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Old 08-15-2008, 02:06 PM
 
5,340 posts, read 13,947,660 times
Reputation: 1189

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Quote:
Originally Posted by wileynj View Post
why not! You need a frickin' license to fish in this country but any a-hole can have kids!
exactly

 
Old 08-15-2008, 02:10 PM
 
Location: New Jersey
11,338 posts, read 16,691,416 times
Reputation: 13341
Quote:
Originally Posted by EEEPNJ View Post
Oh, that won't do it - what WILL is assuming that somehow you have superiority in any way, shape or form IF you are white...which you don't. Nor do I. Nor does anyone else.....

As stated earlier, SCIENCE has stated that you can not determine race scientifically - I'm going to put my trust there a little more than in the US Courts....

And I hate to tell you this - we will be the US of China one day if things don't improve - and last time I checked - according to the US courts - they are not "white."
I believe that while people who need help should be helped but not made to rely on the gov't of any country. Unfort, in the US now, there are to many people who feel that the gov't needs to control peoples lives and doesn't care about enforcing laws that are on the books.

And yes, I agree that this once great country is going down a very dark path.
 
Old 08-15-2008, 02:10 PM
 
Location: 32°19'03.7"N 106°43'55.9"W
9,374 posts, read 20,787,825 times
Reputation: 9982
Quote:
Originally Posted by EEEPNJ View Post
Sorry Mike - you completely lost me. Because see, the "free market" does not work when unchecked. Not at all.

Government involvement has destroyed many things, agreed. But PRIVATE corporations have done the same.

And I think anyone who really thinks that GOVERNMENTS rule the world anymore is fooling themselves. CORPORATIONS rule the world, we just live in it.

Private corporations have become all about greed and screwing the consumer and worker just to make sure the CEO gets an additional house or two... sorry, I've seen way too much to think just letting things"be" will make it all work out.
EEEPNJ,

Both houses of congress could go into committee, and vote to raise your taxes across the board by whatever amount they see fit to do so. And you will have no choice but to pay them. To me, this constitutes a greater threat to our liberty than any corporate practice.

In contrast, the CEO of a corporation, in MOST cases, is the beneficiary of the success of a company, and a product his/her company provided. I have no problem with the prosperity of a company, again, in MOST cases. The CEO of my company busted his ass off to assemble a product and good employees. Clients are happy. He had the balls to go out and invest in himself, and to me, is entitled to his ingenuity in the form of the capital it has conferred onto him. Much more than any entity in Washington D.C. is entitled to a big chunk of income from his company.

I guess I am in the minority, but to me, this concept is so crystal clear that it hardly warrants a counter argument. Frederich Engels and Karl Marx would definitely see this in another light. But, needless to say, this system of government has failed everywhere it has been tried.
 
Old 08-15-2008, 02:10 PM
 
Location: NJ
12,283 posts, read 35,677,666 times
Reputation: 5331
Quote:
Originally Posted by MPBsr View Post
Lets add fuel to the fire.

Show me one minority country that is as prosperous and generous as the USA?
what do you mean "minority"? minority as defined by who(m)? does japan qualify? but japanese are not minorities in japan.
 
Old 08-15-2008, 02:11 PM
 
32 posts, read 86,727 times
Reputation: 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by mike0421 View Post
Well, in order to evaluate the current state of calamity vis a vis prescription drug costs, it is appropriate that we avail ourselves of historical facts. To me, the greatest problem with the left wing is their skepticism in the free market, and a marked preference for government to fix or solve problems over private sector and the market. I reject this central tenant, because the government has screwed up almost everything when it comes to interfering with business practices. And, the government, when you examine the current state of affairs with prescription drug costs, is at fault. Have you ever heard of the HMO Act of 1973? Tax rules that do not allow individuals to allocate pre-tax dollars to pay for health care, make individual citizens interact with HMO and Medicare bureaucrats. And why? Unwarranted legislation. This is an unnecessary third party that stands between the doctor and the patient. Shouldn't individual citizens be able to differentiate what prescriptions are appropriate while simultaneously ruducing thieir taxable income for all drug expenditures? When you force employers to offer HMOs and prohibit people from paying for prescriptions with pre-tax dollars, the result is government enabling drug companies to set high prices for middlemen who have no regard for the freemarket.

What about the FDA? Another governmental tenticle that is directly responsible for high drug costs. Pharmaceutical companies spend hundreds of millions of dollars to bring a single drug to market because of FDA rules. Often FDA approval is never obtained, no matter how much a company spends developing a drug. So pharmaceutical makers naturally try to recoup their huge investments by charging high prices and lobbying to keep exclusive drug patent periods as lengthy as possible. This is an instance of a governmental agency, in this case the FDA, that is doing more harm than good. The drug prices are being artificially raised and stifles the incentive for needed drug research. If the FDA would butt out, there would be more of an incentive to shorten patent expirations and as a result, drug development costs would be reduced. As a result, price competition between drug companies would be encouraged.

