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Old 05-18-2020, 03:45 PM
 
8,256 posts, read 17,267,194 times
Reputation: 6220

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Quote:
Originally Posted by JERSEY MAN View Post
I guess you would be locked in the closet in florida or many other states. I was in the supermarket today with about 20 or 30 other people and only 1 person had a mask on. Most restaurants are open at 50% capacity with most of the people with no masks on. It's amazing that you want to put people in jail for not wearing a mask. Didn't Murphy and Cuomo release people from jail because of the virus.
Yup and that's why this is never going to end because Americans are selfish and ignorant and refuse to follow any guidelines that can help us get out of this mess. And it's also why I refuse to ever live in a state like Florida or anywhere else in the South for that matter. Money is more important than human lives there and it always has been since white people have lived there.
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Old 05-18-2020, 03:55 PM
 
Location: New Jersey/Florida
5,816 posts, read 12,581,649 times
Reputation: 4409
Quote:
Originally Posted by jessemh431 View Post
Yup and that's why this is never going to end because Americans are selfish and ignorant and refuse to follow any guidelines that can help us get out of this mess. And it's also why I refuse to ever live in a state like Florida or anywhere else in the South for that matter. Money is more important than human lives there and it always has been since white people have lived there.
OK,
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Old 05-18-2020, 04:07 PM
 
8,256 posts, read 17,267,194 times
Reputation: 6220
Quote:
Originally Posted by JERSEY MAN View Post
OK,
You know that even high-risk people need to grocery shop right? Old ladies go to the grocery store. She can't stay inside 24/7/365 or she'd starve to death. So if you are an asymptomatic carrier of the virus, you could kill her. I don't understand why that's not a concern to you guys. How selfish are you that you really don't care that your selfishness could kill other innocent people? It's an effing mask. Is it really that burdensome on you to do one simple thing to keep other people alive?

And I'll ask again. Should we get rid of speeding laws? You may think you're safe speeding, but you could kill an innocent person with your negligence. Similarly, you may think you don't carry the virus, but you could kill an innocent person if you infect them accidentally. Speed limits manage the flow of traffic and make the roadways safer for everyone. The guidelines for COVID manage the spread of the disease and make society safer for everyone. Do you believe you have the right to go whatever speed you want without any consequences and cause car accidents with no liability?

I'll also ask again. What's the solution for childcare of employees forced to go back to work? Do they have to risk dying and DCF taking their children? Or do they stay home and lose all income because they're ineligible for unemployment? What's the solution for people who rely on public transit? Do you think it's fine to reopen all the businesses and people crowd subways/trains/buses again with no masks and no temperature checks? And if it's really so safe to go back, why are politicians from a certain party refusing to budge on passing federal legislation that gives businesses immunity to lawsuits for virus infection?

Literally none of you have addressed any of these questions with real solutions or answers.
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Old 05-18-2020, 04:16 PM
 
Location: In an indoor space
7,685 posts, read 6,161,261 times
Reputation: 5154
Quote:
Originally Posted by jessemh431 View Post
You know that even high-risk people need to grocery shop right? Old ladies go to the grocery store. She can't stay inside 24/7/365 or she'd starve to death. So if you are an asymptomatic carrier of the virus, you could kill her. I don't understand why that's not a concern to you guys. How selfish are you that you really don't care that your selfishness could kill other innocent people? It's an effing mask. Is it really that burdensome on you to do one simple thing to keep other people alive?

And I'll ask again. Should we get rid of speeding laws? You may think you're safe speeding, but you could kill an innocent person with your negligence. Similarly, you may think you don't carry the virus, but you could kill an innocent person if you infect them accidentally. Speed limits manage the flow of traffic and make the roadways safer for everyone. The guidelines for COVID manage the spread of the disease and make society safer for everyone. Do you believe you have the right to go whatever speed you want without any consequences and cause car accidents with no liability?

I'll also ask again. What's the solution for childcare of employees forced to go back to work? Do they have to risk dying and DCF taking their children? Or do they stay home and lose all income because they're ineligible for unemployment? What's the solution for people who rely on public transit? Do you think it's fine to reopen all the businesses and people crowd subways/trains/buses again with no masks and no temperature checks? And if it's really so safe to go back, why are politicians from a certain party refusing to budge on passing federal legislation that gives businesses immunity to lawsuits for virus infection?

Literally none of you have addressed any of these questions with real solutions or answers.

