to put in some work at night, but I can assure you, you are not the only occupation putting in some overtime without getting compensated. Anyone who is a salaried employee does not get sompensated for overtime, and there are plenty of days where I work from 8am to 6 or 7 pm.

Getting all the benefits was fine when the economy was not in a downward spiral, but things evolve with time, and the economy is in a very different place right now. I have a lot of friends who are teachers who were complaining about not getting their contracts picked up or about their co-workers whose contracts did not get picked up due to the budget cuts, but the fact of the matter is that if the NJEA and the teachers (most of whom were already tenured) agreed to contribute a small portion of their salary to their own benefits most of those jobs could have been saved. Even at 5% of a $48,000 salary you are talking a measley $46. That is still significantly less then what I am paying for medical, dental and vision a week.

I know I am going to get a lot of flack for saying this, but suck it up, stop complaining and start contributing to your own future.
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Old 09-09-2010, 12:32 PM
 
16,825 posts, read 17,736,880 times
Reputation: 20852
Quote:
Originally Posted by nativetoNJ View Post
I've looked through some of the other posts on this topic, but they all seem to circle my very specific question.

I'm coming out of Rutgers with an Ed.M in English Education. What would be a good salary to negotiate for in an urban/Abbott district in my first year teaching?

In general, what's a good salary for a Masters degree in the first year teaching around NJ?
LOL!

Negotiate? With an English degree and a masters in education?

You can expect first step on the scale and a column over for the masters. Thats it.

If you are not science with a grad degree in your field (not education) then there is not even a chance of moving up steps.

In this economic climate and surplus of English teachers its the norm.
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Old 09-09-2010, 12:45 PM
 
16,825 posts, read 17,736,880 times
Reputation: 20852
Quote:
Originally Posted by JCK7778 View Post
Wurlivox - I completely understand that teachers might feel misled about the beeftis that they had been receiving.

That being said, there is no other occupation in the world where everything is included at no cost to the employee. Forgive me for saying this but I have been in the corporate world since I was 21 years old, and every week have been paying into my helath insurance, vision insurance, dental as well as contributing 10% into a 401K for my future, all while teachers were being given these things.

The trainees at my company (a fortune 500 company) receive an annual salary of $48,000 for 12 months of work while most entry level teahcers are receiving at or near that salary for 9 months of work. Yes you have to put in some work at night, but I can assure you, you are not the only occupation putting in some overtime without getting compensated. Anyone who is a salaried employee does not get sompensated for overtime, and there are plenty of days where I work from 8am to 6 or 7 pm.

Getting all the benefits was fine when the economy was not in a downward spiral, but things evolve with time, and the economy is in a very different place right now. I have a lot of friends who are teachers who were complaining about not getting their contracts picked up or about their co-workers whose contracts did not get picked up due to the budget cuts, but the fact of the matter is that if the NJEA and the teachers (most of whom were already tenured) agreed to contribute a small portion of their salary to their own benefits most of those jobs could have been saved. Even at 5% of a $48,000 salary you are talking a measley $46. That is still significantly less then what I am paying for medical, dental and vision a week.

I know I am going to get a lot of flack for saying this, but suck it up, stop complaining and start contributing to your own future.
I teach in a top district in Monmouth Co. We do not get vision at all. Our dental in minimal. Our medical coverage is far from the "cadillac" it is purported to be and we already pay 1.5% towards it and that is going up (granted less than our equivalent in private industry pay) but we also get significantly less money than our counterparts in level of education in private industry.

I have been teaching for nearly 10 years with a masters degree in science (NOT education) and I just broke $50k this year.

Am I underpaid. No. But am I overpaid. Absolutely not.
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Old 09-09-2010, 01:00 PM
 
572 posts, read 2,022,278 times
Reputation: 341
I never said you were overpaid, just that teahcers might need to come to grips with the fact the the general popoulation have to pay for their benefits and that they are part of the general population, as well as remember that your salaries are for 3/4 of a year, not a full year.

You should be happy that you have a job and the option for benefits as there are a lot of people who would kill for $48,000 a year and the ability to contribute only 1.5% of that for benefits. I think in this debate the teachers as well as the NJEA are making themselves look terribly short sighted and a bit selfish. IMO.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lkb0714 View Post
I teach in a top district in Monmouth Co. We do not get vision at all. Our dental in minimal. Our medical coverage is far from the "cadillac" it is purported to be and we already pay 1.5% towards it and that is going up (granted less than our equivalent in private industry pay) but we also get significantly less money than our counterparts in level of education in private industry.

I have been teaching for nearly 10 years with a masters degree in science (NOT education) and I just broke $50k this year.

Am I underpaid. No. But am I overpaid. Absolutely not.
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Old 09-09-2010, 01:11 PM
 
16,825 posts, read 17,736,880 times
Reputation: 20852
Quote:
Originally Posted by JCK7778 View Post
I never said you were overpaid, just that teahcers might need to come to grips with the fact the the general popoulation have to pay for their benefits and that they are part of the general population, as well as remember that your salaries are for 3/4 of a year, not a full year.

You should be happy that you have a job and the option for benefits as there are a lot of people who would kill for $48,000 a year and the ability to contribute only 1.5% of that for benefits. I think in this debate the teachers as well as the NJEA are making themselves look terribly short sighted and a bit selfish. IMO.
Since you are saying that we should be paying MORE for our benefits that is a REAL pay cut. Also I am not sure where you got $46 since it would be another $60 a week on top of the $60 I already pay since I ALREADY pay 1.5% (as many teachers do).

And we trade more salary for more benefits. Fine but now you want us to take less salary and less benefits than our private industry counterparts.
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Old 09-09-2010, 01:22 PM
 
Location: NJ
12,283 posts, read 35,694,578 times
Reputation: 5331
Quote:
Originally Posted by JCK7778 View Post
Wurlivox - I completely understand that teachers might feel misled about the beeftis that they had been receiving.

