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This thread kind of reminds me of the two minutes of hate in 1984.
Everyone gets to vent their hatred and rage for illegal immigrants.
This doesn't alter the fact that this is a really bad bill.
I also think the fact that legislators think this issue deserves their time indicates that they are not listening to their constituents. The voters sent a clear message that they were concerned about the states finances and property taxes -- and this is the response. Maybe the voters didn't express themselves clearly enough at the last election ?
I think the results of this poll are in consonance with the views of New Jerseyans at large. If New Jersey's politicians knew for real that we all felt this way, they would carry out our will. That they do not reflects the fact that we all are too lazy to do anything but complain when it comes to terrible wasteful programs and the utter immorality of wholesale redistribution of wealth.
That can end so easily in the Internet age. The mechanism for making our voice heard is so much simpler than in past days when dissatisfied citizens had to write letters or make phone calls.
In the time it takes to set up an account on Facebook, anyone can find out who their representatives are and make their opinions known.
By all means, let's continue venting here on City-Data. But if you don't add a companion Internet protest to your representatives, you are wasting time.
Believe me, the "victims" who are constantly robbing us by using the police and taxation powers of the state of New Jersey make their opinions known and get heard. And they get things changed.
We can fight back, and it's not all that hard to effect change if we set up a few links in IE and make our voices heard.
You get this set up one time on your computer then it's easy to hit the politicians each time an utterly stupid program comes along where a pressure group manages to steal our hard earned tax dollars.
This time it's the illegals. Next time it might be a teacher's union. Or a collection of health insurance companies. Or environmental whackos. Everybody thinks they deserve our money more than we do, and it's time we start putting an end to it.
Quoting someone: If you are not part of the solution than you are part of the problem.
I think the results of this poll are in consonance with the views of New Jerseyans at large. If New Jersey's politicians knew for real that we all felt this way, they would carry out our will. That they do not reflects the fact that we all are too lazy to do anything but complain when it comes to terrible wasteful programs and the utter immorality of wholesale redistribution of wealth.
That can end so easily in the Internet age. The mechanism for making our voice heard is so much simpler than in past days when dissatisfied citizens had to write letters or make phone calls.
In the time it takes to set up an account on Facebook, anyone can find out who their representatives are and make their opinions known.
By all means, let's continue venting here on City-Data. But if you don't add a companion Internet protest to your representatives, you are wasting time.
Believe me, the "victims" who are constantly robbing us by using the police and taxation powers of the state of New Jersey make their opinions known and get heard. And they get things changed.
We can fight back, and it's not all that hard to effect change if we set up a few links in IE and make our voices heard.
You get this set up one time on your computer then it's easy to hit the politicians each time an utterly stupid program comes along where a pressure group manages to steal our hard earned tax dollars.
This time it's the illegals. Next time it might be a teacher's union. Or a collection of health insurance companies. Or environmental whackos. Everybody thinks they deserve our money more than we do, and it's time we start putting an end to it.
Quoting someone: If you are not part of the solution than you are part of the problem.
I wish I shared your optimism. Unfortunately, there are many NJ voters who just vote for whichever guy has a "D" after their name. These guys know that so they vote AGAINST our interests without any fear of reprisal. They have proven time and time again to just vote with the national democratic agenda even in matters that are harmful to NJ and it's citizens.
As to the illegal alien problem, we are all born into our own situations, and we dont have the tax payers to bail us out. Some people are born rich, others born poor, others born to evil parents and others born to good parents. We all have to make the best of whatever situation life's lottery places us, but we cant expect everybody else to pay for our own parent's sins. It's an unfortunate fact of life that we are not all born equal. Most of us have to just deal with it, so what makes the illegal alien's so special that they are immune? As a NJ tax payer, we are already being overtaxed for things we neither need or want, why add more taxes to the list?
I wish I shared your optimism. Unfortunately, there are many NJ voters who just vote for whichever guy has a "D" after their name. These guys know that so they vote AGAINST our interests without any fear of reprisal. They have proven time and time again to just vote with the national democratic agenda even in matters that are harmful to NJ and it's citizens.
As to the illegal alien problem, we are all born into our own situations, and we dont have the tax payers to bail us out. Some people are born rich, others born poor, others born to evil parents and others born to good parents. We all have to make the best of whatever situation life's lottery places us, but we cant expect everybody else to pay for our own parent's sins. It's an unfortunate fact of life that we are not all born equal. Most of us have to just deal with it, so what makes the illegal alien's so special that they are immune? As a NJ tax payer, we are already being overtaxed for things we neither need or want, why add more taxes to the list?
Well said and all true. However, at this point I only pay attention to policies, not party affiliations. There is not a dime's worth of difference between the two parties. Whoever is in power, whether they are Democratic or Republican, wants to stay there and will bend to pressure if we apply it in sufficient numbers and with sufficient clarity and focus. The Democrats have always and will always control this state, and I will hammer them every time they come up with another scheme to Robin Hood us to death. There are Conservative Democrats on the national scene. We need to move our Democrats to the economic Right. It can only happen by relentless pressure on policies, rather than personalities or parties.
