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Old 01-15-2007, 10:48 AM
 
146 posts, read 907,963 times
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I keep hearing people refer to the term white flight when they talk about NJ? Does that refer to the influx of immigrants moving in and us whities moving out?

 
Old 01-15-2007, 11:04 AM
 
Location: Hopewell New Jersey
1,398 posts, read 7,689,585 times
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I've always heard the term used to describe white suburbs fleeing to "escape" blacks moving in from the inner city.

The term has likely evolved to apply to the situation you desribe.
 
Old 01-15-2007, 11:18 AM
 
Location: Bronx, NY
2,806 posts, read 16,330,485 times
Reputation: 1115
This is more of a thing of the past. I guess it is still going on in some areas. First an explanation is needed of what white flight actually is.

Many more urban areas of North Jersey like Newark, Irvington, Patterson, Passaic, Plainfield used to have large white populations, if not white majorities. At the end of the WWII with the return of the troops from the war many white families left the more urban areas moving out to towns that are today the suburbs. This of course had an important impact upon American society on the whole as now about 50% of America lives in a suburb (25% in more urban areas, and 25% in more rural areas), whereas that number only used to be about 25% in 1950.

The suburbanization of America obviously had a huge impact on Urban areas. While this was going on large numbers of African-Americans from the South had been moving north looking for good paying industrial jobs that were created during and after the war. African-Americans for the most part filled the vacuum so to speak of the leaving white families as they moved into neighborhoods and took jobs that whites were leaving.

As a result of African-Americans moving in, many white people, who otherwise were content to stay in urban areas, also decided to follow their neighbors and move to more suburban areas. A lot of this happened as a result of tricks played by realtors who were trying to get people to sell their houses at a low price, so they convinced the white people that the neighborhood was going to hell since black folks were moving in.

This trend continued throught the late 40s & 50s. During the mid 1960s there were race riots in NJ, most notablly the Newark riots, but I believe there was rioting in Plainfield as well in the 60s. Racial violence like this greatly excellerated the pace of white flight from urban areas of NJ. So, for example an area like North Newark which 40 years ago was probably 80-90% Italian is probably now only 5% Italian, if that (most of the holdout are people who now are quite old, in their 70s/80s).

The negative effect of all of this was that many of these cities lost their middle class, which was largely composed of white small business owners. In the case of Newark there were lots of Jewish small business owners who lived near Central Newark and by Irvington. Many of these small businesses were torched during the Newark riots, and as a result the owners decided not to rebuild in Newark.

Things continued to spiral out of control for the 70s/80s/ and even into the early 90s. Newark has come back to a certain degree in the downtown section, but it is still a shell of what it used to be. In 1950 there were 440,000 people living in Newark. Today there are only 280,000. If you want to understand how bad Newark used to be drive through the business district sometime. A lot of the buildings are connected by walkways above the streets. These were built, not to showcase some type of engineering ingenuity, but rather because Newark was so dangerous in the 70s/80s that many people refused to work there if they had to walk around on the streets.

Now you could make the case that white flight is still occurring today. Many towns in NJ have seen an influx of immigrants (mostly from Asia and Latin America), as a result many white people have left. Good examples of this are Edison and Fort Lee with Asian immigrants and towns like Dover with Latin American immigrants.
 
Old 01-15-2007, 11:24 AM
 
84 posts, read 378,024 times
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This maybe a dumb question, but how is it that immigrants can afford to live here in NJ. I'm white, and i'm fleeing but not because of the diversity around me, i just simple can't afford to own a home and start my family in this state.

Truth be told i'm really gonna miss the diversity of the ppl around me.
 
Old 01-15-2007, 11:49 AM
 
146 posts, read 907,963 times
Reputation: 129
Because they live 15 in a house like many old immigrants used to do many years ago. Plus immigrants today are hard workers that will put crazy hours in to provide for their families, not that you don't but they work long laborous hours.
 
Old 01-15-2007, 12:09 PM
 
84 posts, read 378,024 times
Reputation: 38
Is there any truth that the goverment gives better tax breaks to encourage ppl to come here? Or is that just urban myth
 
Old 01-15-2007, 12:21 PM
 
146 posts, read 907,963 times
Reputation: 129
I think that is true.
 
