Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > New Jersey
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Thread summary:

Home buyer and real estate business ethics, real estate agent did not hold up end of bargain, used another realtor, opinions if this is bad business or unethical

Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 04-18-2008, 07:32 PM
 
128 posts, read 354,283 times
Reputation: 74

Advertisements

I used Realtor A in a neighborhood other than where I live. Over a year ago, I asked them to keep an eye on a foreclosed property that I really wanted, and to let me know as soon as it was back on the market. over the past year, they did show me other properties, while i waited for the one I really wanted. Well, it finally came on the market ... but they never told me! another realtor friend of mine, who knew my interest in the property brought it to my attention. I didn't feel I should just hand over a commission to
Realtor A, especially b/c they were supposed to be watching out for that property. and they live right down the street from it. so I put in an offer through my realtor friend, since they cared enough to look out for my best interest. I never signed any contracts with Realtor A ... was it wrong not to use them to submit an offer?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 04-18-2008, 07:37 PM
 
Location: Seymour TN
2,116 posts, read 6,795,477 times
Reputation: 1461
I don't see anything wrong with what you did. It's business - they did not hold up their end of the deal. You reward the person that did.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-18-2008, 08:21 PM
 
5 posts, read 12,751 times
Reputation: 13
You did nothing wrong. There was no agreement signed so you're basically a free agent...you buy through the realtor that showed you the property. Sellers are the ones that sign agreements with the realtors and they can get stuck with a realtor they don't like and may have to wait until the agreement is up before they can move on. Glad you found something :-)
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-19-2008, 12:43 AM
 
Location: Chester, NJ (Morris County)
127 posts, read 543,093 times
Reputation: 40
Unfortunately, you may find yourself in the middle of so-called "procuring cause" litigation. Here is an example of such lawsuit:

Jerry Seinfeld owes $100,000, Manhattan judge says - Entertainment

Your realtor friend had a professional obligation to you, her client, to do a "due diligence", which includes finding out if another realtor could be involved in procuring your offer. She should have asked you if you were working with another realtor and if that realtor did any work for you regarding that property; the fact that you specifically asked "realtor A" to "watch out" that property for you makes your transaction especially vulnerable. "Realtor A" may try to block your sale by asking the judge to impose a temporary restraining order on the transaction until the matter is resolved. And while you and your realtors are trying to get out of that legal mess, someone may make another offer on the same property and buy it just because the seller wouldn't want to wait until your troubles are over.

If you want to learn more about the legal concept of "procuring cause", here is an good article:

Brokerage Law: Procuring Cause — Revisited | Real Estate Weekly | Find Articles at BNET.com

It is your agent's job to help you avoid any pitfalls on your way to owning the property you want; that includes a potential litigation. A simple contact between the broker of "realtor A" and you new agent's broker may be enough to prevent a huge problem. IMO, your attorney should be involved, too.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NJcost$$ View Post
I used Realtor A in a neighborhood other than where I live. Over a year ago, I asked them to keep an eye on a foreclosed property that I really wanted, and to let me know as soon as it was back on the market. over the past year, they did show me other properties, while i waited for the one I really wanted. Well, it finally came on the market ... but they never told me! another realtor friend of mine, who knew my interest in the property brought it to my attention. I didn't feel I should just hand over a commission to
Realtor A, especially b/c they were supposed to be watching out for that property. and they live right down the street from it. so I put in an offer through my realtor friend, since they cared enough to look out for my best interest. I never signed any contracts with Realtor A ... was it wrong not to use them to submit an offer?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-19-2008, 06:32 AM
 
Location: NYC
16,061 posts, read 26,678,433 times
Reputation: 24848
I think the Seinfeld incident is vastly different from this one. Of course I am not an Agent; but I think that is comparing Apples to Oranges.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-19-2008, 07:31 AM
 
Location: NJ
23,830 posts, read 33,355,576 times
Reputation: 30687
Quote:
Originally Posted by NJcost$$ View Post
I used Realtor A in a neighborhood other than where I live. Over a year ago, I asked them to keep an eye on a foreclosed property that I really wanted, and to let me know as soon as it was back on the market. over the past year, they did show me other properties, while i waited for the one I really wanted. Well, it finally came on the market ... but they never told me! another realtor friend of mine, who knew my interest in the property brought it to my attention. I didn't feel I should just hand over a commission to
Realtor A, especially b/c they were supposed to be watching out for that property. and they live right down the street from it. so I put in an offer through my realtor friend, since they cared enough to look out for my best interest. I never signed any contracts with Realtor A ... was it wrong not to use them to submit an offer?
Since you didn't sign anything I doubt they would have a case.