Well said and all true. However, at this point I only pay attention to policies, not party affiliations. There is not a dime's worth of difference between the two parties. Whoever is in power, whether they are Democratic or Republican, wants to stay there and will bend to pressure if we apply it in sufficient numbers and with sufficient clarity and focus. The Democrats have always and will always control this state, and I will hammer them every time they come up with another scheme to Robin Hood us to death. There are Conservative Democrats on the national scene. We need to move our Democrats to the economic Right. It can only happen by relentless pressure on policies, rather than personalities or parties.
I know I’m in the minority here and I DO NOT want to start a crazy political debate but on the human side of things I feel kind of bad for these kids. A lot of them came here as small children and 1)had no say in whether or not they wanted to come here 2) had no idea coming here was illegal. Much like many of us when we were small these children were just doing what their parents wanted and had no idea what the actual situation was (anyone else not realize until they were older that they "grew up poor"?).
These kids live here their entire lives here not even knowing their status is illegal, they go to school and study hard, they have hopes and dreams JUST LIKE YOUR CHILDREN. These kids are asking for an opportunity to go to school and better themselves, not some discount on public housing or luxury cars. They are seeking the opportunity to become productive members of our society. Why not give them this opportunity to pay less? Structure the bill so they have to pay back the difference if they do not graduate within a set period of time.
I agree illegal immigration is wrong but I think the FIRST thing this country needs is better control on its borders so the problem does not continue to grow. It's like trying to get out of debt while continuing to use your credit cards.
Once that situation is under control they need to evaluate the people who are already here on a case by case basis. Anyone illegal who is using up tax dollars by sitting in our jails needs to be shipped out ASAP. Forget sending them home after they serve their term just send them home straight out of the court room. Give the others a legal way to work and pay taxes. No reportable income, not in school, trouble with the law? Out you go. Pay your taxes, work hard, go to school and stay out of trouble? Here's a green card so you can actually put your education to work.
And as a Latina I hate that what most people think of when they think of an illegal immigrant is a drunk day laborer Hispanic gang member living 25 to a house. Wake up people, illegal’s come in ALL colors, Hispanic, Black, Asian and GASP even White. Growing up in Queens I knew a ton of illegal Irish families but yet they are not looked down upon as much because they are lily white.
Some illegal’s are less than respectable and should not be here but A LOT of them are decent hardworking people looking for a better life and I am sure they would be glad to pay taxes if some one would allow them to work at a decent job where you get a paycheck instead of $4.25 an hour under the table.
Just saying, they are people too.
Thank you for saying that, I feel like you...it's for kids
It is the concept of entitlement that has RUINED poor to working class communities in this state and this country. That is why we are upset as taxpayers. Our ancestors came here, legally, worked arduous blue collar jobs, and by the 2nd and 3rd generation ... guess what? Due to the work ethic that they were raised on, the 2nd and 3rd generation kids were able to go to college.
BINGO! That's exactly the way is HAS worked and should CONTINUE to work. When I think of how rough my grandparents had it, so that their children could have a better life so that OUR generation could go to college (and all my cousins as well as my sibling and myself did), it humbles me. Add the important factor of the grands' desire to assimilate quickly, learn the language and become a US citizen also proves the strength and fortitude behind their dedication. Are we still seeing that presently? I don't know...
Click on a name (in the link above) and there's a link to send an email. I tried using the link, but my page is coming up blank. Search for the bill by the number(s).
Identical Bill Number: S1036 (1R)
Last Session Bill Number: A4032 S436
Johnson, Gordon M. as Primary Sponsor
Vainieri Huttle, Valerie as Primary Sponsor
Jasey, Mila M. as Primary Sponsor
Cruz-Perez, Nilsa as Primary Sponsor
Gusciora, Reed as Co-Sponsor
Green, Jerry as Co-Sponsor
Conners, Jack as Co-Sponsor
Quigley, Joan M. as Co-Sponsor
McKeon, John F. as Co-Sponsor
Stender, Linda as Co-Sponsor
Oliver, Sheila Y. as Co-Sponsor
Fisher, Douglas H. as Co-Sponsor
Cryan, Joseph as Co-Sponsor
Burzichelli, John J. as Co-Sponsor
Pou, Nellie as Co-Sponsor
Conaway, Herb, Jr. as Co-Sponsor
Vas, Joseph as Co-Sponsor
Schaer, Gary S. as Co-Sponsor
Giblin, Thomas P. as Co-Sponsor
Barnes, Peter J., III as Co-Sponsor
Chiappone, Anthony as Co-Sponsor
Coutinho, Albert as Co-Sponsor
Last edited by timneh5; 01-07-2010 at 08:48 AM..
Reason: additional information
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Link to the bill and it's sponsors and co-sponsors