Old 01-15-2007, 03:25 PM
 
Location: New Jersey
11,290 posts, read 16,570,887 times
Reputation: 13239
Quote:
Originally Posted by mead View Post
This is more of a thing of the past. I guess it is still going on in some areas. First an explanation is needed of what white flight actually is.

Many more urban areas of North Jersey like Newark, Irvington, Patterson, Passaic, Plainfield used to have large white populations, if not white majorities. At the end of the WWII with the return of the troops from the war many white families left the more urban areas moving out to towns that are today the suburbs. This of course had an important impact upon American society on the whole as now about 50% of America lives in a suburb (25% in more urban areas, and 25% in more rural areas), whereas that number only used to be about 25% in 1950.

The suburbanization of America obviously had a huge impact on Urban areas. While this was going on large numbers of African-Americans from the South had been moving north looking for good paying industrial jobs that were created during and after the war. African-Americans for the most part filled the vacuum so to speak of the leaving white families as they moved into neighborhoods and took jobs that whites were leaving.

As a result of African-Americans moving in, many white people, who otherwise were content to stay in urban areas, also decided to follow their neighbors and move to more suburban areas. A lot of this happened as a result of tricks played by realtors who were trying to get people to sell their houses at a low price, so they convinced the white people that the neighborhood was going to hell since black folks were moving in.

This trend continued throught the late 40s & 50s. During the mid 1960s there were race riots in NJ, most notablly the Newark riots, but I believe there was rioting in Plainfield as well in the 60s. Racial violence like this greatly excellerated the pace of white flight from urban areas of NJ. So, for example an area like North Newark which 40 years ago was probably 80-90% Italian is probably now only 5% Italian, if that (most of the holdout are people who now are quite old, in their 70s/80s).

The negative effect of all of this was that many of these cities lost their middle class, which was largely composed of white small business owners. In the case of Newark there were lots of Jewish small business owners who lived near Central Newark and by Irvington. Many of these small businesses were torched during the Newark riots, and as a result the owners decided not to rebuild in Newark.

Things continued to spiral out of control for the 70s/80s/ and even into the early 90s. Newark has come back to a certain degree in the downtown section, but it is still a shell of what it used to be. In 1950 there were 440,000 people living in Newark. Today there are only 280,000. If you want to understand how bad Newark used to be drive through the business district sometime. A lot of the buildings are connected by walkways above the streets. These were built, not to showcase some type of engineering ingenuity, but rather because Newark was so dangerous in the 70s/80s that many people refused to work there if they had to walk around on the streets.

Now you could make the case that white flight is still occurring today. Many towns in NJ have seen an influx of immigrants (mostly from Asia and Latin America), as a result many white people have left. Good examples of this are Edison and Fort Lee with Asian immigrants and towns like Dover with Latin American immigrants.
Great example, but please, if you're going to be PC, please do it all the way or not at all.

If I'm white, then they are black.

If they're African-Americans then I'm European-American.

Fair is fair.

There was a story about 2 years ago, with a teacher who wanted her class to pick out an African-American in their school and write about him/her.They did, but the teacher disallowed it as the African-American was white. In other words, she really wanted someone who was black from Africa. The words African-American paints with a broad brush and isn't even accurate within itself.
 
Old 01-15-2007, 08:49 PM
 
Location: Bronx, NY
2,806 posts, read 16,330,485 times
Reputation: 1115
Well I guess i can't please everyone on this forum. Yesterday someone was bashing me as a racist and today I'm being called too PC. Oh well, such is life.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MPBsr View Post
Great example, but please, if you're going to be PC, please do it all the way or not at all.

If I'm white, then they are black.

If they're African-Americans then I'm European-American.

Fair is fair.

There was a story about 2 years ago, with a teacher who wanted her class to pick out an African-American in their school and write about him/her.They did, but the teacher disallowed it as the African-American was white. In other words, she really wanted someone who was black from Africa. The words African-American paints with a broad brush and isn't even accurate within itself.
 
Old 01-15-2007, 08:52 PM
 
Location: Bronx, NY
2,806 posts, read 16,330,485 times
Reputation: 1115
Yeah the house stacking is true. Oftentimes several immigrant families will live in a single house or apartment.

This is a problem though because it keeps real estate prices artificially high.
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