If one just wakes up in the morning they risk dying.
I'm a late 50's male and possibly an at risk candidate of contracting CV and possibly dying from it, but guess what I'm not afraid but instead am VERY ANGRY just about 24/7 which has raised my cortisol, blood pressure, and blood sugar about this whole fascist tryannical fiasco!!!!
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Old 05-18-2020, 04:19 PM
 
8,256 posts, read 17,267,194 times
Reputation: 6220
Quote:
Originally Posted by atgss View Post
If one just wakes up in the morning they risk dying.
I'm a late 50's male and possibly an at risk candidate of contracting CV and possibly dying from it, but guess what I'm not afraid but instead am VERY ANGRY just about 24/7 which has raised my cortisol, blood pressure, and blood sugar about this whole fascist tryannical fiasco!!!!
Ok and you can make the decision to kill yourself. But you have no right to make the decision for someone else to die. Do you also go speeding at 100 mph just because you can and you're going to die one day anyway? And yet again, someone ignoring the real issues I'm asking you about.
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Old 05-18-2020, 04:23 PM
 
Location: Elsewhere
88,139 posts, read 83,978,350 times
Reputation: 114435
Quote:
Originally Posted by ebbe View Post
Murphy allows a foursome in golf. Is that different than 4 people in a hair salon? What if a restaurant has tables for 4 and keeps each table 6 feet apart...is that any different than the golf foursome?

If Murphy waits till a vaccine is widely available, let’s say 18-24 months away, do you think the nj economy will survive being largely shut down that long? I don’t.
Re the bolded...well, YEAH. And I'm an over-60 person who would probably take the risk to get rid of these grey roots if I had/when I have somewhere to go where I want to look presentable.

But a foursome in golf is OUTSIDE, where viruses blow away in the air or are at least diluted in number, plus since when do golfers need to touch one another or get so close that one is breathing on the other?
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Old 05-18-2020, 04:23 PM
 
Location: In an indoor space
7,685 posts, read 6,161,261 times
Reputation: 5154
Quote:
Originally Posted by jessemh431 View Post
Ok and you can make the decision to kill yourself. But you have no right to make the decision for someone else to die. Do you also go speeding at 100 mph just because you can and you're going to die one day anyway? And yet again, someone ignoring the real issues I'm asking you about.

Then those people stay home if they're afraid they might contract CV and die.
So in your world, "the few outweigh the needs of the many".

I meet almost on a daily basis people who are sick and tired of this BS!
I've met people in dire straits because they aren't allowed to work.
One mile of people in cars consisting of two lanes just to get food at an outside food bank.

These people want the normalcy that was prior to this BS, they don't want handouts either.
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Old 05-18-2020, 04:25 PM
 
Location: Elsewhere
88,139 posts, read 83,978,350 times
Reputation: 114435
Quote:
Originally Posted by vision33r View Post
It is Jersey Shore on 5/16 and it is not some photochop angle shot.

Yes, one of the guys on the other thread downloaded it and read off the EXIF information. It's Belmar the day they were selling the season badges.
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Old 05-18-2020, 04:55 PM
 
8,256 posts, read 17,267,194 times
Reputation: 6220
Quote:
Originally Posted by atgss View Post
Then those people stay home if they're afraid they might contract CV and die.
So in your world, "the few outweigh the needs of the many".

I meet almost on a daily basis people who are sick and tired of this BS!
I've met people in dire straits because they aren't allowed to work.
One mile of people in cars consisting of two lanes just to get food at an outside food bank.

These people want the normalcy that was prior to this BS, they don't want handouts either.
Ok so answer the scenarios I presented. You can't just have everyone at risk stay home what don't you guys understand about that? You're still going to infect other people and the virus spreads further and more at-risk people are exposed doing essential shopping or by their family members who have to go back to work and the hospital will get overloaded again. Even if you don't die, healthy people are still ending up on ventilators and living with permanent damage from the virus. So your right to die doesn't equate to the right to infect other people and kill them. Why is that such a hard concept? Why is wearing a mask the worst oppression you've ever experienced in your life? And please, answer the issues I've brought up as well. Nody has yet to do that.

That's great you meet people who sick and tired of it. But the vast majority of people polled disagree with you and idk a single person who wants everything to reopen immediately, including a woman who is a hair stylist and needs the income, but is at risk and is afraid to return to work. You know what could help people not lining up at food banks? A government that actually cares about its own citizens like other countries that have continued matching at least a certain percentage of payroll.