That being said, there is no other occupation in the world where everything is included at no cost to the employee. Forgive me for saying this but I have been in the corporate world since I was 21 years old, and every week have been paying into my helath insurance, vision insurance, dental as well as contributing 10% into a 401K for my future, all while teachers were being given these things.
The trainees at my company (a fortune 500 company) receive an annual salary of $48,000 for 12 months of work while most entry level teahcers are receiving at or near that salary for 9 months of work. Yes you have to put in some work at night, but I can assure you, you are not the only occupation putting in some overtime without getting compensated. Anyone who is a salaried employee does not get sompensated for overtime, and there are plenty of days where I work from 8am to 6 or 7 pm.

Getting all the benefits was fine when the economy was not in a downward spiral, but things evolve with time, and the economy is in a very different place right now. I have a lot of friends who are teachers who were complaining about not getting their contracts picked up or about their co-workers whose contracts did not get picked up due to the budget cuts, but the fact of the matter is that if the NJEA and the teachers (most of whom were already tenured) agreed to contribute a small portion of their salary to their own benefits most of those jobs could have been saved. Even at 5% of a $48,000 salary you are talking a measley $46. That is still significantly less then what I am paying for medical, dental and vision a week.

I know I am going to get a lot of flack for saying this, but suck it up, stop complaining and start contributing to your own future.
I've been in the corporate world since I was 21 and have NEVER, and I repeat NEVER, paid for my benefits. There was a brief time where I didn't have any, but the remaining time? Nope. Vision, Dental, Medical, Legal - no $$$ out of my paycheck.

And where you get the notion that teachers get a "free" 401K? (or 403B)? Teachers can contribute to a 403B like everyone else..WITHOUT MATCHING CONTRIBUTIONS which a lot of private sector companies provide.
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Old 09-09-2010, 01:33 PM
 
4,156 posts, read 4,176,092 times
Reputation: 2076
Quote:
Originally Posted by lkb0714 View Post
Since you are saying that we should be paying MORE for our benefits that is a REAL pay cut. Also I am not sure where you got $46 since it would be another $60 a week on top of the $60 I already pay since I ALREADY pay 1.5% (as many teachers do).

And we trade more salary for more benefits. Fine but now you want us to take less salary and less benefits than our private industry counterparts.
I perfectly agreed with you that teacher is one of the under paying profession in this country. But with average of 8k property tax per house and 70% of it goes to the dept of education, don't you think it's little too much? That's almost $6k per family on top of income tax. Don't you think we need reform in the school system?
Why do we even need a superintendent every town that make almost 200k a year? And these guys are off limits to citizens that they are suppose to support.
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Old 09-09-2010, 01:53 PM
 
572 posts, read 2,022,278 times
Reputation: 341
Quote:
Originally Posted by tahiti View Post
I've been in the corporate world since I was 21 and have NEVER, and I repeat NEVER, paid for my benefits. There was a brief time where I didn't have any, but the remaining time? Nope. Vision, Dental, Medical, Legal - no $$$ out of my paycheck.

And where you get the notion that teachers get a "free" 401K? (or 403B)? Teachers can contribute to a 403B like everyone else..WITHOUT MATCHING CONTRIBUTIONS which a lot of private sector companies provide.
I would like to know what company you work for since I have never heard of, nor worked for any company that pays 100% of the benefits, unless you have completely sub-par insurance, or unless it was negotiated for as part of your salary.

And just an FYI, I was talking about the pension that the state pays for for teachers that other private sector employees generally do not get the pleasure of having.
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Old 09-09-2010, 01:58 PM
 
Location: NJ
12,283 posts, read 35,694,578 times
Reputation: 5331
Quote:
Originally Posted by JCK7778 View Post
I would like to know what company you work for since I have never heard of, nor worked for any company that pays 100% of the benefits, unless you have completely sub-par insurance, or unless it was negotiated for as part of your salary.

And just an FYI, I was talking about the pension that the state pays for for teachers that other private sector employees generally do not get the pleasure of having.
the state of NJ does not pay 100% of teachers benefits.

the state of NJ does not pay 100% of pensions. do realize teachers PAY into the pension, don't you?

btw, I get a pension too in my private sector job!!!
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Old 09-09-2010, 02:11 PM
 
1,041 posts, read 3,013,121 times
Reputation: 775
Quote:
Originally Posted by lkb0714 View Post
I teach in a top district in Monmouth Co. We do not get vision at all. Our dental in minimal. Our medical coverage is far from the "cadillac" it is purported to be and we already pay 1.5% towards it and that is going up (granted less than our equivalent in private industry pay) but we also get significantly less money than our counterparts in level of education in private industry.

I have been teaching for nearly 10 years with a masters degree in science (NOT education) and I just broke $50k this year.

Am I underpaid. No. But am I overpaid. Absolutely not.
More whining.

Here's a question for teachers, why the sense of entitlement to make more money, and pay less benefits??

To be a teacher you need a college degree right?? College degree is the new HS diploma. Everyone has one these days. If there are 100's of applicants for every one teaching position, its obvious the job pays too much (supply and demand).

I just don't get the pedestal teachers put themselves on. You regurgitate whats in a plan or book to kids. Lets be real here, you're not theorizing another law of physics that is unknown presently, you aren't fusing an atom in class. Why do teachers so strongly believe they deserve more??? You deal with bratty kids, ok, but so do day care workers, and baby sitters. They dont make 50K.

Just because something historically seemed ok in the past, doesnt mean it should remain the status quo in the future (See Berlin Wall, Smoking cigarettes, slavery etc). Times change people.
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