Guys, I am no rocket scientist, but this is not tough stuff to understand. We just need to be more aware of historical facts, acts, and their consequences as they pertain to present day, rather than listening to 30 second soundbytes by half-baked presidential candidates, and their followers, who seem to think that when 'their guy' is elected, their standard of life will improve immediately, on January 21st, 2009, without having to do so much as lift a finger. In reality, folks, it doesn't work that way. You have to earn it for yourself. The Constitution only allows for the pursuit of happiness, not the guarantee of it. And there never will be a guarantee, however, the only way we will be prosperous as a society, ultimately, is when these politiicians of both parties get out of our way, stop the taxation, the regulation, and allow ingenuity to enrich our lifestyles. Washington D.C. will never be able to provide that. And as soon as 50% of this country comes to that realization, only then will we have a chance. Liberty > security.
Ummm...Adam Smith would surely frown on corporate welfare that the right love so much...need we point any further than Freddie Mac/Fannie May?

Both parties are to blame equally for todays problems...but this is either here nor there...this just a fodder to keep distracted of the real problem...politicians opening the doors to the treasury for their corporate friends.
 
Old 08-15-2008, 02:12 PM
 
Location: New Jersey
11,338 posts, read 16,691,416 times
Reputation: 13341
Quote:
Originally Posted by tahiti View Post
what do you mean "minority"? minority as defined by who(m)? does japan qualify? but japanese are not minorities in japan.
Another person who reads what they want to read.

"As defined by the Courts of the USA...non-whites."
 
Old 08-15-2008, 02:17 PM
 
93,167 posts, read 123,783,345 times
Reputation: 18253
Default Not true......

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunil's Dad View Post
Not to belabor this.......but most "black" people are mixed. Many are genetically much less African than Barack Obama. So in actuality we already have two ethnic groups ("Black" and "Hispanic") whose members are very mixed to begin with.
Actually, 80% of the genes of African Americans are Black African. So, that is not true actually.

Also, 33% of Whites in the US have some recnt Black ancestry. While the percentage of those that have it is supposedly around 2.3%, that doesn't take into account mixture that might have occurred before arrival here.
 
Old 08-15-2008, 02:19 PM
 
5,340 posts, read 13,947,660 times
Reputation: 1189
Quote:
Originally Posted by mike0421 View Post
EEEPNJ,

Both houses of congress could go into committee, and vote to raise your taxes across the board by whatever amount they see fit to do so. And you will have no choice but to pay them. To me, this constitutes a greater threat to our liberty than any corporate practice.

In contrast, the CEO of a corporation, in MOST cases, is the beneficiary of the success of a company, and a product his/her company provided. I have no problem with the prosperity of a company, again, in MOST cases. The CEO of my company busted his ass off to assemble a product and good employees. Clients are happy. He had the balls to go out and invest in himself, and to me, is entitled to his ingenuity in the form of the capital it has conferred onto him. Much more than any entity in Washington D.C. is entitled to a big chunk of income from his company.

I guess I am in the minority, but to me, this concept is so crystal clear that it hardly warrants a counter argument. Frederich Engels and Karl Marx would definitely see this in another light. But, needless to say, this system of government has failed everywhere it has been tried.

Again, I completely disagree.

First of all, there is a much better chance of my company (or yours or any other) offshoring my job than there is of both houses raising taxes to 50%. When they do this often enough UNCHECKED - as they have in many industries - there are no other jobs to be had. THIS my friend is more likely to happen to me than my taxes going up to 50% any day of the week and THAT will have a much greater impact on me and my family and my way of life. AND I WOULD HAVE NO CHOICE ABOUT WHAT TO DO ABOUT IT. Because honestly, this is America, it's set up to benefit the corporation and the weatlhy - it is NOT set up to benefit the little guy and anyone who thinks it does is in denial.

Additionally, you have practically NO liberties at work - the good ol' courts have made sure of that.

And I strongly disagree w/ your assesment of CEO's. When our contry was a true world power and faired far better economically than it does today - CEOs made substantial livings, lived well, and fared quite nicely comared to the "working man." However, that has been replaced by many CEO's earning hundreds times more than their employees all while sending the jobs of the employees overseas. There is NO reason for any human being to earn the amounts some CEO's command NOR should they have "golden parachutes." Damn, I want to be able to screw a company up so badly that I get a "no confidence" vote and then I can be PAID millions to leave.... must be nice.....

Again, you are entitled to your opinion and I am entitled to mine. Clearly, neither of us will convince the other to cross over....
 
Old 08-15-2008, 02:20 PM
 
5,340 posts, read 13,947,660 times
Reputation: 1189
Quote:
Originally Posted by MPBsr View Post
I believe that while people who need help should be helped but not made to rely on the gov't of any country. Unfort, in the US now, there are to many people who feel that the gov't needs to control peoples lives and doesn't care about enforcing laws that are on the books.

And yes, I agree that this once great country is going down a very dark path.
so do only white people who need help get help?
 
Old 08-15-2008, 02:21 PM
 
Location: New Jersey
11,338 posts, read 16,691,416 times
Reputation: 13341
Quote:
Originally Posted by EEEPNJ View Post
so do only white people who need help get help?
Who said "white" people?

Your words, not mine.
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