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Old 05-21-2010, 05:51 AM
 
160 posts, read 375,372 times
Reputation: 159

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Quote:
Originally Posted by bababua View Post
Let me guess the teachers and kids share the blame for this one? Do you understand that we have a group of parents in this country who could honestly care less about being responsible. Tell them until you are blue in the face and they just dont care. Who suffers...the children first and foremost and in a way teachers suffer because they are labeled as "failing" because children from these parents are at a huge educational disadvantage. Of course blaming teachers for these kids failures is the easy thing to do. Blaming parents would not be PC so most politicians dont even approach the subject.
Nope, the parents ARE to blame and they need to be held accountable...

BUT the teachers need to cut with the "I'm poor" routine. It's total BS. Drive by any school in your district and take a look at the cars in the parking lot. BMW, Lexus, SUV's, and not a single rusted out Gremlin or Pacer among them. I'm not buying it.
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Old 05-21-2010, 07:58 AM
 
607 posts, read 957,568 times
Reputation: 520
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boardwalk 08755 View Post
Nope, the parents ARE to blame and they need to be held accountable...

BUT the teachers need to cut with the "I'm poor" routine. It's total BS. Drive by any school in your district and take a look at the cars in the parking lot. BMW, Lexus, SUV's, and not a single rusted out Gremlin or Pacer among them. I'm not buying it.
So, which cars, exactly, would you consider acceptable to have the teachers drive to work? You go from BMW to rusted-out Pacer in your post, which only backs up my earlier post here - all (BMW) or nothing (Pacer).

There are any number of outside factors involved with these individual teachers that you - or frankly, anyone here, regardless of on which side you stand - don't know about. Are they a multiple family income? Maybe their spouse is making good coin in the private sector, and they can afford a nice car. Maybe their spouse has a company-paid car, so they can spend more on a upper model. Maybe they are just good with their personal finances, and saved enough to buy the car they wanted. Maybe they lease the car. Maybe they bought it used (or "pre-owned"). Maybe they scrimp on other tings so they can get the nice car. Maybe they have been working for 20 years, and with the salary they receive bought the car they wanted (regardless of the vitriol, they are still getting a money, and have been earning a salary for some time now - it's not as though these salaries just went into effect last week - so they hopefully have built up a savings).

Should they only drive a Carollas or Jeep Liberty or Prius or a rusted out Yugo? Would that make anybody feel better? Maybe the local BOE can get that worked into their next contract, along with the clothes they can wear, the jewelry they can have, and the size of their home TV (please adjust your sarcasm filter accordingly).

And BTW - I voted for Christie, and support that he needs to take some extreme measures to get the state back on solid fiscal ground. But, I also respect and support the teachers, being very involved with my town's schools, and know what kind of a job it is and how grateful I am for what they have done for my own kids and the many kids I know in my town, and how much they truly care about their work and the well-being of their students.

I've been accused of being anti-teacher here and elsewhere for my pro-Christie posts (regardless of the topic, if it is positive in any way about the Governor you are seen to be kissing his, um, ring...), but life is rarely as black and white as it is seen by others.

Last edited by NJ07035; 05-21-2010 at 08:09 AM..
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Old 05-21-2010, 11:29 AM
 
160 posts, read 375,372 times
Reputation: 159
Quote:
Originally Posted by NJ07035 View Post
So, which cars, exactly, would you consider acceptable to have the teachers drive to work? You go from BMW to rusted-out Pacer in your post, which only backs up my earlier post here - all (BMW) or nothing (Pacer).

........

Should they only drive a Carollas or Jeep Liberty or Prius or a rusted out Yugo? Would that make anybody feel better? Maybe the local BOE can get that worked into their next contract, along with the clothes they can wear, the jewelry they can have, and the size of their home TV (please adjust your sarcasm filter accordingly).
I don't give a rat's ass about teachers, their spouses, you, or your opinions. They are over paid civil servants who work for the taxpayers. If the taxpayers say "enough", than so be it. NOBODY is entitled to $0 co-pays and grotesque pensions on the public's dime.

As far as kissing asses, you can kiss mine.
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Old 05-21-2010, 11:48 AM
 
50,686 posts, read 36,389,238 times
Reputation: 76501
The vast majority of teachers do not drive Lexus' or BMW's. You must've driven past the administrator's spots.
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Old 05-21-2010, 12:58 PM
 
607 posts, read 957,568 times
Reputation: 520
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boardwalk 08755 View Post
I don't give a rat's ass about teachers, their spouses, you, or your opinions. They are over paid civil servants who work for the taxpayers. If the taxpayers say "enough", than so be it. NOBODY is entitled to $0 co-pays and grotesque pensions on the public's dime.

As far as kissing asses, you can kiss mine.
Hey, don't be shy - by all means, if you have something you want to say, don't hold back...



Funny that you say you don't care about the opinions of others (I cleaned it up for you) on a site that is, essentially, opinion-driven at its core. Just curious, but do you feel we should all bow to your obviously well-articulated positions? See, everybody here - you included - have their own personally-held view on the topics discussed here; that is called having an opinion. Some base their posts here on said opinions; others may just post links to articles or other fact-based information.