Snooze you lose and them snoozing could have cost you the house.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-19-2008, 09:38 AM
 
128 posts, read 354,283 times
Reputation: 74
Default Procuring Cause

I really don't think "procuring cause" would apply here ... according to the article that was posted "Specifically, the court set forth that a broker does not have to participate in the negotiations surrounding a transaction in order to earn a commission, so long as the broker proves that it created the atmosphere or generated the chain of circumstances in which the negotiations proceeded."

Realtor A didn't generate the chain of circumstances. He never was able to get any contact with the seller, and once it was relisted, over a year later, he never contacted me about the property ... so how could he have any claim to fees?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-19-2008, 10:39 AM
 
Location: Chester, NJ (Morris County)
127 posts, read 543,093 times
Reputation: 40
You shouldn’t worry about the “procuring cause” at all since it only affects the realtors, not you. Does it really matter to you how many realtors share the commission?

Let me explain what I meant in my previous post:

1. You are free to choose any realtor, and you should use only the realtor you are comfortable to work with. You, as a buyer, don’t owe the commission to anyone – it is paid by the seller.
2. However, the new buyer’s agent (your realtor friend and her broker) may (or may not) owe some part of their commission to the “realtor A”. It may eventually lead to a litigation that may halt the sale.
3. The litigation can be easily prevented by the new buyer’s agent – I have already explained how.

So the only thing that you, the buyer, should do is to notify your new realtor in writing (an e-mail would be enough) that another realtor was involved before. Have her respond, also in writing. That’s it. From that point, like I said before, it is your new agent’s job to do their due diligence and communicate with the previous agent. They may or may not agree to share the commission; in case if there is an unresolved conflict, they must notify you. Then, it is up to you to decide whether or not to proceed with the deal.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NJcost$$ View Post
I really don't think "procuring cause" would apply here ... according to the article that was posted "Specifically, the court set forth that a broker does not have to participate in the negotiations surrounding a transaction in order to earn a commission, so long as the broker proves that it created the atmosphere or generated the chain of circumstances in which the negotiations proceeded."

Realtor A didn't generate the chain of circumstances. He never was able to get any contact with the seller, and once it was relisted, over a year later, he never contacted me about the property ... so how could he have any claim to fees?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-19-2008, 10:43 AM
 
3,269 posts, read 9,915,812 times
Reputation: 2025
Quote:
Originally Posted by HelgaB View Post
You shouldn’t worry about the “procuring cause” at all since it only affects the realtors, not you. Does it really matter to you how many realtors share the commission?

Let me explain what I meant in my previous post:

1. You are free to choose any realtor, and you should use only the realtor you are comfortable to work with. You, as a buyer, don’t owe the commission to anyone – it is paid by the seller.
2. However, the new buyer’s agent (your realtor friend and her broker) may (or may not) owe some part of their commission to the “realtor A”. It may eventually lead to a litigation that may halt the sale.
3. The litigation can be easily prevented by the new buyer’s agent – I have already explained how.

So the only thing that you, the buyer, should do is to notify your new realtor in writing (an e-mail would be enough) that another realtor was involved before. Have her respond, also in writing. That’s it. From that point, like I said before, it is your new agent’s job to do their due diligence and communicate with the previous agent. They may or may not agree to share the commission; in case if there is an unresolved conflict, they must notify you. Then, it is up to you to decide whether or not to proceed with the deal.
What a joke this whole post is. You don't owe the old realtor anything legally or morally. If you had waited around for them to let you know the house you wanted was on the market you would have lost it. If they were doing their job properly they would have had the sale and made the bucks. As it happens they didn't do their job and therefore don't get rewarded.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-19-2008, 10:59 AM
 
Location: Chester, NJ (Morris County)
127 posts, read 543,093 times
Reputation: 40
UKOK, you are missing my point. Where did I say that the buyer had an obligation, moral or legal, before the previous realtor? Read my post again:

"The only thing that you, the buyer, should do is to notify your new realtor in writing (an e-mail would be enough) that another realtor was involved before. Have her respond, also in writing. That’s it."


I was explaining the professional obligation of the new agent; it includes obtaining all the relevant information and protecting her client from the potential litigation. I am not saying the old realtor is entitled to any part of the commission. However, the new agent should communicate with him, anyway.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:




Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > New Jersey
Similar Threads
View detailed profiles of:

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top