There are literally so many options out there that can be discussed and debated, but all you guys on the rampage of "OPEN EVERYTHING RIGHT THIS MINUTE I MISS FREE REFILLS AND HAIRCUTS" are just completely unwilling to even consider other options and how your views can be dangerous and how we can help everything. It's your way or the highway (to hell). I don't agree with reopening everything, but I can get down with some reopening if done properly and I think that's a middle ground. But your camp refuses to even consider the other side and thinks your opinions are the only ones that matter EVEN THOUGH YOU'RE IN THE MINORITY!

Even in red Arizona: "More than half (52%) of likely Arizona voters, when asked about the stay-at-home order, say they are more worried about easing restrictions too soon which would potentially increase infections and cause more lives to be lost."
Poll: Arizonans think 'reopening' is too soon; Most Republicans not concerned

"Meanwhile, more than half (or 55 percent) say businesses are reopening too soon"
https://www.bankrate.com/surveys/cor...erica-economy/

"Nearly three out of four Americans – 71% – say they are more concerned by the government lifting social distancing restrictions too quickly, according to a survey from the Democracy Fund + UCLA Nationscape Project."
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/...ly/5180069002/

"51 percent of the 2,000 registered voters polled between May 8 and 10 said that businesses and public spaces across the nation are opening too quickly, while only 15 percent think that the nation isn’t reopening fast enough. "
https://www.statista.com/chart/21741...ng-of-economy/

"Seventy-one percent of those surveyed across the three states said that officials should focus on keeping people home and maintaining social distancing measures to combat the pandemic. Only about a quarter — 26 percent — said that their states should put people back to work to help the economy recover, even if it means hastening the spread of the virus."
https://thehill.com/policy/healthcar...open-economies

"In their latest poll (conducted May 3-5), The Economist/YouGov found that only 11 percent of adults believed it was safe to end social distancing and reopen businesses right now. Six percent said it would be safe in about two weeks, and another 19 percent said it would be in a month or so. A plurality (29 percent) thought it would take several months, and 15 percent even said a year or longer. A Morning Consult survey taken April 29-30 found that just 20 percent of registered voters thought the economy should reopen in April (i.e., immediately) or May, 37 percent said June or July, 16 percent said August or September, and 12 percent said October or later. And a May 5 poll from Global Strategy Group and GBAO for left-leaning firm Navigator Research found that 60 percent of Americans opposed reopening the country in the next few weeks, versus 36 percent who supported it. Finally, a May 2-5 poll by Civiqs for Daily Kos asked respondents flat out whether they supported having a stay-at-home order in place in their state: Sixty-five percent said yes, and 29 percent said no.

Simply put, Americans think the stay-at-home orders are doing a lot more good than bad. That same Economist/YouGov survey found that 59 percent of adults believed the orders were extremely or very effective at stopping the spread of COVID-19; an additional 31 percent said they were somewhat effective, while only 10 percent doubted their effectiveness. In addition, a whopping 75 percent thought it was either very or somewhat likely that states reopening would result in an increase in COVID-19 cases. And in an Axios/Ipsos poll conducted May 1-4, 67 percent of Americans said that they thought returning to their pre-coronavirus life right now would be a large or moderate risk to their health and well-being; only 30 percent of Americans said they were willing to accept such a risk to return to their normal lives.

According to a Monmouth University poll conducted April 30-May 4, 63 percent of adults were more concerned about lifting restrictions too quickly than not lifting them quickly enough; 29 percent said the opposite. And the Navigator Research poll reported that 59 percent of Americans were more concerned about social distancing ending too soon, while 32 percent were more concerned that it would go on too long."
https://fivethirtyeight.com/features...-pre-pandemic/

So you might think you're the majority, but you're not. Stop acting like it. You wanna take a dump all over everything I've said, but refuse to accept that my viewpoints are the viewpoints of the majority of Americans. I've given actual real solid information of how I believe we can more safely reopen, and the answer is always just "I WANT TO INFECT OTHER PEOPLE I DON'T CARE IF I DIE GIVE ME UNLIMITED SOUP SALAD BREADSTICKS AT OLIVE GARDEN RIGHT NOW OR I RIOT." None of you have any said anything that resembles willing to work together and sharing ideas. None of you have said anything worth value whatsoever to having a conversation, jut telling me I'm wrong and refusing to realize there are serious issues with reopening too quickly. And you're so blind to reality that you think your positions are shared by the majority of people.
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Old 05-18-2020, 04:58 PM
 
Location: Bergen County, NJ
3,994 posts, read 3,551,659 times
Reputation: 5767
Jesse... why are you arguing so passionately on here? NJ is opening very cautiously, which seems to be what you want. Why are you trying so hard to get people to agree with you, when what you want is already taking place?
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