Your opinion on teacher salaries is no more or less important to me or anyone else here than is your preference for Italian restaurants, television shows or music. You may think it is, which is fine - everyone should have a sense of self-worth.

I didn't run at you with insults or name-calling (having a bad day?); all I said was that there are any number of things that you (obviously, based upon your reply) didn't consider. People don't exist in a vacuum; there are other things at play for everyone - including you, me and even teachers.

My town voted for our BOE budget, and we are still losing a number of very valuable teachers and staff. It is unfortunate, but the cuts are a long time in coming, and while I sympathized with those teachers who will be leaving - having gotten to know them for the past few years - the state funding cuts are a necessary evil.

We probably agree more than you think: I support the cuts that need to be made, and hope there are far more changes made in the coming weeks/months to a bunch of state-financed institutions. I think they should have focused elsewhere first, but it didn't happen that way.

But then, you don't care, so...........
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Old 05-21-2010, 01:54 PM
 
16,825 posts, read 17,716,576 times
Reputation: 20852
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boardwalk 08755 View Post
Nope, the parents ARE to blame and they need to be held accountable...

BUT the teachers need to cut with the "I'm poor" routine. It's total BS. Drive by any school in your district and take a look at the cars in the parking lot. BMW, Lexus, SUV's, and not a single rusted out Gremlin or Pacer among them. I'm not buying it.
Sure. I am a teacher and I have an SUV instead of a Gremlin or Pacer. Of course, its a 2004 Saturn VUE. Is that a sign that I make too much money?
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Old 05-21-2010, 01:59 PM
 
16,825 posts, read 17,716,576 times
Reputation: 20852
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boardwalk 08755 View Post
I don't give a rat's ass about teachers, their spouses, you, or your opinions. They are over paid civil servants who work for the taxpayers. If the taxpayers say "enough", than so be it. NOBODY is entitled to $0 co-pays and grotesque pensions on the public's dime.

As far as kissing asses, you can kiss mine.
I have an MS and I would have made 54k next year, so that is not "overpaid". Now neither is it underpaid when you take into consideration the benefits but that was not what you said.

Second, I have a co pay, I already pay the 1.5% and I pay towards my pension. You are spreading misinformation when it comes to that sort of thing.

But I would be absolutely fine with letting go of our pensions if you think they are out of line with the private industry just bring my salary up to what private industry would make (obviously only 10 months instead of 12) and I will take care of my own retirement. Fair right?
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Old 05-21-2010, 05:33 PM
 
Location: Montgomery County, PA
2,771 posts, read 6,272,838 times
Reputation: 606
Quote:
Originally Posted by lkb0714 View Post
I have an MS and I would have made 54k next year, so that is not "overpaid". Now neither is it underpaid when you take into consideration the benefits but that was not what you said.

Second, I have a co pay, I already pay the 1.5% and I pay towards my pension. You are spreading misinformation when it comes to that sort of thing.

But I would be absolutely fine with letting go of our pensions if you think they are out of line with the private industry just bring my salary up to what private industry would make (obviously only 10 months instead of 12) and I will take care of my own retirement. Fair right?
Bringing up your pay at the expense of your pension would be good for the tax payer, but I wouldn't nearly be as enthusiastic about signing up for that deal if I were you. The pension is a good deal. The whole NJ pension system could fail of course, but the federal government will probably have to bail pension plans out when that happens. So you have a plan that gives you an "assumed" 8% return -- basically, you get a guaranteed return on your investment. It's like having a 401K plan and being able to buy treasury bonds that earn 8% instead of 3.5%.

I'd be fine with implementing a system that would have science teachers compensated in line with the going market rate for those skills. Unfortunately for both you and I, the teachers unions would never allow that to happen -- because while that would entail a pay hike for science teachers, others would get cuts.
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Old 05-21-2010, 08:40 PM
 
631 posts, read 719,751 times
Reputation: 162
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boardwalk 08755 View Post
Nope, the parents ARE to blame and they need to be held accountable...

BUT the teachers need to cut with the "I'm poor" routine. It's total BS. Drive by any school in your district and take a look at the cars in the parking lot. BMW, Lexus, SUV's, and not a single rusted out Gremlin or Pacer among them. I'm not buying it.

LOL, you're funny. So teachers should only drive 30 year old cars? Hell... when I was 18 I had a better car then that and I made 7.25 a hour.

Following you logic, teachers should get paid 2.22 a hour even though they have a masters degree. I would hate to be your employee.
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Old 05-22-2010, 06:32 AM
 
1,931 posts, read 3,412,189 times
Reputation: 956
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boardwalk 08755 View Post
I don't give a rat's ass about teachers, their spouses, you, or your opinions. They are over paid civil servants who work for the taxpayers. If the taxpayers say "enough", than so be it. NOBODY is entitled to $0 co-pays and grotesque pensions on the public's dime.

As far as kissing asses, you can kiss mine.

Bitter,Angry People make me.... To think that someone could be soo unhappy is great. Wow my life is great !!
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